Will religion eventually collapse?

[fishjie]

if you want to define god as the yet unknown laws of nature that govern unexplainable phenomenon, then thats really not the same thing as the benevolent loving creator. it just becomes a semantics thing, and loses any special meaning. instead of calling it string theory, we might as well call it god theory. but again, just as we know lightning is caused by electricity, we don't say stuff like "the gods hurl down lightning bolts from the heavens" because we can get much more precise. there is no need for "god" in the explanation for lightning.

we may never get all the answers, but if you want to call the unknowns "god" then why even worship such a "god"?

 

[Berzerker]

I didn't define god as the yet unknown laws of nature

 

[Henky]

Hello there...
For the start, what is your goal of the whole thing, here? Just to see other people opinion? It all started as question on religion, but ended as expected: The First Question Ever Made?!
There won't be any answer if God exist or doesn't. Never.! But that later...

The concept: belief is different from religion. Every human being believes in something (he believes God(s) exist; he believes that God(s)does not exist). So, belief is not connected to religion. Religion only uses it. Religion has other principles than beliefs. Religion has more political background than spiritual. As Napoleon said, "Religion is the only thing that the poor does not kill the rich". That is why Kings/Emperors and other rulers chose there religions and tried conquer more lands. It was a used as a weapon in order to control people and lands. You just have to get a normal history book and see the patterns that happened in the Roman Empire, later in the Holy Empire and the 16th cc. In those eras there were the biggest religion fights. It all was made to make people follow them as sheep, to have fear, because there is something that watches you over and sees everything, after his judgment you may go to heaven or hell.! Bad=Hell; Good=Heaven. In Islam even they gave you virgins. (They just didn't specify what kind of virgins.!)
Humans have ever believed in something. There is no man, woman, child that does not believe in something. (I actually want to believe in Santa.. At least i get presents even if i am not an angel.) So, people will continue to believe in something and will share there experience with others, so organized (syn.organised) religion.

About God or gods. Well, Imanuel Kant once wrote that, in this life we won't experience God, even if it exist, because he is beyond our capability to perceive Him. That might actually be true, but what or who is God? Is it really a wise-old-man that lives on top of a cloud? That's the whole point of the farce.. Every man has his own view what He is. That makes Him individual and specified to your needs. In reality, you create God not he creates you. The funny thing is that He gets all the merit of creating...

Answering to the question before all this. Will religion decay or disappear? Probably not. If the mission of religion is completed than there is no longer point to exist, so... Religion has far-going missions and that means it may mutate, but not disappear. It's too economical for some to be let buried.


For a fact, how many believers are in the world that believe to a God or gods? In the world are round about 6,6 billion people.. Christianity "control" some third of it. Imagine.!

 

[Bill3000]

Most of you guys are real sure of your superior atheistic beliefs aren't you?

Oh please. You believe in God because it's conservative, not because you have a genuine belief in Catholicism.

 

[fishjie]

I didn't define god as the yet unknown laws of nature

Its just a word or concept to describe a belief in some unfathomable power possibly lurking beyond what science can tell us about existence.

see this is just a semantics game. if you use "god" as a stop plug to fill in the missing gaps of human knowledge then the word loses any relevance or meaning. what causes cancer? we don't know. god did it. what an ultimately unsatisfying and useless answer.

what i also don't understand is how a lot of people will argue how since we don't know what caused life on earth, that a god was responsible, and then they magically transition from that to "thus that god must have been x" where x is their god. thats a gigantic leap in logic there.... if you want to infer the existence of a god because we don't know some answers, well all you could infer is that god set some events in motion. you could not infer that he's loving or any other characteristics people attribute to deities.

 

[Berzerker]

see this is just a semantics game. if you use "god" as a stop plug to fill in the missing gaps of human knowledge then the word loses any relevance or meaning. what causes cancer? we don't know. god did it. what an ultimately unsatisfying and useless answer.

what i also don't understand is how a lot of people will argue how since we don't know what caused life on earth, that a god was responsible, and then they magically transition from that to "thus that god must have been x" where x is their god. thats a gigantic leap in logic there.... if you want to infer the existence of a god because we don't know some answers, well all you could infer is that god set some events in motion. you could not infer that he's loving or any other characteristics people attribute to deities.

Either you believe the universe just popped into existence by itself "naturally" or you believe there's some "unfathomable" power behind it all, beyond our natural laws. Religion will survive because science cant answer that question well enough to satisfy people. And semantics or not many people use "god" as the word for this power.

 

[fishjie]

Either you believe the universe just popped into existence by itself "naturally" or you believe there's some "unfathomable" power behind it all, beyond our natural laws. Religion will survive because science cant answer that question well enough to satisfy people. And semantics or not many people use "god" as the word for this power.

yes, but god defined in this sense isnt really anything meaningful. god would just be defined as the unknown. whoop tee doo. such a god has been shrinking and growing smaller with every passing century as our knowledge increases.

the god(s) most people believe in are actively involved in shaping the course of humanity, and forms personal relationships with them.

edit: furthermore, you still haven't told me how you went from "we dont know many things about the universe so god must have been responsible" to "thus we must worship this god through an organized form of religion"

where is your line of reasoning that because some kind of power was responsible for bringing everything into existence, that that power demands or even wants to be worshipped or even cares?

 

[King Flevance]

Do you think Religion will survive in the future? From the way I see it, there are so many factors working against religion that it seems likely it will eventually die out:

I assume from this statement that you are not familiar with many religious groups larger than 10-20 people. Religious communities are not any weaker with the word they preach than they always have been. But its culture surrounding it can appear silent at times.

Also, this thread isn't meant to discuss the truth of religions or whether they are useful or detrimental to society. It is whether religions will survive or not in face of social forces that are driving away their disciples and believers.

Well, then its a tilted converstaion. Because if the Christian faith is true then it can never die. So really, christians aren't welcome in this discussion. Again the second part is based on your personal viewpoint. I don't hear alot of stories about people leaving religions. I do hear alot of stories of people converting.

 

[Theige]

Religion collapsed a long time ago in the West, considering the position it once occupied.

It will always exist, and has had great influence. But as a society we have moved on to different ideological struggles.

 

[CurtSibling]

Will religion eventually collapse?

I think it likely that religions of today will evolve. To not labour the point, myths are religions of yesterday.

I am of the mind that cults like 'dianetics' will become the new 'christianty' in a future age.

...

 

[Bast]

Religion collapsed a long time ago in the West, considering the position it once occupied.

It was always exist, and has had great influence. But as a society we have moved on to different ideological struggles.

Medieval Christendom is not my idea of good religion. If that's the case I'm glad religion has "collapsed".

I think people are also confusing organized religion with personal religion in this thread.

It's important to differentiate between the two.

 

[CurtSibling]

Personal religion seems to be replaced in this age with a 'cult of self'...

People only care about their materialistic lives and use so-called
'religious belief' when they wish to make themselves feel superior...

It it interesting to watch this circus from afar.

...

 

[Henky]

Either you believe the universe just popped into existence by itself "naturally" or you believe there's some "unfathomable" power behind it all, beyond our natural laws. Religion will survive because science cant answer that question well enough to satisfy people. And semantics or not many people use "god" as the word for this power.

Religions answers the same thing that science. God creates everything vs. Big Bang creates materia and further the planets + life in some.

Nor science tries to explain the time before the Big Bang, nor religions says something that existed before the God did... The only problem is that science tells it is a theory they are researching, but religion tells it as truth there belief.

 

[CurtSibling]

And both are constructs of man's mind.

...

 

[fishjie]

And both are constructs of man's mind.

...

if you think gravity is a construct of man's mind, try jumping off a building and let me know how that goes

 

[Murky]

Current religions will eventually fade away. There will always be someone trying to explain our existence and exploring spirituality. There will always be a societal code of morality which will most likely resemble current religious practices.

 

[moscaverde]

"The concept: belief is different from religion. Every human being believes in something (he believes God(s) exist; he believes that God(s)does not exist)"

Or he is agnostic.

Probably the current religions will change to ones more suitables with science discoveries.

 

[Smidlee]

Science does debunk many of religion's previously held beliefs (the belief that the earth is the center of the universe for example). And there are studies that have shown that the more educated you are, the less likely you are to be religious. I admit that my points come off as extremely biased but that doesn't mean that they are untrue.

yet is it true?
James 1:26-27 " If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue.... this man's religion is vain. Pure religion [is] .... to visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction and to keep himself unspotted from the world. "

So the more educated someone is the more they will run their mouth , the less they care about widows and helpless, and the more corrupt they are? Hmmmm.... You may have a point.

 

[fishjie]

yet is it true?
James 1:26-27 " If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue.... this man's religion is vain. Pure religion [is] .... to visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction and to keep himself unspotted from the world. "

So the more educated someone is the more they will run their mouth , the less they care about widows and helpless, and the more corrupt they are? Hmmmm.... You may have a point.

high rates of religion is also shown to correlate with higher rates of crime so your argument doesn't really hold.

now correlation doesn't imply causality, but its food for thought.

just look at all the atheist nations out there and how well they're doing.

edit: besides, what does higher iq having to do with less likely to be religious have to do with being a more generous person? thats an entirely separate question. and since when are religious people the only people who are capable of doing good?

 

[Smidlee]

high rates of religion is also shown to correlate with higher rates of crime so your argument doesn't really hold.

now correlation doesn't imply causality, but its food for thought.

What is crime? What is crime in one country can be legal or overlooked in another. For example driving drunk isn't illegal in some countries but it is in USA. So of course in this case USA will have a greater number of people with DUI's.

James was making clear what pure religion is since those to whom he was writing to claimed to be so "religious".