Won my second Deity game, here's tips.

[JohninNewport]

I played 1 diety game continents/marathon used alexander and consider it somewhat of an easy win.
Phase 1 land destruction, build, sell resources buy kill kill kill. Took out the first opponent with 3 warriors and 2 phalanx at around 3000 bc. 3 more down by 1700 BC. I used some companions, but honestly the strat would have worked with any civ.

Phase 2 build shiny infastructure and wonders for thousands of years, befriending city states along the way while rushing navigation and saving massive amounts of gold.

Phase 3 rush buy 7 frigates.

Phase 4 find the super advanced swarmed packed continent and stutter in amazement at the hundreds of units on every square and 10ish sail boats floating around.

Phase 5 make deals for everyones gold all at once then sink all the fail boats at once.

Phase 6 bombard 90% of the hundreds of units into oblivion.

Phase 7 accept like 20 cities and everything else they have in payment for peace once i get bored watching the massacre and accept the -100ish happiness hit.

Phase 8 move in the old ground troops into strategicly placed locations on my new colonies.

Phase 9 upgrade all the old troops to rifles, rush buy swarms of artillery, click on all the capitals in the same turn.

Phase 10 watch the painfully unsatisfacting victory message pop up then walk away in frustration.

I can confirm this is a valid strategy on standard time and continents map as well. However unlike the OP I was not frustrated by the win. I took many failures to finally get a win on DEITY. Even then this strategy is far from foolproof and wont win 100% of the time.

However, a couple points of difference:

1. I did not do any diplomacy at all. No city states, no research agreements, no negotiations of peace. It was constant warfare with the every enemy.

2. I neither razed nor annexed cities. I just left them as puppets.

3. I built zero wonders.

4. I left my workers on automated improvements.

5. I chose random leader and got Gandhi, although I dont really feel like he provided much of an advantage to this strategy.

The reason this strategy works is primarily because the AI is not very skilled at combat, in articular naval combat. Once I had solidified my continent I rushed to control the seas and built frigates (which I later upgraded to destroyers). These units have large movement speed, and with full upgrades can bombard units from 3 tiles away twice in one turn without fear of counterattack. They are effectively an unstoppable military force. Note, that eventually the city strength will be so high that destroyers will be useless in city bombarbment.
I made a bunch of mistakes a long the way that could have made the victory easier but I think this is generally one of the easiest ways to get a legitimate win on Deity for those that are struggling to beat that difficulty at all.

 

[stii]

Yup. I have to conclude that relying on Stonehenge cannot make for a good strategy. You cannot guarantee stonehenge, you merely have to get lucky.

I say this because I recently started a culture game, got an amazing start location, beelined calendar then mining immediately after, built a worker and stole a worker and was running double chops, and was still beat to stonehenge by a large margin. It wasn't even close. I got essentially a perfect stonehenge start (short of popping calendar from a hut) and still lost the race.

Thing is there is probably some percentage of deity games where unless you do something radical like rushing this wonder you will just lose, maybe it is only 2% but it is there. You can get some pretty terrible starts right next to AIs who expand all over you.

In my testing I was never miles away from building stonehenge when they finished it and even when I missed by a few turns I could have chopped or moved tiles to make it. So if you can do it in 98% of games then lose the other 2% is it really that different?

 

[stii]

For instance, Martin Alito has given ample evidence of how to ACTUALLY win on Deity (on any speed from marathon to normal), on larger maps (standard and bigger), using a strategy that is NOT reload/map dependent. And he has screenshots in deity to prove it.

Where is this out of interest?

 

[insaneweasel]

"Restarted a few times to get a decent starting point"

lol

reloading to win battles and wonders is another great way to win on Diety

i refer to this as "how to win everytime- a reloaders guide to victory"

lol

He wasn't talking about restarting battles, just starting locations.
A bad location means slower start, and less fun.

 

[Martin Alvito]

Where is this out of interest?

I think he's referring to http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=385379. It's his idea, not mine. I just made it work on Deity.

I wouldn't call it non-map-dependent, although you can do a lot to influence a bad start. You have to keep AIs off your back early, which means taking deals to make war against distant civs that can't hurt you. If you have a hyper-aggressive AI next door, you're going to have to punt to something else. Ditto if there aren't any Forests for miles around.

It is not a quick conquest machine by any means. Horses will get the job done faster. But you don't need any resources, and once the machine gets rolling it becomes pretty effective. It'll do well on any map type until they fix SHIFT-ENTER. After that things may get dicey.

 

[jayjackson]

Arguments about strategy being the ability to be adaptive have nothing to do with employing a particular strategy at a particular time. xcaine won a game on Deity, fair and square, employing his strategy. That's better than 99% of CFC members can do. He also lost a bunch of games trying the same strategy, and quitting when he viewed the situation as hopeless. That means his strategy isn't odds-on. It could mean that there are better ones. It doesn't mean it's not a "strategy," or that he cheated in the game where he won. It only means he quit other games before you would have.

By the way, saying " in the eyes of 99% of us" is usually a cheap shot indicative of sloppy reasoning to follow.

No, about 1% of the people here cheat, I'd say. Most people here tend to play the game as intended.

Quitting when you think a game is hopeless? If because you miss the first wonder available to you (Stonehenge) makes the game hopeless, then you don't belong on Deity. And I'll tell you this, if he reloaded a save at any point after having further knowledge of the map, he didn't win a damn thing fair and square. If, say you know a city location has Iron or Horses, for instance, and you aren't that far in the game when you reload the save, that's cheating. You've uncovered information you would have had to play to get. Again, I will qualify this by saying that I think he is strictly playing new maps until he gets one where he gets Stonehenge, and I don't think there is anything wrong with this as long as he isn't reloading the same map. At all.

Like other posters have said, any "strategy" where you have to reload constantly until you get to Stonehenge isn't really a strategy, because obviously there is no adaptation, and its saying "You lost out on the FIRST WONDER in the 2000BC's, so you lose."

Don't get me wrong, either - I love the discussion. I'm just trying to help him understand why the purists are on his case. And, like the other poster said (although I don't think you should have to change the type of maps you play) - is to play a game out where you actually MISS Stonehenge, and see if you can come up with another viable strategy. It will make the OP have a lot more value, because then he can say "Well, you missed this, but it's not the end of the world, now since you missed it, you need to concentrate on THIS and make sure it happens..." etc!

I wasn't trying to pick a fight or anything by any means. As I said in my original reply, its his money he spent on this piece of software and he can use it in anyway he likes to bring him enjoyment. Sorry if for some reason my post was construed as argumentative, I tried very much to avoid that.

 

[civhawaii]

You people need to get out more.

IF IT WORKS AT ALL, ITS A VIABLE STRAT.

It doesnt matter if OP needed to restart, another player might get lucky on their first map and could use the strat here and win. See how its viable?

And read the thread title again, all he said was "heres tips"

Maybe it will give other ideas on how to improve their own strats.

 

[stii]

I think he's referring to http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=385379. It's his idea, not mine. I just made it work on Deity.

I wouldn't call it non-map-dependent, although you can do a lot to influence a bad start. You have to keep AIs off your back early, which means taking deals to make war against distant civs that can't hurt you. If you have a hyper-aggressive AI next door, you're going to have to punt to something else. Ditto if there aren't any Forests for miles around.

It is not a quick conquest machine by any means. Horses will get the job done faster. But you don't need any resources, and once the machine gets rolling it becomes pretty effective. It'll do well on any map type until they fix SHIFT-ENTER. After that things may get dicey.

While I think it is fine I'm not sure how that is any less cheating than the strat suggested by the OP in this thread. He mentions reloading for a good start and requires you to build two wonders.

 

[jayjackson]

While I think it is fine I'm not sure how that is any less cheating than the strat suggested by the OP in this thread. He mentions reloading for a good start and requires you to build two wonders.

Well, Hall of Fame allows you to choose your map. But, you have to save the game before you make a move on the map you are using. So, by the competitive rules that were in play for Civ IV this was absolutely allowed. I think because of the wording people think he was reloading turns... and that's generally looked at as "cheating".

Again, your game - do what you want.

 

[stii]

I didn't read that at all, in fact I'm wondering where you are getting that from.

 

[Zhahz]

If you know the AI will come right at you and attack the nearest thing, and you setup on favorable terrain with a properly promoted unit, and let the AI suicide on you repeatedly til it's gone, is that really a strategy, or is it taking advantage of horrendous AI?

And then ultimately, is it a whole lot different from anything else that's being called questionable here?

Beating diety is beating diety. And a such, it's something I've always been critical of thru all of civ's history. Players often use favorable settings, taking advantage of game mechanics (tech trading in IV for ex), and/or taking advantage of AI flaws. The whole reason diety and other high diffs get extreme bonuses is because the AI has flaws and cannot compete strategically, so beating those kinds of odds isn't usually completely about strategy, it's about a mix of strategy and maximizing your ability to leverage the flaws.

 

[WaKKO151]

I considered not going for Stonehenge, but really, what are the better early alternative.

Go for horseback Riding. Kill the two civs next to you keeping there capitals only and razing the rest. Build settlers and fill out your empire quick. Get all those workers you stole pumping out LUX and start slamming it home with Chivalry or make the switch to Rifling beeline.

The problem with people trying to cookie cutter Deity is that its not going to happen. Also I would suggest NOT QUITING!!! Slow down. Plan strategys and wait before you hit that next turn button. I read alot on this forum since Civ3 and I don't think alot of people ralize taht the game isn't over until you are dead. Not when you go cry in a corner cause he took your best city or your favorite unit. Keep playing. You learn alot more from losing then winning. So DO NOT QUIT!!!

 

[Brawndo]

"Restarted a few times to get a decent starting point"

lol

reloading to win battles and wonders is another great way to win on Diety

i refer to this as "how to win everytime- a reloaders guide to victory"

lol

Oh ****, he just came at you bro!


Apparently, playing Civ = srs business

 

[jayjackson]

I didn't read that at all, in fact I'm wondering where you are getting that from.

Because in the first page of the thread he says he tried "10 times to play it fair" and couldn't do it. I'm not going to cut and paste the quote, its in the first page of the thread. I'm not saying I saw the language, I'm saying I can tell that's what people are so venomous about. Picking your map was an essential part of the Civ IV HOF, so that's NOT what people are saying. That's where I'm getting that from.

 

[Viperace]

Thanks for the guide. People should give xcaine some credits on it.

-Regenerating till you get a better starting location is NOT cheating. It simply saves precious game time in tough odds game like Deity.
-Reloading to get a god-like view on what is forthcoming, or to change the outcome of a random event, IS cheating. But this guide is not teaching us that.

So, people please think about it.

As far as I am concerned, I learned from the thread which Civ to pick, how to leverage on the UU and UB. What can we expect in the early game, mid-game, late-game. What is the core to win Deity , bla bla bla...

What did the complainers have to add in this thread - Win in Deity? Perhaps give me a better strategy that you can think of ?
(PS: No acrchipealago map or Duel map rush please - I already know that, thanks )

 

[stii]

Go for horseback Riding. Kill the two civs next to you keeping there capitals only and razing the rest. Build settlers and fill out your empire quick. Get all those workers you stole pumping out LUX and start slamming it home with Chivalry or make the switch to Rifling beeline.

Which is risky just in a different way. I tried both the rush stonehenge plan and the make horsemen plan and both are fine but things can go wrong.

With a 2f1h tile you can get stonehenge most of the time and with a chop almost always, without it is really risky. Moving to zero food and working a hill included.

I was easily able to rush one AI but by then I was left on a contient with a second civ who had absorded almost all of another AI. I built more horsemen and teched towards knights but although I could take a few cities the AI had musketmen before I could upgrade to knights and swarms of them. (UU musketmen but I don't think I could attack into normal anyway) I could hold them off but behind on land and tech. The real problem was I had to commit to the second attack before I could tell how poorly it would go.

It doesn't seem like any one plan is without risk when the computer can have a huge army of high tech units, so all the complaining about the risk of stonehenge rush is just silly. Much more useful is working out when the computer gets it on average and if their range is big or small. If they have a small range then you can work out pretty accuately if oyu can get it and if they have a big range this will never be a consistant winning plan.

 

[Infiltrator]

I tried stonehenge with mixed results. Sometimes I would be late and get it surprisingly, other times I'd get an amazing start, +pop pottery at ruins and get beaten by 4 turns. It just depends on what the AI decides to make, making SH a very risky strat.

 

[Collic]

Wow. I can appreciate what people are saying about this not being a fully fleshed out strategy, but this thread is just full of people flaming. Would it really kill some of you to offer some constructive criticism on what the OP wrote, or perhaps offer insights of your own?

I really can't stand elitism, especially when it's attached to something as ultimately pointless and throwaway as a videogame.

 

[Vordeo]

So to sum up flames in this thread:

It's perfectly ok to abuse ******** AI in combat but it's cheating if you abuse ******** AI in trade/diplomacy.

It's lame to play small maps but it's ok to play with marathon speed since that doesnt give any advantage to human player at all.

At no circumstances are you allowed to restart the game, instead you have to continue to the bitter end since it's not fair for the AI and you might hurt their feelings.

It is not valid strategy if AI cant do it, human player is allowed to pick their leader since AI can pick their leader too.

It's not ok to post tips for deity until you have essentially a guide that will work every. single. time. and even a ape can copy it. If you have tips the politically correct way is to replace deity with difficulty level that specific tactic will work every. single. time.

erm did I miss something else? Would call dips on double standards but I'm too confused at the moment to do that. Some people seems to be rather narrow
minded on these forums, and that's really sad.

Best post of the thread by far (w/ all due respect to the OP).

Seriously people, there was no need to attack the guy. Even if you didn't like his strategy, some people are going to find it useful. Generally any discussion is good discussion.

I really can't stand elitism, especially when it's attached to something as ultimately pointless and throwaway as a videogame.

Second best post of the thread. It's not that important people , it's a videogame. Now if it were something like the economy, or football/soccer it'd be a different story.

Edit: Also, kudos to the guy who kept talking about the OP cheating and exploiting, then bragged about his awesome strategy of exploiting AI stupidity. that gave me a good laugh.

 

[Guardian_PL]

Originally Posted by Gartheras
So to sum up flames in this thread:

It's perfectly ok to abuse ******** AI in combat but it's cheating if you abuse ******** AI in trade/diplomacy.

It's lame to play small maps but it's ok to play with marathon speed since that doesnt give any advantage to human player at all.

At no circumstances are you allowed to restart the game, instead you have to continue to the bitter end since it's not fair for the AI and you might hurt their feelings.

It is not valid strategy if AI cant do it, human player is allowed to pick their leader since AI can pick their leader too.

It's not ok to post tips for deity until you have essentially a guide that will work every. single. time. and even a ape can copy it. If you have tips the politically correct way is to replace deity with difficulty level that specific tactic will work every. single. time.

erm did I miss something else? Would call dips on double standards but I'm too confused at the moment to do that. Some people seems to be rather narrow
minded on these forums, and that's really sad.

Best post of the thread by far (w/ all due respect to the OP).

Seriously people, there was no need to attack the guy. Even if you didn't like his strategy, some people are going to find it useful. Generally any discussion is good discussion.



Second best post of the thread. It's not that important people , it's a videogame. Now if it were something like the economy, or football/soccer it'd be a different story.

Edit: Also, kudos to the guy who kept talking about the OP cheating and exploiting, then bragged about his awesome strategy of exploiting AI stupidity. that gave me a good laugh.

Yup, well done Gartheras, very good post indeed