Zimbabwe for VP

[KlHannibal2]

The initial idea was to just give only one wildlife and that's it, then I thought about adding a chance of spreading to adjacent unimproved forest/jungle tiles (and adjacent only) as a sort of reward for not improving tiles with a lumbermill and choose to preserve nature instead.
I didn't have maximization strategies in mind when I devised it, in the sense of choosing as first plot the one with the most forest/jungle tiles around so to maximize spreading possibilities; it was not the point and it isn't worth the effort of coding it imo.
From an economic point of view lumbermill should be still the more convenient improvement because its construction hence its yields are a certain outcome depending on the player's decision making (you send a worker there to build it) while wildlife diffusion is as exogenous as it should be (depending on a random draw). So strategically speaking you can choose to maximize wildlife resource diffusion but still it would be a less optimal choice than having carpets of lumbermills as it is in reality (destruction of Amazon rainforest enters the chat).
However one can technically exploit the reforestation mod to put forests/jungles next to a wildlife and affect the resource spread more directly.

Thinking about it again, I quite like the current implementation. It forces you to plan ahead to max your wildlife. Cut down/improve single forest tiles and leave larger forests untouched. It feels like being a curator of the land.
I played a bit and like the civ. A lot of bonuses from diverse resources/terrain. This allows you to work with any land except too much water. It also does not force you into a specific pantheon or tech path, save for revealing most resources early. This can delay your science since you would not beeline for science buildings. The zimbabwe castle seens very strong for science.

Overall, I favor authority into fealty. Authority for the border pop yields and fealty to boost your defense and get more science from UB1. Also, you want to fight a lot to train up your UU1. Later, imperialism can be a thing as you want garrisons everywhere and you have the wildlife monopoly to boost.

Overall, this policy setup guides Zimbabwe towards domination. This is interesting since they have no significant combat bonus or direct yields from fighting. On the other hand, most of their bonuses scale well in a wide empire.
In the other hand, science can be a thing if the UB1 scinece from city CS is enough to make a difference.
Pretty unique feel to play.

 

[Anarcomu]

@jarcast2 you should bold the differences with base building/unit, it is hard to figure out what effect your uniques add.
Great Civ by the way, I'll definitely try it

 

[gwennog]

However one can technically exploit the reforestation mod to put forests/jungles next to a wildlife and affect the resource spread more directly.

With the latest version of Reforestation (v.5), the AI plants forests/jungles very regularly. I'm curious to try it with Zimbabwe to see how it will work.

 

[jarcast2]

Little update online.
Now the UA production bonus scale also with game speed, so x1.5 at Epic, and x3 at Marathon (I forgot about that).

 

[Anarcomu]

Isn't the UA bonus a per turn bonus ? In which case it doesn't warrant a speed scaling

 

[jarcast2]

Isn't the UA bonus a per turn bonus ? In which case it doesn't warrant a speed scaling

The production cost of buildings changes with game speed (see table in my previous post) so in marathon and epic the bonus are less effective in relative terms because buildings cost more production.

 

[Captain Carrot]

The production cost of buildings changes with game speed (see table in my previous post) so in marathon and epic the bonus are less effective in relative terms because buildings cost more production.

By that metric, every single yield is less effective on lower speeds. Which is what a lower speed does, by definition - everything costs more and the per-turn yields are unchanged, so that the time to build (grow/research/adopt/etc) something is increased. What you should be evaluating is the relative worth of your bonus to regular per-turn sources of production, which don't scale with game speed, so neither should yours.

cost / prod = time
cost / (prod + bonus_prod) = Zimbabwe_time
1.5 * cost / prod = 1.5 * time
1.5 * cost / (prod + bonus_prod) = 1.5 * Zimbabwe_time
bonus_prod/prod and Zimbabwe_time/time remain constant for all game speeds.

 

[jarcast2]

By that metric, every single yield is less effective on lower speeds. Which is what a lower speed does, by definition - everything costs more and the per-turn yields are unchanged, so that the time to build (grow/research/adopt/etc) something is increased. What you should be evaluating is the relative worth of your bonus to regular per-turn sources of production, which don't scale with game speed, so neither should yours.

cost / prod = time
cost / (prod + bonus_prod) = Zimbabwe_time
1.5 * cost / prod = 1.5 * time
1.5 * cost / (prod + bonus_prod) = 1.5 * Zimbabwe_time
bonus_prod/prod and Zimbabwe_time/time remain constant for all game speeds.

I see. If it's unnecessary then I will revert to previous version. :V

 

[KlHannibal2]

I'm getting close to scientific theory, so I used IGE to sneak preview the birds. I rushed the UB2 in all cities with IGE. I got the correct number of birds, but they always spawned in existing forests or jungles, even if they were far away from the city. There was not a single new forest ir jungle created to accomodate the birds near the corresponding city.

I will play on to see if this bug also occurs during normal play.

 

[Anarcomu]

Just a question regarding the placing of cattle (UU's ability) and the case there is a resource below : does it forbid the use of the ability, or does it do nothing instead ? I assume that the latter doesn't consume the ability either, is it right ?

 

[jarcast2]

Just a question regarding the placing of cattle (UU's ability) and the case there is a resource below : does it forbid the use of the ability, or does it do nothing instead ? I assume that the latter doesn't consume the ability either, is it right ?

It's written in the info in the first page: the unit cannot do the action if there is a resource on the plot (including those not yet revealed like coal, aluminum etc.) so if you click nothing happens and the action is not consumed.

 

[Anarcomu]

I wondered if it would be greyed out. It is not then, it just do nothing.

 

[gwennog]

Hi Jarcast, this is just an idea for forests with the Wildlife improvement, you could use the fish birds by placing a worthless dummy resource and giving color to the seagulls to make them colored birds. The improved forests would thus be easily identifiable and it could be pretty.
On the Louisiana mod, there is a Shrimp under the improvement and in the forest it looks like this:

 

[KlHannibal2]

Hi Jarcast, this is just an idea for forests with the Wildlife improvement, you could use the fish birds by placing a worthless dummy resource and giving color to the seagulls to make them colored birds. The improved forests would thus be easily identifiable and it could be pretty.
On the Louisiana mod, there is a Shrimp under the improvement and in the forest it looks like this:
View attachment 678117

The bird's icon is pretty already. It would be great if a similar colorful bird could be seen on the map.

 

[gwennog]

For this part of the UA "Cities gain Production from unique improved Resources nearby, scaling with Era.", a pillaged resource give always the production bonus, Is this expected?

And something seems to count incorrectly. For a new city I have a +1 Production Bonus but nothing improved in the working range :

Spoiler 3 tiles around City :

 

[gwennog]

The start is powerful, very supported by the UA. My neighbor is Shaka Zulu, I play Progress, he, authority and I don't tremble behind my borders. I have walls quite early and more than troops than usual. I really appreciate .

 

[jarcast2]

I wondered if it would be greyed out. It is not then, it just do nothing.

You simply cannot click on it, the button is visible but greyed out and not clickable (the unit is a Tercio because the ability is kept on upgrade if not used up).

Hi Jarcast, this is just an idea for forests with the Wildlife improvement, you could use the fish birds by placing a worthless dummy resource and giving color to the seagulls to make them colored birds. The improved forests would thus be easily identifiable and it could be pretty.
On the Louisiana mod, there is a Shrimp under the improvement and in the forest it looks like this:
View attachment 678117

I'm already using white seagulls from fish resource.

I should edit the model somehow to give color to the birds but honestly I don't know how to do it.

For this part of the UA "Cities gain Production from unique improved Resources nearby, scaling with Era.", a pillaged resource give always the production bonus, Is this expected?

Yes, it is intended.

And something seems to count incorrectly. For a new city I have a +1 Production Bonus but nothing improved in the working range :

View attachment 678127

Spoiler 3 tiles around City :

View attachment 678126

Check with IGE if the city is settled on a resource that is not yet revealed.
I should add a futher check for whether the player has the tech to reveal the resource.
I will add it if there is another update-requiring bug.

Edit: screw it, update 1.4 is online.

 

[hokath]

I'm already using white seagulls from fish resource.
View attachment 678144
I should edit the model somehow to give color to the birds but honestly I don't know how to do it.

The feathers returned, as it was foretold!

 

[KlHannibal2]

I tested the bird building now without IGE. I built them in most cities and in a way that only one of them finishes per turn. I found some wierd stuff going on.

First one completed in the capital. It spawned 3 birds right away on unimproved jungle. They formed a triangle. Next turn, 2 more birds appeared next to the triangle.

The wildlife description says it gets +1 culture if next to another wildlife. I was getting +1 culture PER adjacent wildlife.

In the other cities, only 1 bird per city appeared upon UB completion. But ONLY if there was an unimproved forest or jungle. Never did the UB create a new jungle or forest, even if there was space. These cities just missed out on the bird.

Also, birds can spawn on a partially completed improvement in forest.

 

[gwennog]

I should edit the model somehow to give color to the birds but honestly I don't know how to do it.

Cool, I haven't arrived at the building yet, I hadn't seen it. For the model, I don't know how to use Unpacked Dragon either, but you should ask to @adan_eslavo or @N.Core.