Why do you support gun ownership?

[.Shane.]

I think that a reading of the federalist papers and past legal precedent make it pretty clear that, regardless of how we want to read "militia", US citizens have a right to own guns. What is debateable is the degree or limits to said ownership.

What I'm curious about is why states and even municipalities have sooooo much flexibility in terms of limiting guns. Anyone have a good, objective (meaning not authored by the NRA payroll) book on the history of gun legislation?

 

[cgannon64]

It all makes sense.

It still doesn't tell us what exactly this militia is.

Alot of conservatives like to talk about how that militia clause is to foment rebellion when the time comes and the government has abandoned the constitution; that would seem to indicate the militia is an extragovernental force - alot like, say, that one down in Waco?

 

[IglooDame]

I think that a reading of the federalist papers and past legal precedent make it pretty clear that, regardless of how we want to read "militia", US citizens have a right to own guns. What is debateable is the degree or limits to said ownership.

What I'm curious about is why states and even municipalities have sooooo much flexibility in terms of limiting guns. Anyone have a good, objective (meaning not authored by the NRA payroll) book on the history of gun legislation?

I'm not sure you can find any book that doesn't have a heavy pro- or anti- bias.

Anyway, as for municipalities, some states' do and some don't, based mostly I think on the preemption level built into the state laws - some states (NH being one) specifically disallow local preemption of state gun laws.

As for the states, well, their state supreme courts interpret their own constitutions, and there have been no decisive rulings by the US Supreme Court in the last few decades, if at all.

 

[Bugfatty300]

What is that quote that you liberal gun grabbers love to cite so much? Ya know. The one you guys quoted every breath during the Patriot Act fiasco.

I think it goes soemthing like this: "Those who would give up essential liberty for security will lose both and deserve neither."

Since you guys love founding father quotes, here is one I like alot.

"Laws that forbid the carrying of arms... disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man."

 

[Eukaryote]

I Don't, you're more likley to shoot a family member/boyfriend or girlfriend/mailman than an intruder. And why shoot I support something in the constitution if it doesn't help anyone?

 

[Bugfatty300]

I Don't, you're more likley to shoot a family member/boyfriend or girlfriend/mailman than an intruder.

Source?

And why shoot I support something in the constitution if it doesn't help anyone?

Can apply to anything in the constitution.

Some people do not believe the 1st amendment helps anyone either.....

 

[IglooDame]

I Don't, you're more likley to shoot a family member/boyfriend or girlfriend/mailman than an intruder.

This is, to be blunt, complete bullcrap.

 

[Eukaryote]

Source?

Dude, that's pretty common knowladge. Pretty much everyone I know has heard of it. I don't know who first told the world this but I'm pretty sure it's true.

 

[MobBoss]

Dude, that's pretty common knowladge. Pretty much everyone I know has heard of it. I don't know who first told the world this but I'm pretty sure it's true.

Not common knowledge at all. Please refer to igloos link and then make an informed opinion on it. Lets bring it out of the urban myth realm and shine some light on it....the old "I'm pretty sure" isnt proof enough for folks around here.

 

[Eukaryote]

This is, to be blunt, complete bullcrap.

Good arugument but I think that simply the fact that more people are unintentionally killed with a gun that intuders are shot is enough to keep me away from guns.

 

[MobBoss]

Good arugument but I think that simply the fact that more people are unintentionally killed with a gun that intuders are shot is enough to keep me away from guns.

Your choice. However, would you stay away from vehicles since more people are unintentionally killed by them?

People are unintentionally killed by a gun because people dont respect the gun enough to handle it responsibly. I have handled guns all my life and never had anyone unintentionally hurt, nor has anyone experienced this in my circle of friends either. Guns can be used responsibly and safely, just like anything else...its the human factor that gets people killed...just like with everything else.

 

[classical_hero]

The problem with guns is that they have only one purpose and that is to kill. Having that sort of weapon in your home is something that really should happen.

 

[Tycoon101]

The problem with guns is that they have only one purpose and that is to kill. Having that sort of weapon in your home is something that really should happen.

Guns don't always kill. You can immobilize an assailant by shooting out their arms or their knees. Guns aren't always used to kill. Even saying that you have a gun can make a potential attacker rethink his plans.

 

[IglooDame]

The problem with guns is that they have only one purpose and that is to kill. Having that sort of weapon in your home is something that really should happen.

And yet, simply pointing one at someone without actually pulling the trigger can be enough to prevent a murder (notably, your own)...

 

[IglooDame]

Good arugument but I think that simply the fact that more people are unintentionally killed with a gun that intuders are shot is enough to keep me away from guns.

No, more people in the study are unintentionally killed with a gun (12) than intruders are killed in self-defense (not just "shot") (9). The study offers no numbers on the number of intruders that are wounded, or shot at but missed, or not shot but scared off by armed homeowners.

You are of course free to make your own decisions about owning a gun, obviously. I want everyone to have accurate information in order to base their decision, but really all I ask is that everyone leave me free to make my own decisions about it as well. In Washington DC, NYC, Chicago and its suburbs, recently San Francisco, and elsewhere that freedom has been denied or curtailed so much as to be effectively denied.

 

[Blazer6]

I follow dads example of placing a lock on it and hiding it in a tall place, unloaded. I wouldn't have my money on display for the world to see, so why have the gun in a location where children can get it?

 

[tomsnowman123]

Since a green-anarchy won't happen overnight, and the government appears to be here to stay, I mine as well try to get them to help a little bit. I would rather restrict gun ownership then allow it, since guns kill people.

 

[plarq]

Your choice. However, would you stay away from vehicles since more people are unintentionally killed by them?

People are unintentionally killed by a gun because people dont respect the gun enough to handle it responsibly. I have handled guns all my life and never had anyone unintentionally hurt, nor has anyone experienced this in my circle of friends either. Guns can be used responsibly and safely, just like anything else...its the human factor that gets people killed...just like with everything else.

Since some of gun holders don't respect the gun, I guess a more strict regulation of firearm is needed. In order to fend off intruders and other criminals, we should only allow faithful, skillful, and responsible citizens in perfect mental health to hold guns.

 

[Atlas14]

Since some of gun holders don't respect the gun, I guess a more strict regulation of firearm is needed. In order to fend off intruders and other criminals, we should only allow faithful, skillful, and responsible citizens in perfect mental health to hold guns.

Can the people that don't qualify for gun ownership be trusted with sharp steak knives, automobiles, cigarette lighters, or even baseball bats? Some people don't respect the use of alcohol or even swiss army blades. Should these be restricted and more strictly regulated as well? Im guessing you don't own a gun, and have probably never really fired any either.

 

[plarq]

Can the people that don't qualify for gun ownership be trusted with sharp steak knives, automobiles, cigarette lighters, or even baseball bats? Some people don't respect the use of alcohol or even swiss army blades. Should these be restricted and more strictly regulated as well? Im guessing you don't own a gun, and have probably never really fired any either.

You got it right, I never owned a gun. The goverment doesn't allow. That's why I'm not so eager against guns, as our goverment deprives me off one possible hobby.