When did feminism go completely crazy?

[warpus]

Who are the good MRAs?

Feminists and MRAs are not equivalent groups. One is an opposing response to the other masquerading as activism.

I posted a video in this thread several pages back, which had a woman proclaiming "I am not a feminist."

She views herself as a Men's Rights activist, from what I remember, as well as a gender equality activist.

You think that this is just an act? Why? What is she hoping to accomplish by doing this?

And what do you call an "authentic" men's rights activists? What's the term that you use for people like that?

 

[caketastydelish]

I think just to call it "someone that supports both men's issues and women's issues".

 

[Bootstoots]

I would believe that you are a "rape apologist." Those "rape apologists" tend to be sexually frustrated men with adolescent mentalities. It's a social problem that I agree deserves more attention under the umbrella term of 'men's rights', which unfortunately doesn't include the right to a sex partner.

Edit: x-post

I think you're a rape apologist too, for the exact same reasons listed above.

Moderator Action: Please do not say that other posters may be rape apologists. More broadly, discuss the issue, not individual posters.

 

[caketastydelish]

I'm not expecting you to be some Woman's rights crusader.

I discuss women's issues. What could you expect an individual person of no importance to actually do?

 

[useless]

I discuss women's issues. What could you expect an individual person of no importance to actually do?

Advocate feminism

 

[caketastydelish]

Advocate feminism

I'm just not comfortable with the term for the same reason I'm not comfortable with the term "men's rights activist".

 

[Farm Boy]

Advocate egalitarianism then! You don't even need a label. Just be.

 

[warpus]

I'm not comfortable using either term either - both movements seem to be inherently flawed to me.

Too bad there isn't a movement out there that has "gender equality" as a main thesis/motto that the movement is built around.

Maybe someone should try to start one.. but then again, I bet they would be called "sexist" and chased away if they tried.

 

[aelf]

A lot of people must be smoking something potent. The last I checked, feminism is about gender equality.

Is there some kind of MRA brand crack out there?

 

[warpus]

A lot of people must be smoking something potent. The last I checked, feminism is about gender equality.

Some feminists say that, while others say that it is based around the concept of women's rights. For example, if you want to find a feminist at the university where I work, you'd head to the "Women's studies" department.

From my experience it seems to be based on the foundation of women's rights, for the most part dealing with women's issues rather exclusively, much in the same way that the MRA movement views "Men's rights" a priority.

I am talking about a movement that places the concept of "gender equality" as their foundation, building up their movement from that, instead of focusing on one of the genders instead.

 

[aelf]

Isn't that the product of a history in which men have dominated?

Would you also find fault in the label "anti-war"? Do you demand a truly 'objective' "war equality" label?

 

[Borachio]

I don't know what you mean by a "war equality" label.

But I could easily find fault with a "Department of Defense" label, if asked.

 

[caketastydelish]

Isn't that the product of a history in which men have dominated?

Sure, but there can still be men's issues can there not?

Would you also find fault in the label "anti-war"? Do you demand a truly 'objective' "war equality" label?

Haha, nice false dichotomy.

 

[Manfred Belheim]

Yes, they still do blame them. One of the commonest questions that arises when someone is raped is "What was she wearing?" or "Was she drunk?". Neither should have any bearing on the fact that a crime was committed.

Citation for that fact? I've never heard anyone in real life ever express such an opinion. Obviously it happens, and I'd imagine it always makes for good sensationalist headlines whenever anyone publicly expresses such an opinion, but I really doubt it's in any way a common response.

There was a case where a teenage girl was sexually assaulted during a job interview. The perpetrator defended himself by saying that she hadn't "presented herself in a bonnet and crinolines." (meaning she wasn't dressed like a woman out of "Little House on the Prairie", in a bonnet and long dress that reached the ground)

I don't think we should take the perpetrator's views as being representative of society at large. If you wanted to know how the public at large feel about murder, you wouldn't quote a single murderer would you?

Edit: Sorry, I have now read your later post where you explained that it was actually the judge saying that, not the perp. But the fact that there is a Wikipedia article about it and, as you said, it caused "quite a fuss at the time" is precisely what I was talking about with my "sensationalist headline" thing above. Things like that wouldn't cause a stir if it they were as common as you make out.

 

[caketastydelish]

On the one extreme, you have complaints about manspreading, on the other extreme, you have this:


http://www.rooshv.com/how-to-stop-rape

The author apparently writes a lot of fiction and fantasy.

I can single-handedly beat Roosh in a debate without ever opening my mouth during the debate: Just let him talk and he pwns himself the more he does it.

 

[Borachio]

'd imagine it always makes for good sensationalist headlines whenever anyone publicly expresses such an opinion, but I really doubt it's in any way a common response.

I've very often heard this sentiment expressed: "Well, what do these young women expect? Going out dressed like that! They're just asking for it."

 

[aelf]

Sure, but there can still be men's issues can there not?

Nobody here has said that there can't be. You can continue to fence with an imaginary opponent, though. I've seen that it fulfills some deep need of yours.

Haha, nice false dichotomy.

It's not a dichotomy. It's an analogy. You have much to learn.

Feminism is a reaction, just like being anti-war is a reaction. You don't expect a reaction to occupy an inherently neutral space. That's unreasonable and simply illogical.

There are people (who invariably think of or refer to themselves as 'moderates' - certainly how a lot of MRAs see themselves in contrast to the 'extremist' feminists) who are against whatever is anti something. That's basically as absurd as being anti-anti-war because anti-war does not regard war and peace equally.

 

[warpus]

I've very often heard this sentiment expressed: "Well, what do these young women expect? Going out dressed like that! They're just asking for it."

These days I only ever hear talk like that from crazy people in the middle east or Alabama or one of those states.. Most other people seem to understand that it's not kosher to say things like that anymore. Mind you that's just me and what I have heard or read.

 

[Borachio]

I hear it a lot. Especially from women in their late middle age. (Which might say much about them. I can't really comment.)

 

[warpus]

Really? Well that's kind of depressing..