Why is the hijab considered oppressive?

[Mouthwash]

I don't actually understand the objections to it. Different cultures have different standards and norms. It's no different on a fundamental level to ban Muslim women from showing their hair in public than to ban Western women from showing their breasts in public (which many cultures have no problem with and would consider our standards "oppressive").

The current backlash against it just shows you the sheer depth and absurdity of ethnocentrism. We Westerners like to think we're immune to things like "culture" or "barbarism" but that's what ethnocentrism is- viewing your own culture as the completely normal and moderate one and judging other cultures solely your own values and standards. We haven't actually changed much in that regard since the Stone Age. Orthodox Jewish women wear bandanas over their heads to cover their hair, for precisely the same reason that Muslims do, and nobody raises a fuss because Jews are a familiar part of our Judeo-Christian European heritage.

 

[Joecoolyo]

I think most objections to it come from the notion that its forced upon the women, as in they have no choice in the matter.

 

[Mouthwash]

I think most objections to it come from the notion that its forced upon the women, as in they have no choice in the matter.

So is covering up breasts. As I just pointed out.

And didn't Christopher Hitchens want to ban the hijab?

 

[emzie]

Because a bunch of righteous westerners have never bothered to actually talk to women wearing hijabs and just assume it's forced upon them.

 

[Joecoolyo]

So is covering up breasts. As I just pointed out.

Well yes, never said I agreed with the notion, just that's why some people consider it oppressive.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

I don't actually understand the objections to it. Different cultures have different standards and norms. It's no different on a fundamental level to ban Muslim women from showing their hair in public than to ban Western women from showing their breasts in public (which many cultures have no problem with and would consider our standards "oppressive").

The current backlash against it just shows you the sheer depth and absurdity of ethnocentrism. We Westerners like to think we're immune to things like "culture" or "barbarism" but that's what ethnocentrism is- viewing your own culture as the completely normal and moderate one and judging other cultures solely your own values and standards. We haven't actually changed much in that regard since the Stone Age. Orthodox Jewish women wear bandanas over their heads to cover their hair, for precisely the same reason that Muslims do, and nobody raises a fuss because Jews are a familiar part of our Judeo-Christian European heritage.

I pretty much agree with you. I think the issue with banning hijabs and naquibs is that it attacks the symptom while leaving the problem itself to fester. If there is any evidence that banning these things force muslim men to be more considerate, respectful and less commabding of muslim women then that's one thing. I don't know If there is any evidence to support this though and it could create a backlash that further entrenches the mindset that the bans are meant to change.

 

[emzie]

I pretty much agree with you. I think the issue with banning hijabs and naquibs is that it attacks the symptom while leaving the problem itself to fester. If there is any evidence that banning these things force muslim men to be more considerate, respectful and less commabding of muslim women then that's one thing. I don't know If there is any evidence to support this though and it could create a backlash that further entrenches the mindset that the bans are meant to change.

Most women I've spoken with about headscarves feel naked in public without them. It might have been socially conditioned into them, but so is makeup into western girls.

 

[Borachio]

Well, there's a case to be made that make-up is also oppressive. Many feminists would say so.

 

[warpus]

Has there been a hijab backlash? I haven't seen one.

Hijab is the one that covers up the hair but not face, right? The only blacklash I've seen has been with the one that covers up the face.

And yeah, if you're looking into another culture from the outside? You will find a lot of things very weird. You will likely encounter many things that don't jive with your cultural norms or expectations. Such as North Americans and the consumption of baked goods for breakfast in the name of a continental plate.

 

[emzie]

Has there been a hijab backlash? I haven't seen one.

Hijab is the one that covers up the hair but not face, right? The only blacklash I've seen has been with the one that covers up the face.

And yeah, if you're looking into another culture from the outside? You will find a lot of things very weird. You will likely encounter many things that don't jive with your cultural norms or expectations. Such as North Americans and the consumption of baked goods for breakfast in the name of a continental plate.

Hijab generally refers to headscarves. Burkas / niqabs are the whole body thing.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

Hijab = headscarf
Niqab = full body cover (iirc)

Then there's dirka dirka but that only comes up when I am so ronery

 

[warpus]

Does a hijab generally cover up the face though? It doesn't, right?

I've really never heard anyone complaining about those. It's usually ninja/burqa jokes or issues with people not being able to be identified cause their face is covered up, etc.

 

[emzie]

Does a hijab generally cover up the face though? It doesn't, right?

No, it doesn't. In a sense, nuns and old eastern orthodox women wear hijabs.

 

[Silurian]

What percentage of adult muslim women wear the hijab etc in public.

40% 30% or less?

 

[Borachio]

The French got quite aerated about the hijab: in schools and colleges, where any outward symbolism of religious affiliation is banned.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_scarf_controversy_in_France

In 2010, France also banned the birqah in public. I think the birqah is a rather different issue to the hijab.

 

[emzie]

What percentage of adult muslim women wear the hijab etc in public.

40% 30% or less?

Culture dependant. In Turkey or Tunisia, not a lot. In western countries, it depends on the country of origin. For observant Muslims on Fridays, probably damn near 100% -- yer not going to mosque without one.

 

[Tahuti]

The Hijab is not even a religious piece of clothing. AFAIK, it is a matter of culture, first introduced by the Hebrews and Persians (both for secular reasons), which was later adopted by the Romans and Arabs. It may very well have originated as protective gear against sandstorms, who knows. Anyway, the very word isn't even mentioned in any Islamic Holy Text, so Hijabs are just as consequential to Islam as camels and oil derricks.

 

[squadbroken]

Has there been a hijab backlash? I haven't seen one.

In Quebec there have been a few incidents regarding the hijab.

 

[Bugfatty300]

More accurately "hijab" is the general term for dressing modestly. Not a headscarf.

 

[emzie]

The Hijab is not even a religious piece of clothing. AFAIK, it is a matter of culture, first introduced by the Hebrews and Persians (both for secular reasons), which was later adopted by the Romans and Arabs. It may very well have originated as protective gear against sandstorms, who knows. Anyway, the very word isn't even mentioned in any Islamic Holy Text, so the Hijab is just as consequential to Islam as Camels.

While this is all true, hijab just means modest and modesty is a cultural artifact in the first place.