Worst UU

[babar]

The only realistic "worst" candidates are Panzer/ballista elephant.

What about numidian cavalry? The rest of the lower strength units I quite like, but I've never been a fan of numidian cavalry. There are some pretty good arguments as to why they are worse than the base unit (rather than merely no improvement). They are not even better against well entrenched melee.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

What about numidian cavalry? The rest of the lower strength units I quite like, but I've never been a fan of numidian cavalry. There are some pretty good arguments as to why they are worse than the base unit (rather than merely no improvement). They are not even better against well entrenched melee.

Frankly, they're pretty terrible in SP. I'd say they're a "worst" candidate but probably not as bad as Panzer. In MP you do NOT want these things having a pillage party on you because in the field, spears are only ok-ish and everything else BLOWS CHUNKS. Contrast that with stock HA, which while they are odds-on against everything but spears, don't defend so hot vs swords or even axes for cost. NC have a chance to ruin someone's day in such a manner, though they are still nothing compared to say skirmishers in MP lol.

 

[CHEESE!]

Dogs seem to have a lot of spots in the hof, but I guess this is because of cheese.

Sorry.

 

[jgroth1978]

I'm playing a game as the Spanish, and the conquistadors have done very little for me. I'm more of a trait person versus a UU/UB person, anyway.

 

[Ataxerxes]

I'm playing a game as the Spanish, and the conquistadors have done very little for me. I'm more of a trait person versus a UU/UB person, anyway.

Conquistadors are a poor UU IMO. I usually go quickly for Rifling so don't use them. Their UB can give you super-siege, however. Spain is one case where the UB is better for war than the UU. Getting some CR3 siege and some other accuracy siege immediately is a big help. I usually think of Spain's UU as it's siege, although it sometimes takes a tech deviation to get it.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Conquistadors are a poor UU IMO. I usually go quickly for Rifling so don't use them. Their UB can give you super-siege, however. Spain is one case where the UB is better for war than the UU. Getting some CR3 siege and some other accuracy siege immediately is a big help. I usually think of Spain's UU as it's siege, although it sometimes takes a tech deviation to get it.

People use cuirassers (stock cuirassers) on deity (though cav is more common, not always). How could the spanish UU possibly be bad? Admittedly, it might be outshined by CR III cannons, but still.

 

[shpeka]

People use cuirassers (stock cuirassers) on deity (though cav is more common, not always). How could the spanish UU possibly be bad? Admittedly, it might be outshined by CR III cannons, but still.

I thought Cuirassiers (gunpowder based units) ignored city walls and that was the main reason they are the monsters we see.
Conquistadors would be utter crap with no siege support.

 

[Farm Boy]

Conquistadors are a tarp!

 

[TheMeInTeam]

I thought Cuirassiers (gunpowder based units) ignored city walls and that was the main reason they are the monsters we see.
Conquistadors would be utter crap with no siege support.

I thought conqs were patched so that they also ignored walls?

 

[Farm Boy]

Just like infarty!

 

[obsolete]

I thought Cuirassiers (gunpowder based units) ignored city walls and that was the main reason they are the monsters we see.

They are mounted, not gun-powdered.

 

[Iranon]

...but still gunpowder-based as the game defines it (for the purpose of ignoring walls). Both regular cuirassiers and conquistadors ignore walls.

 

[ParadigmShifter]

Well they did after the first patch

EDIT: Conqs I mean. They forgot to add the ignore walls bit in unpatched BtS.

 

[ywhtptgtfo]

Frankly, they're pretty terrible in SP. I'd say they're a "worst" candidate but probably not as bad as Panzer. In MP you do NOT want these things having a pillage party on you because in the field, spears are only ok-ish and everything else BLOWS CHUNKS. Contrast that with stock HA, which while they are odds-on against everything but spears, don't defend so hot vs swords or even axes for cost. NC have a chance to ruin someone's day in such a manner, though they are still nothing compared to say skirmishers in MP lol.

Skirmishes did ruin one of my games recently. I decided to axe rush Mansa Musa due to an early copper. Somehow, I forgot his UU is Skirmisher. Suffice to say, I abandoned that game after losing 7 axes without capturing the city. ******** UU.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Skirmishes did ruin one of my games recently. I decided to axe rush Mansa Musa due to an early copper. Somehow, I forgot his UU is Skirmisher. Suffice to say, I abandoned that game after losing 7 axes without capturing the city. ******** UU.

Try being on the other end, with 4 skirmishers or more in your territory before you have metal.

Good luck killing that with normal archers.

 

[shpeka]

...but still gunpowder-based as the game defines it (for the purpose of ignoring walls). Both regular cuirassiers and conquistadors ignore walls.

Baf, I even managed to mix up the Conquistador with the Cataphract.
Conqs seem to me like one of the best UUs in the game, having in mind that in most of my games my heaviest loses come from the Cuirassier vs Pikeman matchup (especially on hills).

 

[TheMeInTeam]

Cataphracts replace knights though, and have the oomph to fight ahead of their counter unit on the field in contemporary times. If medieval warfare didn't suck for other reasons, the cataphract would be on par with units like the redcoat, cossack, and praetorian. Unfortunately for the cataphract, medieval warfare DOES frequently suck; it takes a long time to bombard anything and all of the medieval war techs are AI favorites.

Still, in a contemporary stack vs stack war cataphracts are one of the LAST things you want attacking you, and I have seen them make a difference in some high level games, putting them soundly above the panzer.

 

[jgroth1978]

The conquistador wasn't horrible, per se, but it seemed it's time in service was too quick. I had cavalry before I knew it.

 

[Ataxerxes]

The conquistador wasn't horrible, per se, but it seemed it's time in service was too quick. I had cavalry before I knew it.

I think it partly depends upon preferred tech path. I'm very fond of Rifling and often have it before Military Tradition. If you go quick for MT Conquistador would probably be a pretty good unit. I don't regard it as a great UU, but it's far from the worst. I usually go for Cannon/Rifle wars. Upgrading trebs built with the Citadel makes it much easier. Admittedly, the Citadel itself may call for a tech deviation.

Skirmishers are a great UU. Not glamorous, but effective. They're probably in the top dozen of UU's.

 

[shpeka]

The conquistador wasn't horrible, per se, but it seemed it's time in service was too quick. I had cavalry before I knew it.

Well, this depends on the circumstances. Very often one ends up in a position to take Military Tradition by being first to Liberalism. A quick (5-10 turns) Cuirassier war will often be enough to cap one of the AIs. Conquistadors should be even better.

THEN you can upgrade to cavalry, but this is some three techs further down the tech tree. And that is usually more than 20 turns.