[WTP] Quick questions

Discussion in 'Civ4Col - We The People' started by Nightinggale, Feb 7, 2020.

  1. Arkona

    Arkona Chieftain

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2020
    Messages:
    28
    i have some question all are for the plains branch
    1 is it wad that some times in the loading screen a 2 quotes at a time ?
    2 is it wad that a trek can be transported by a conestago ?
    3 is it wad that mangroves a grown on a big river ?
    4 if i have text bug should i post them direct in kendons threat?
     
    Last edited: May 8, 2022
  2. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2011
    Messages:
    8,502
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Stuttgart, Germany
    Never saw that happen. :dunno:

    No. But it should already be corrected in one of my commits.
    (I have no idea if that commit was actually merged to "Plains" though.)

    See here, in my own version everything is correct:
    (Maybe you simply do not have the most recent updates.)

    upload_2022-5-8_17-10-46.jpeg

    Yes. But "Plains" is also not fully balanced. It has not even been fully implemented either. It is "work in progress".
    I never cared about fully balancing it, since some implementations are not yet even fully done either.

    1) The "New Cost Movement System" has broken Pathfinding and it has not been repaired yet (alternatively the "New Cost Movement System" could be removed).
    2) Maps and MapScripts have not yet been adjusted to the New Terrains, Terrain Features, ...
    3) The Streams Feature is not yet considered by Maps and MapScripts either (but that is also not that dramatic either)
    4) There is a MapScript that can generate "Large Rivers" but I am not sure what the status of it really is.
    ...

    I simply do not care about balancing a branch that I do not consider yet to be fully implemented. :dunno:
    (It would not be released anyways, so why invest effort for balancing it then.)

    Probably most efficient way, so yes. :thumbsup:

    ----

    Summary:

    "Plains" is currently in a state of "Modder's Nirvana" to be honest. :dunno:
    There is stuff that needs to be finished but nobody tracks and coordinates the activities to do so.
    Also there are fixes, updates, improvements in various branches that have not yet been merged to "Plains".

    In other words:

    "Plains" is not yet finished and thus also purposely not published.
    Thus also do not expect it to be as polished as a published branch.

    To be honest:

    There are times where I considered "Plains" to be my biggest failure and I often regret to have started it.
    It was simply too big and too ambitious for a mod with as little modders as we still have ...
    Maybe it will be published at some point ... maybe not ... maybe only parts of it ... I do not know.
     
    Last edited: May 8, 2022
  3. Arkona

    Arkona Chieftain

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2020
    Messages:
    28
    to 1 i have screen shots of the double quotes i can post the bugs channel.
    In my opinion as player i really like plains and think you and the others have made a nice job it is not finish but i think it brings the mod to the next step.
     
  4. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2011
    Messages:
    8,502
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Stuttgart, Germany
    Please do so. :thumbsup:
     
  5. BaneFire

    BaneFire Warlord

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2011
    Messages:
    279
    Gender:
    Female
    Hello,
    What decides whether I capture a native city or not? Sometimes I do, sometimes I just raze it to 1 pop. With the bigger ones I'd like to conquer it.
    Thank you
     
  6. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2011
    Messages:
    8,502
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Stuttgart, Germany
    Native Villages are not captured by Europeans in Civ4Col.

    The code does not allow it because the game would not offer any game mechanics for it.
    What should a European do with a Native Village? (Considering current game mechanics.)

    Also it would conflict with current game logic and configuration.
    (e.g. The Native Buildings and Native Units are not valid for Europeans and vice versa.)

    So if you want to change that you need to implement new game mechanics for captured Native Settlements.
    (That will require new code but of course also changes in e.g. XML, Python and graphics.)

    I have never seen a Native Village being captured by Europeans. :confused:
    They are supposed to always be razed if conquered by Europeans.

    If that is not the case anymore, we would have a bug.
    Which release do you play? Official public release 3.0.1 or something else?
     
  7. BaneFire

    BaneFire Warlord

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2011
    Messages:
    279
    Gender:
    Female
    Official release as far as I can tell! Maybe I just misremembered or something, but I'm sure I took Tenochtitlan (because I renamed it to Mexico City!). I will keep an eye out next time. Or perhaps it is something to do with the Aztecs specifically?
     
    raystuttgart likes this.
  8. BaneFire

    BaneFire Warlord

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2011
    Messages:
    279
    Gender:
    Female
    mexico city.png
    Apologies for double replying but I managed to find the save. You can see here - Mexico, founded 1492. This was in the RAR America Huge map, starting as Spain, where Tenochtitlan is a pre-placed Aztec city.
     
  9. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2011
    Messages:
    8,502
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Stuttgart, Germany
    Thanks for the info. :thumbsup:

    Strange. Never seen that happen in "randomized" games (random Map or game generated by MapSript). :confused:
    And as I said the code should explicitly prevent a Native Settlement to be captured by a European and vice versa.
    (Unless I am gravely mistaken and completely remember the code wrong.)

    However MapMakers can configure lots of strange stuff in Scenario Maps by Worldbuilder.
    e.g.
    • You could also give yourself Units which you are normally not allowed to have.
    • You could also give Units Professions which they are normally not allowed to have.
    • You could also place Terrain Features or Bonus Resources on Plots where they are normally not allowed.
    • ...

    So you might e.g. create a "European Colony" and give it to the Natives as new owner.
    However, I have never tested what happens then if you conquer it ... :dunno:

    ----

    Summary:

    Scenario Maps are not "normal" game rules.
    The Map Maker can actually create his own rules in his map.
    (Which might however also cause bugs with the core mod.)
     
    Last edited: May 10, 2022
    BaneFire likes this.
  10. BigWilly'sBurgers5665

    BigWilly'sBurgers5665 Chieftain

    Joined:
    May 14, 2022
    Messages:
    2
    Hello everybody! I just have a quick question on the Archbishop's mechanics, and I have looked throughout the forum and haven't been able to find an answer. Every time you use the Archbishop to raise relations with your king or another European leader, the cost to do so goes up. I was curious if there is a cap on how much it could go to.
     
  11. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2011
    Messages:
    8,502
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Stuttgart, Germany
    No, there is no cap implemented.
    Theoretically it could rise "infinitely".

    I actually never expected that the feature was used that much.
    I considered it more of a feature that only in special use cases mad sense.

    Use Cases I had in mind:
    A) This stupid European AI is really angry and might declare War on me - which I currently really do not want - so I rather appease it
    B) My King really is angry, so I rather try to get him happy - so he is less harsh in tax raises and more generous in events

    But as I said, I never expected it to be used more than a couple of times in a game - I have played games I never used that feature once.
    (Especially once it gets expensive, I do not consider it to be worth paying the Archbishop to raise relations.)
     
    BigWilly'sBurgers5665 likes this.
  12. BigWilly'sBurgers5665

    BigWilly'sBurgers5665 Chieftain

    Joined:
    May 14, 2022
    Messages:
    2
    Thanks for the quick reply! I didn't realize the malus you get every time you ask the king for troops, so I racked up a lot of negative relation with him. I have using the archbishop to claw back some of the relationship. You live and you learn I guess!
     
  13. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2011
    Messages:
    8,502
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Stuttgart, Germany
    The mod was purposely built so there is a lot to learn. :)
    Because for me that is what makes a game interesting.
     
  14. BaneFire

    BaneFire Warlord

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2011
    Messages:
    279
    Gender:
    Female
    Does anyone have any suggestions on how to deal with pirates? It seems like they can spawn up to 4 Pirate Frigates by 1600, meanwhile I am lucky if i can afford more than one Corvette. And this Corvette can only do a 30% victory against a pirate ship, so if he fails he's dead...
     
  15. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2011
    Messages:
    8,502
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Stuttgart, Germany
    If you feel that it is balanced a bit too harsh, you can also adjust the balancing settings in GlobalDefinesAlt.xml.

    Increasing "MIN_ROUND_PIRATES", will let them appear later in game.
    Decreasing "BASE_CHANCE_PIRATES" will let them appear less often.
    Increasing "TIMER_PIRATES" to a higher value, will increase the time between spawns.

    Spoiler :

    Code:
        <Define>
           <DefineName>MIN_ROUND_PIRATES</DefineName>
           <iDefineIntVal>100</iDefineIntVal>
       </Define>
       <Define>
           <DefineName>BASE_CHANCE_PIRATES</DefineName>
           <iDefineIntVal>20</iDefineIntVal>
       </Define>
       <Define>
           <DefineName>PRICE_PIRATES</DefineName>
           <iDefineIntVal>2000</iDefineIntVal>
       </Define>
       <Define>
           <DefineName>TIMER_PIRATES</DefineName>
           <iDefineIntVal>20</iDefineIntVal>
       </Define>
    


    --------

    Generally "Pirate Frigates" are supposed to be more of a "try to run and hide" in early game instead of a "attack heads on and fight" feature.
    So you are not necessarily supposed to easily win against them with your first Combat Ships.

    By the way, when you see "Privateers", then those are from the other European Players, not the "Barbarian Civ".
    The other European Players will go Pirating as well relatively early on some times.

    In midgame, once you build your Navy, those Privateers are little more than XP givers for your Navy to prepare for the King's Fleet.
    (But yeah, they may be annoying some of your Trade Ships, Fishing and Whaling Boats if you are not careful.)

    --------

    Otherwise use this tactic:

    Get a Ship like e.g. Corvette or Frigate once they show up, or even earlier.
    Scout as much of the Map as possible and collect all "Water Goodies" to get some XP.
    Only once your Corvette has enough Promotions, start attacking the Pirates.

    Don't waste "Water Goodies" for Trade Ships.
    (The Combat Ships will profit more from it on the long term.)

    --------

    If you invest all your money just into other stuff, you might of course have a problem. But yeah, it is tempting not to prepare. :)
    But don't worry, you are not the first player who was caught unprepared by "Pirate Frigates" or "Privateers" showing up.
    It is one of these features that is supposed to prevent the player from being lazy and casually focussing just on economy.
     
  16. BaneFire

    BaneFire Warlord

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2011
    Messages:
    279
    Gender:
    Female
    Makes lots of sense. This is a more technical question and may just be me being obtuse, but how do I deal with the specific problem of my ships having to travel further to reach Europe? As in, it takes two or three turns from port to Europe, so they spend turns sitting like dead ducks in the water. I set my corvettes on sentry mode, but as far as I can tell it isn't enough, as pirates can move from out of the fog of war to attack my trade ships. So how would I go about avoiding this.
     
  17. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2011
    Messages:
    8,502
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Stuttgart, Germany
    If the distance to Europe Travel Plots is longer then send your Combat Ships as Convoy Guard Ships with them until they reach the Europe Travel Plot.
    It requires more micro-management of course than just putting your corvette on stationary "sentry" mode", but such a "Convoy" it is safer for your ships as well.

    Basically, join the Units to a group until you reach the Europe Travel Plot.
    Once the Ship can sail safely to Europe split again so your Combat Ship may guard another one.

    The mod is simply not supposed to play "casual". It wants to keep you on your toes the complete time - especially in early game. :)
    There may be some micro-management of Units involved for doing so because automatization will often not give results good enough.
     
    BaneFire likes this.
  18. Evil Beejeebers

    Evil Beejeebers Warlord

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2008
    Messages:
    139
    Location:
    China
    Who plays with the smaller city radius setting?

    I feel the mod is balanced around the larger radius.
     
  19. raystuttgart

    raystuttgart Civ4Col Modder Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2011
    Messages:
    8,502
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Stuttgart, Germany
    It is. :)

    1-Plot-Radius will simply not exhaust features like Health, Happiness, ...
    Thus 2-Plot-Radius will feel more like "This is the way it was built for".

    The new branches add even more features that only truly feel "fitted", when the player plays with 2-Plot-Radius and on Gigantic Maps.
    With 1-Plot-Radius and on Small Maps it will feel like you will miss out a lot of additional content because it will not really impact gameplay that much.

    Both gamestyles are however possible. :dunno:
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2022
  20. Honor

    Honor Immortal

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2005
    Messages:
    748
    Location:
    Celo
    Also, I don't know if this is specifically true for the current implementation or not, but asking for troops from the King raises the REF by a proportionate amount, as well, so you end up fighting as many troops as you get from the King. Not a very good idea if it is not early to mid game where you are rushing the Europeans.
     

Share This Page