Why Archipeligo maps stink (in my opinion)

[insaneweasel]

Okay, rant time:

-HUGE lag on archi maps...small islands is worse than large continents.

-Pathing problems. I ask a unit to go somewhere - maybe it will, maybe it won't.
It's a crapshoot.

-Expanding is pretty boring. If you find good spots for 4 cities, consider yourself lucky.
It isn't worth the unhappiness and cultural policy loss to settle cities that don't have at least 2 types of luxury resources.

-The script is so moronic that you see 1, 2 or 2 tile islands with only 1 resource...not worth settling unless you're a cheating AI.

-If you are a cheating AI, you're still not smart enough to utilize ANY aspects of naval warfare.

-Fishing boats on fish stink now. 1f 1g, thanks, but no thanks. Lighthouse is good enough in most cases.

That's my rant. Agree or disagree, just don't flame.

-The nerf to seaport has made them practically useless.

-That doesn't matter anyway, because most water tiles are useless!
2f 1g tiles are crap (even with colossus, they're still not great, and you won't likely get it on higher difficulties). It's better to run merchants, for the gp points.

 

[TM Moot]

-The nerf to seaport has made them practically useless.

especially this...

hardly bother with coastal cities now tbh, basic sea tiles are poo and sea resources aren't much better without serious investment, hopefully buffed in the next patch

 

[chazzycat]

can't say I totally agree. With the nerf to communism, +3 per coastal city is the strongert bonus available so coastal cities can still be ok. And they moved some of the production from seaports to harbors, which come earlier so you can get the production faster.

I do agree they nerfed seaports too hard. I would like to see +2 flat production bonus added or something, they are pretty underwhelming now.

 

[Larsenex]

Oh the poor Danes....What will we do?

 

[Elliot]

Why are regular sea tiles still 2 F 1 G for the ENTIRE game? There needs to be an upgrade around the time of economics to 2F 2G otherwise I avoid water like the plague. Its just a drain on happiness, culture, settlers, time otherwise.

 

[GrayingGamer]

When the AI can actually squash you militarily on maps that involve some/much naval warfare, then these maps will be much more interesting.

 

[Fabiano79]

Archipelago maps = Domination with Denmark, only victory I had on deity. (not proud of it, but I have the achievment weeeeee)

 

[blasto]

Regarding the pathfinding, I found the issue is probably specific to sending a unit through fog of war. FOW totally hoses they're pathfinding versus sending them through discovered territory.

 

[GreenBayGuru]

Actually I found playing on a huge map with the huge map mod pretty good with the archipeligo set up but I change the planets age to 5 million & have the sea level set at low, This seems to create continents & smaller island chains

\m/

 

[Kerosene31]

I'm on the exact opposite side of things. I love Archipeligo maps.

The best thing about them is you get a little breathing room from the overly aggressive AI when you don't share borders with them.

 

[Calouste]

Archipelago maps, and specially tiny islands, are resource poor, by their very nature. It's part of the challenge/charm of them. You might as well complain about Ice Age maps not having a lot of jungle.

I find that going Tradition -> Commerce works well on Archipelago maps. Build up your capital first and start expanding when you can found new cities starting with +2F+3H, and buy a Workshop in them.

 

[ColinTH]

Archipelago maps = Domination with Denmark, only victory I had on deity. (not proud of it, but I have the achievment weeeeee)

Why are you not proud of yourself? I say well done, why should you be ashamed?

 

[Civsassin]

-The nerf to seaport has made them practically useless.

Do you build Stoneworks and or stables? I typically do even if I only have one of each resource available. What's the difference with the Seaport? Particularly if you have two or more sea resources, they can be extremely useful. The only problem I see with them is that they come late in the game typically.

On a more general note, I enjoy archipelago maps. I don't mind hunting for and settling the best lands available. I am not afraid to build a lot of cities if the map calls for it.

 

[Calouste]

Do you build Stoneworks and or stables? I typically do even if I only have one of each resource available. What's the difference with the Seaport? Particularly if you have two or more sea resources, they can be extremely useful. The only problem I see with them is that they come late in the game typically.

On a more general note, I enjoy archipelago maps. I don't mind hunting for and settling the best lands available. I am not afraid to build a lot of cities if the map calls for it.

Stoneworks is 1 base hammer + 1 happy + 1 hammer per resource for 1 gpt. Stables is 1 hammer per resource for 1 gpt. Seaport is 1 hammer per resource for 3 gpt.

 

[That nerdy kid]

yup pretty much true. archipelago maps have 4 civs that work: britain, polynesia, denmark, and the ottomans (and only if you are playing with quite a few barbarians). otherwise you might as well choose a different map.

 

[Civsassin]

Stoneworks is 1 base hammer + 1 happy + 1 hammer per resource for 1 gpt. Stables is 1 hammer per resource for 1 gpt. Seaport is 1 hammer per resource for 3 gpt.

Correct. However, the Harbor gets the +1 production first, so you get it that much earlier. You will get the +2 production per sea resource with your Seaport, which makes the combination more powerful than either the Stable or Stoneworks given that you have an equal number of resources with which to gain the bonus. I consider that a buff and not a nerf IMO.

 

[ColinTH]

I hate the fact that so many civ forum members consider Archipelago maps to be the poor relation to the (true) civ game. Archipelago maps have their own set of challenges, the knockers generally highlight how bad the AI are at naval warfare (as if to make a big point of how good the AI are at land warfare). I can play any type of map at any level but I prefer Archipelago for the same reasons as Kerosene31.
To the op, the seaport/ harbour combo is probably better post patch, (because of earlier hammers) the exception being if you have to build a harbour for three cities on the same island, previously you didn't need all three harbours!

 

[Gwenwyn]

Archipelago maps = Domination with Denmark, only victory I had on deity. (not proud of it, but I have the achievment weeeeee)

Same here but with Suleiman - nowhere near being able to do it on a land map.

 

[Jim Bro]

yeah archipelago maps suck that's why the Ottomans and the British are not very popular. anyways, the game engine apparently can't sustain huge maps.

 

[Fabiano79]

=ColinTH;10688227]Why are you not proud of yourself? I say well done, why should you be ashamed?

Because its not really a challenge. I played standard map and speed, 8 civs. After I killed all the barbs on my island, I just sit there, trying to catch up the AI tech. what only happened on modern era. By this time, there was only 3 civs on the game.

Them I built a decent size army (I was never attacked) and stroke cirurgical attacks on their capitals.

I dont think this configure a deity game, but nevertheless I won.