Would you vote for Calexit?

[Vectors]

Is it usual for the incoming president to live in the White House before he's actually sworn in?

That's not the issue, the issue is after the inauguration his family will stay in Trump Tower and they are likely going to make fat stacks of money off of the federal government.

 

[CavLancer]

Well, at least they are doing something new. Politicians never really make any money.

 

[onejayhawk]

Well, at least they are doing something new. Politicians never really make any money.

Not the honest ones. Others, not so much.

J

 

[CavLancer]

Honest ones? Well I suppose its possible.

 

[onejayhawk]

Is it usual for the incoming president to live in the White House before he's actually sworn in?

There are significant renovations planned. Several have been put off while the Obama's were in residence.

This happened before. President Truman vacated for a major reconstruction. This is much smaller scale, but President Obama did not want to put up with it. For one thing, the Oval Office is getting work that may take all year.
http://twistedsifter.com/2013/02/trumans-white-house-renovation/

J

 

[Valka D'Ur]

There are significant renovations planned. Several have been put off while the Obama's were in residence.

This happened before. President Truman vacated for a major reconstruction. This is much smaller scale, but President Obama did not want to put up with it. For one thing, the Oval Office is getting work that may take all year.
http://twistedsifter.com/2013/02/trumans-white-house-renovation/

J

Well, that makes sense. The Trudeau family are currently living in one of the other official residences because 24 Sussex needs major renovations to practically everything. Naturally the right wing has twisted this into a series of talking points that Trudeau is having it made over for him personally, and conveniently miss the point that it's the Prime Minister's official residence and some future Conservative will also likely benefit some day and not have to live in a house with inadequate heating and plumbing, and where there is asbestos in the walls.

 

[CavLancer]

That's quite a link. I was impressed with the guy relaxing sideways in the air duct. Could fit loads of Jedi in there. Any idea Jay about what the renovations will be this time?

 

[tetley]

I'm sure those renovations don't involve putting bugs everywhere to make sure everything the cabinet is doing and saying is kosher.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

I believe the Trump family want to keep their son going to the same schools in NYC that he's been going to. I think that is a valid reason to not live at the White House to be honest.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

i think it would be practical to keep the seat of government in Sac town, since the infrastructure is already there.. Why Hollywood?? that doesnt really have any purpose in my mind, to have the capital there, in the part of the country where the citizens are the citizens are the MOST out of touch with reality.. No, Sac town or San Jose, somewhere in the Bay Are, the middle of the State, close to the tech corridor and the really smart universities would be a good location i reckon.. and the sierra mountains and the nevada desert will act as a buffer to the rest of the RSA... However if my Raiders move to Vegas, we gotta gobble up Nevada as a part of our New Republic of California..I mean we should take Vegas with us for sure.. They were Bernie Sanders people anyways, they are good peeps..

He said Hollywood specifically to try and make a parody of the idea of an independent Californian nation.

herpa derp, Hollywood's gonna run the country like a Michael Bay action flick herpa derp

 

[hobbsyoyo]

The ones calling Calexit a pipe dream aren't the ones who will make it actually happen. We need to give Yes California some critical mass, and make it a reality. Then either California really can be free of the bonds of the U.S., or we can show Washington's true colors: forcing the people to remain in the union against their will.

Yeah there was kind of a war that settled that point....

 

[hobbsyoyo]

I call BS.

"If there is not sufficient or provisional ballots to tip the election"...pray tell Jay, which election might that be?

The presidential election? Great, in California there aren't four million ballots outstanding so stop counti...oh, wait. There was a congressional race on the ballot. State senate. State assembly. A dozen propositions, or more. City councilman and the mayor. County supervisor.

So, again, which is this magical election that can't be tipped that makes it okay to just not bother with the ballots?

Or was this, like so many of your "how it is" pronouncements, just something you thought sounded good at the time?

He's not wrong though. That's exactly what lots of states do. That's why Californian public media spend a lot of time telling people that their votes will be counted no matter what unless and until they are proven to be invalid. Truly other states don't work like that. I don't think Jay was saying that was a good thing either, he was just pointing out what actually happens.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

Yeah there was kind of a war that settled that point....

Perhaps only temporarily...or conditionally.

The north needed the south, and they were smart enough to know it. The RSSA (Remaining Stupid States of America) firmly believe they would be "better off" if all the "******* states" weren't "dragging them down." That creates a much different dynamic, and as long as they keep their recto cranial inversions in place the union could be peacefully dissolved.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

He's not wrong though. That's exactly what lots of states do. That's why Californian public media spend a lot of time telling people that their votes will be counted no matter what unless and until they are proven to be invalid. Truly other states don't work like that. I don't think Jay was saying that was a good thing either, he was just pointing out what actually happens.

I have no doubt that plenty of states are throwing away ballots...but the attributing it to "we assessed the number and they won't make up the difference" is still wrong because there's always something that is running close. Those states don't care if the difference could be made up, they are just run by people who understand that absentee ballots tend to skew democratic so they throw them out under any pretext that they can get away with.

 

[hobbsyoyo]

Perhaps only temporarily...or conditionally.

The north needed the south, and they were smart enough to know it. The RSSA (Remaining Stupid States of America) firmly believe they would be "better off" if all the "******* states" weren't "dragging them down." That creates a much different dynamic, and as long as they keep their recto cranial inversions in place the union could be peacefully dissolved.

The North actually didn't need the South for anything. Literally nothing. Agriculture in the North greatly exceeded the output of the South - even before the war. You have to remember that the North wasn't nearly as developed back then so there was a lot more land devoted to farming. And Illinois was and is fertile as hell and it was part of the North. A huge majority of the manufacturing infrastructure and rail links were in the North as well. The Northern states could have very easily lived on without the South but actively chose not to let that happen.

Then the North didn't just beat the South - they curbed stomped it and destroyed everything of value their soldiers could reach in some areas. The South was razed, don't let anyone ever mis-remember that.


This is why I argue so passionately against Calexit. To even tempt that fate is irresponsible to millions of people in this state.

Then to re-iterate the moral perspective on the argument, a lot of poor people in the rest of the country would be materially worse off without our tax dollars.

I have no doubt that plenty of states are throwing away ballots...but the attributing it to "we assessed the number and they won't make up the difference" is still wrong because there's always something that is running close. Those states don't care if the difference could be made up, they are just run by people who understand that absentee ballots tend to skew democratic so they throw them out under any pretext that they can get away with.

oh I see

 

[hobbsyoyo]

And before someone says 'but King Cotton!' -
The North could have imported it from India just like Britain began to do before the war. It would have been more expensive but the North could afford it or turned over more farmland to produce it than they already did. I can't think of anything else of material value that the South had in more abundance than the North. I could be wrong on some individual accounts but nothing that would prove that the North 'needed' the South.

 

[Timsup2nothin]

And before someone says 'but King Cotton!' -
The North could have imported it from India just like Britain began to do before the war. It would have been more expensive but the North could afford it or turned over more farmland to produce it than they already did. I can't think of anything else of material value that the South had in more abundance than the North. I could be wrong on some individual accounts but nothing that would prove that the North 'needed' the South.

Problem is that the independent south would have replaced India as the source of cotton for the British textile industry, and the nascent US textile industry (which was the backbone of industrialization at the time) would have been crushed.

 

[Hygro]

Does Google prefer the protection of the United States or the power it can wield through an independent California?

 

[Farm Boy]

I don't know. What have large groups of wealthy people done before when their interests diverge from the less affluent?

It's an interesting question Hygro. The Singaporean and one of the Greeks don't seem to share your optimism on the coastal American economies sharing in prosperity rather than concentrating relative share. And I think they may grok cultural disconnect from and economic inferiority to American economic might(selectively, but of course) than a leftcoaster?

Can you explain to me how the adequate infrastructure you discussed earlier is materially different to success than the infrastructure present or possible in Detroit, Chicago, St. Louis, Peoria, etc? Run some Google Fiber and suddenly business is possible, automation's wrack is ablated, and competitiveness and purpose are gained?

 

[tetley]

Yeah there was kind of a war that settled that point....

Did you even read? If you are going to "argue passionately against Calexit", then at least do so on the basis of facts.

The people of California need to make clear that they do not want to be part of the union. The California state legislature needs to ratify Calexit. Then the onus falls squarely on Washington: either our " democracy" gives the people what they want, or it is Washington who is forcing California to stay against their will. It is Washington telling California what they want--not Californians who get to speak for themselves.