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Your opinion of the Teacher's Union

It would also end discrimination protections for sexual orientation.
Firefighters honor guard blocked from the capital.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgiFcxDemPI

http://www.channel3000.com/politics/27037991/detail.html

According to court records, Judge Daniel Moeser has issued a temporary restraining order to reopen the Capitol until a trial court can schedule a hearing. The order says the building must be open to the public during business hours and when "governmental matters, such as hearings, listening sessions, or court arguments are being conducted."

The courts ordered open but apparently the police are still not letting people in.
 
It seems it really was about the money:
Wisconsin Officials Rush to Walker-Proof Their Benefits
March 3, 2011 10:35 A.M.
By Christian Schneider

Just days after Gov. Scott Walker introduced his budget repair bill, public-sector-union leaders said they would accept Walker’s financial demands as long as he kept collective bargaining intact. However, in the time bought by the flight of 14 Democratic state senators, local governments have been quickly adopting new contracts in advance of Walker’s bill becoming law. In effect, the unions are spraying their benefits with Walker repellent. (In fact, an investigative report shows that there may have been collusion between the missing state senators and City of Madison officials to delay the bill so contracts could be signed.)

Three days after the governor introduced his budget, the Milwaukee Area Technical College ratified a new three-year contract that preserves no-cost pensions and contains no layoffs for its teachers (average pay: $95,000.) Union leaders called an emergency meeting at 5:00 p.m. on a Friday night to vote on their new contract — yet their president said that had “nothing to do” with Walker’s budget-repair bill.

State employees tried to pull a similar trick in December. In a Hindenburg-like fiasco, Democrats tried to use the pre-Walker lame-duck session to pass state union-worker contracts with microscopic concessions. To get their deciding vote in the assembly, they even pulled a legislator out of jail, where he was serving time for drunk driving. The contracts unexpectedly failed by one vote in the senate when the Democrats’ leader inexplicably switched his position at the last minute.

Also before Walker took office, the Milwaukee Public School board quickly adopted a four-year teacher contract that runs through 2013. It contains pay increases of 2.5 to 3 percent, and requires teachers to begin contributing to their health insurance for the first time — although in amounts well short of what Walker is proposing (1 percent of salary for single coverage, 2 percent for family). The contract also extends health benefits to domestic partners, which will offset a good portion of the $50 million in savings the district expects to realize from the teachers’ contributions.

For other school districts that ram through generous contracts, the results could be disastrous: Walker just announced a budget that reduces state aid to local school districts by $834 million; much of that cut was going to be offset by teachers’ increased benefit contributions, but districts that capitulate to their teachers won’t have that option. Instead of having a full complement of teachers paying slightly more for their benefits, they will have fewer teachers, but teachers with jewel-encrusted retirement and health packages. Then they will blame Scott Walker for the massive layoffs their districts will see.

The president of the state’s largest teachers’ union has already set the stage for a “Blame Walker” campaign. “There’s no way that school districts in this state are going to be able to address this kind of budget shortfall without layoffs and program cuts that will damage the quality of education,” said WEAC’s Mary Bell on Tuesday.

Yet many of her bargaining units are trying to guarantee as many layoffs as possible. In rushing to the negotiating table, teachers’ union leaders are picking their own bank accounts over kids. This should be no surprise to anyone in Wisconsin whose child sat at home for a few days when teachers walked off the job over a week ago.

This rush to ratify new contracts is why Scott Walker didn’t take the union leaders up on their “deal” almost two weeks ago — there’s no way the AFSCME and AFL-CIO big shots could control the contract machinations of over 1,000 local governments. While protesters roared that their objection to Walker’s plan wasn’t “about the money,” their bargaining units were working furiously behind the scenes to grab as much cash as possible before Walker dropped the guillotine.

Furthermore, these new contracts demonstrate why declaring public sector “collective bargaining” to be sacrosanct is so preposterous. In places like the City of Madison, there’s very little “bargaining” happening. Public employees and elected officials are sitting on the same side of the table. The only actual negotiating taking place is from city employees deciding which Applebee’s they’ll crash to celebrate their fat new contracts.
 
No DinoDoc it was about taking away your constitutional right to form a group to colletively defend your position.

Oh, and quoting an article without posting a link (or at least saying where you got it) is the height of bad manners. It also makes it look like you know the article is BS but are doing your hardest to hide the fact because it follows your side in the arguement. Post a link asap.
 
No DinoDoc it was about taking away your constitutional right to form a group to colletively defend your position.
There is no constitutional right at stake. Nearly half the states in the country all restrict the collective bargaining ability of public unions to one extent or another. In fact the Federal government places much more in the way of restrictions than even Walker is proposing.
Oh, and quoting an article without posting a link (or at least saying where you got it)
This stinks of you not having anything meaningful to say wrt the points raised and an inability to use google.
 
There is no constitutional right at stake. Nearly half the states in the country all restrict the collective bargaining ability of public unions to one extent or another. In fact the Federal government places much more in the way of restrictions than even Walker is proposing.

So your right to free association does not allow you to form a group to defend your position. What is it then? A right which doesn't allow you to associate freely? It's unconstitutional, no doubt about it.

This stinks of you not having anything meaningful to say wrt the points raised and an inability to use google.

And your continued refusal to post a link suggest confirm (yeah suggest is too weak in this instance) that a) you are pig-ignorant and b) you know you're wrong but don't want to admit it. Post the link or forever be branded liar.
 
2 things.

First, the article is horribly biased. Just reading it will tell you that it probably comes from a source that is biased as well. But it is quite poor form to not provide a link.

Second. So what? This article tells us nothing, other than the unions are trying their best to protect themselves should this law get passed. Did you think they would just sit back and let the Governor walk all over them? Why should they. If you were in their position, you would be doing everything in your power to benefit your members. Locking in contracts before this new law quite possibly goes into effect is a good strategy to lock in your pay and benefits for at least a few more years.

Hardly surprising (or really controversial) that they are doing this.
 
Couple more things:

Since DinoDoc is hesitant to post the source, here it is: http://www.nationalreview.com/corne...lker-proof-their-benefits-christian-schneider

From the article: “Christian Schneider is a senior fellow at the Wisconsin Policy Research Institute.”

From Wiki:
Wisconsin Policy Research Institute is a non-profit conservative think tank advocating free market economics in the state of Wisconsin. The organization is based in Hartland, Wisconsin, a suburb of Milwaukee.
It has played a prominent role in the development of the State's school voucher program and has formulated recommendations for state prison policy.[1]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wisconsin_Policy_Research_Institute

On the Source:

National Review (NR) is a biweekly magazine founded by the late author William F. Buckley, Jr. in 1955 and based in New York City. It describes itself as "America's most widely read and influential magazine and web site for conservative news, commentary, and opinion."[2] Although the print version of the magazine is available online to subscribers, the free content on the website is essentially a separate publication.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Review

So… yeah.
 
Since DinoDoc is ...
clearly uninterested in providing fodder for osmeone more interested in ad hominem retorts against a source rather than what it says. My compliments though on having better search-fu than Brian though.
 
clearly uninterested in providing fodder for osmeone more interested in ad hominem retorts against a source rather than what it says. My compliments though on having better search-fu than Brian though.

More accurately: DinoDoc is uninterested in proper reasoned debate, just pushing his viewpoint down our throats in whatever underhanded way he can think up of with his limited brain power.

Oh, and it is not my place to do your work for you DinoDoc. IF you want to be taken seriously in any sort of arguement a) properly reference your arguements, i.e. you'll never see me or anyone else make an arguement of fact without properly giving references - by doing the opposite you are placing yourself on the same level as holocaust deniers (think about it) - and b) don't throw a hissy fit a toddler would be ashamed of when called on it.
 
...you are placing yourself on the same level as holocaust deniers (think about it)
Hyperbole (see what I did there. A link for your viewing pleasure.) isn't the best way to approach things if you are truely interested in a reasoned debate. You misunderstand me though if you presume shame over not having linked what should have been clear to any 3rd grader was an editorial I didn't claim to have written. :)

@ BS: Second. So what? This article tells us nothing, other than the unions are trying their best to protect themselves should this law get passed. Did you think they would just sit back and let the Governor walk all over them?

For other school districts that ram through generous contracts, the results could be disastrous: Walker just announced a budget that reduces state aid to local school districts by $834 million; much of that cut was going to be offset by teachers’ increased benefit contributions, but districts that capitulate to their teachers won’t have that option. Instead of having a full complement of teachers paying slightly more for their benefits, they will have fewer teachers, but teachers with jewel-encrusted retirement and health packages.

I'm also interested in the possible collusion between Madison city officials and the fleeing State Senators.
 
Well I've just lost all interest in arguing with you, for the simple fact that no matter how wrong you are (and boy is the comparison of you with holocaust deniers both apt and accurate, both of ye are prone to ignoring evidence, concocting evidence to try and cover your arguements, going off on a screed when found out, and finally accusing others of your own failings). But as I said I've no interest in arguing with the likes of you, so I am going to ignore everything you post from now on (it'll probably help both my sanity and blood pressure).

Enjoy Fantasy land though, won't you.

Moderator Action: That comment was unnecessary.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889
 
For other school districts that ram through generous contracts, the results could be disastrous: Walker just announced a budget that reduces state aid to local school districts by $834 million; much of that cut was going to be offset by teachers’ increased benefit contributions, but districts that capitulate to their teachers won’t have that option. Instead of having a full complement of teachers paying slightly more for their benefits, they will have fewer teachers, but teachers with jewel-encrusted retirement and health packages.

Biased portions underlined.

Besides the obvious bias in the writing style, there is a bigger and more hidden bias here as well. It is the governor who is putting the local communities in this position, not the teachers. He is the one forcing the cuts in funding. He tries to justify this by saying that the teachers will pay for it instead of the state, but that is backfiring based on these contracts. This opinion piece is painting only a partial picture of what is really going on, and attempting to make it easier to place all of the blame on the teachers (who are just trying to maintain what they already have) instead of where it really falls.
 
http://www2.hernandotoday.com/content/2010/oct/17/ha-fdrs-warning-public-employee-unions-a-no-no/

Roosevelt reasoned:

"... Meticulous attention should be paid to the special relationships and obligations of public servants to the public itself and to the government. All Government employees should realize that the process of collective bargaining, as usually understood, cannot be transplanted into the public service. It has its distinct and insurmountable limitations ... The very nature and purposes of Government make it impossible for ... officials ... to bind the employer ... The employer is the whole people, who speak by means of laws enacted by their representatives ...

"Particularly, I want to emphasize my conviction that militant tactics have no place in the functions of any organization of government employees. Upon employees in the federal service rests the obligation to serve the whole people ... This obligation is paramount ... A strike of public employees manifests nothing less than an intent ... to prevent or obstruct ... Government ... Such action, looking toward the paralysis of Government ... is unthinkable and intolerable."

Now I have no idea on the source and could grab another link in Google if this one is too biased but I guess my question is

What do unions do nowadays. Why do public employees need to be a union?

If someone could answer these two questions I would gladly go against Walker.
 
Besides the obvious bias in the writing style,
I never claimed the author didn't have an ax to grind.
there is a bigger and more hidden bias here as well. It is the governor who is putting the local communities in this position, not the teachers.
The State is broke in part because of the generous contracts in comparison to the private sector.
He is the one forcing the cuts in funding.
Being billions in debt is what is forcing a cut in funding across State government. Raming through no cost health and low cost pension contracts in the face of that doesn't seem like a prudent move on the part of the school districts.
that is backfiring based on these contracts.
To the detriment of the school districts that signed them.
This opinion piece is painting only a partial picture of what is really going on,
What do you see going on here other than a governor dealing with a missive deficit trying to rebalance his books while a) getting the State out of the union dues collecting business and b) attempting to rebalance the political power scale between taxpayers and unions back toward the taxpayers.
 
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