2014 FIFA World Cup Brazil Thread

I don't recall anyone saying he shouldn't have been booked.
:rolleyes:
Yes, Brazil fouled more, but it was pretty balanced. And no fouls on any Colombian player, all of whom left the field walking and unharmed, can be compared to what was done to Neymar. But reading your post it's as if it was only Brazil fouling, and not Colombia.

Colombians can rightfully complain about the referee, who did a terrible job. But of course he ended up being far worse for Brazil, with our best player (by a gigantic margin) ending up with a broken back. Considering that the ref didn't really change the result of the game, because Brazil did uncontroversially outplay Colombia, it's clear Neymar was the biggest victim.
Oh please, when I was young the Brazilians played the best and the prettiest football around by a comfortable margin, in the past decade under Dunga and Scolari they've made a point of kicking teams off the pitch whenever things didn't go their way.

Read Zico's article on the Guardian. And please, stop implying that anyone who doesn't see things your way suffers from a mental problem, I don't want you to descend to ReindeerThistle's depths.
Btw, very cool video message by Neymar :thumbsup:

He seems like a polite person, at least in that video. Hopefully he will recover :)
Yes, he and Messi are both very likeable.
42M spanish speaking Argentinians iirc?
More or less, but there's such a rich vocabulary for cursing here… the Mesoamericans to which you've been recently exposed have a short supply of abuse. Ask your Queen for a small glossary.
Thanks Luiz, you helped me to find out the best way to describe Germany's team: 11 Hulks knowing how to play football.
:rotfl: Do you think Neuer is handsome?
 
The comments to Zico's article are quite interesting. The British seem to have the same feeling as anyone I talk to.

I think, a lot of people would be happy to see Brazil lose and Scolari to disappear from the football scene. Maybe then, we will see a renaissance of the beautiful Brazilian teams, that we all loved to watch in the past.

But maybe we will have to witness what Zico recommends, "There are weapons at hand. Against Germany the main battle will be in midfield and I think Brazil should deploy three more combative midfielders that could disrupt the German passing." That doesn't sound the least promising.
 
The problem isn't the 'tactical fouling'. That's been around longer than Brazil has been doing it, though it was an 'emergency measure' not a common part of the plan. The transition from 'oh no, bad turnover, take a foul' to 'just keep fouling constantly so they can't get going' is a bad development that could have and should have been stopped. In the context of the game it is obvious that the fouls are intentional, so book them. Problem solved.

Unfortunately that wasn't done, which has led to the 'refinement' of the practice that Brazil has introduced...to not only foul constantly to disrupt the opponent's flow (as practiced in Spain) but to use big clumsy players to do it in hopes of either intimidating or injuring the opposition. Again, all it takes is referees enforcing the rules and the problem is solved. Unfortunately it didn't happen before this injury to Neymar, but hopefully in the aftermath it will get done.
 
I think it rather means that there is no "extremely upset world" nor is there an "extremely upset sporting press" (outside of Brazil and some parts of South America). ;)

@Luiz: Your way of posting (i.e. everyone is against the Brazilian team and all fouls on Brazilian players (especially Neymar)) is very antagonizing actually. I understand that you're disappointed, but your attitude is making it really easy to root against Brazil on tuesday.

Should make my sister-in-law very happy, me rooting for Germany.... :crazyeye:

I don't think everyone is against Brazil at all.

Which is nonsense and you know it. Your posts in this thread are whiny, petulant and alltogether childish regarding any perceived injustice against the Brazilian team.

You root for Germany all you want (was that supposed to make me sad or something?). I'll root for Argentina against you.

I really couldn't care less about if you're sad about who I'm rooting for. My "rooting for Germany" comment was actually more mocking myself, consdering the Dutch aren't supposed to root for Germany (it's in our national DNA to root against Germany in football ;) ), but my sister-in-law is German, so that makes for interesting football discussions in the family... :D
 
I agree with Vickery (who is a rare example of an excellent BBC football writer) - Brazil got away with countless fouls all night, they wiped out James Rodriguez every time they got the ball, and they barely received any punishment from the ref. The ref was unbelievably biased towards Brazil. Just terrible referring.

Anyway I agree that Neymar's injury was tragic but Brazil are hardly saints... They played some ugly football that night, and I can't get behind them any more than I could get behind Atletico Madrid in the UCL final. Way worse than diving if you ask me.
 
Zuniga+atacando+Hulk+Copa+2014+2.jpg

Only reason Hulk kept on playing is that he is a muscular monster with far more physical strength and resistance than skill. The opposite of ultra-skilled but skinny Neymar.

Spoiler GoT S4 spoiler :
He deserved that foul after what he did to poor Oberyn :(
 
I understand that you're disappointed, but your attitude is making it really easy to root against Brazil on tuesday.

I feel the same about the Netherlands. I really want to root for them, but the way in which certain Dutch posters have been acting has, against all odds, made me start to think I'd rather see them fall in the semi. An Englishman rooting for Germany and Argentina - that really takes some doing. :lol:
 
Is there any way that they can all lose? :( I seriously don't want any of these teams to win the World Cup.

I guess Germany is the lesser of 4 evils.
 
Moderator Action: This thread is becoming a troll fest. If you wish to discuss the World Cup, please do so with civility and addressing the issues instead of each other. Keep the nationalism in check as well. If the trolling continues, infractions and thread closure will follow. Please try to control your passions.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889
 
That Dutch language, not too pretty sounding, quite coarse, I prefer Deutsch.
My final 2 pick, Argentina and Germany, hope the unified Deutschland wins it finally, they're the most consistent team of any, 4 straight semis, 15-I think straight quarters, nobody can top that.
Last time they won was as West Germany in 1990, is that correct? Then it's about time they've won it again, don't you all agree?

If Yugoslavia was still united, imagine the team they could field? They'd definitely be a threat to go deep in the tournament, instead they've got like 6 countries of 5 million more/less each, 2 of them made it to the Mundial and none out of group stage, quite disappointing.

Asian teams were really disappointing in this world cup.
 
^Asian teams never were a force in (football) world cups, though, apart from maybe a couple of good surprises who got to the round of 16, and the more dubious case of Korea in its own hosted WC (where iirc it is often claimed they were pushed through artificially).
Turkey is in Uefa anyway, and i think it had a good run only in that Korea WC too :)
 
but the way in which certain Dutch posters have been acting
I object to lumping me in with Dutchfire, Rik and J-Man. Your issue was with me, it's unfair to implicate these fine Dutch citizens :)

I called your call for two penalties a load of bollocks. That was strong. I apologize. I should have said: I strenuously disagree with your assesment.
 
Oh please, when I was young the Brazilians played the best and the prettiest football around by a comfortable margin, in the past decade under Dunga and Scolari they've made a point of kicking teams off the pitch whenever things didn't go their way.

Read Zico's article on the Guardian. And please, stop implying that anyone who doesn't see things your way suffers from a mental problem, I don't want you to descend to ReindeerThistle's depths.
I know you're not that old. To remember "pretty football Brazil" you would need to have been born in the 1970's or before. Truth is Brazil abandoned the "pretty" and mostly offensive football after 1982 (not 1986 as some people erroneously believe) because it simply did not win anymore. For all it's merits, the 1982 Seleção had some bizarre defensive blunders that are totally out place in modern football. Those who suggest "Brazil go back to 1982 style" either don't know what they're talking about (most often the case) or are suggesting in a PC way that Brazil go back to entertaining everyone but then losing every time and making way to "pragmatic" teams. Brazil went through a deep restructuring, and the "Era of the Defensive Midfielders" did not begin with Scolari in 2002, but rather was at full swing in 1990. So I wonder if that is the pretty football you mentioned? Because 1990 Brazil is widely regarded as the ugliest Brazilian football ever, and 1994 wasn't that much better (save for the genius of Romário). The victory at 1994 consecrated the Defensive Midfielder strategy / mentality, which reached it's apex in 2010 under Dunga and has since been slowly declining. 2014 Brazil is actually "prettier" and "less dirty" than 2010 Brazil. There's no Felipe Melo, an all-out thug whose job was to beat up our opponents, in 2014 Brazil. That we're not doing so good this WC should not detract from that.

Of course, for all your vitriol about Scolari's teams "kicking teams off the pitch", even at it's worst with Dunga the Brazilian team didn't even approach the heights of dirty football and tactical fouling as mastered by Argentina and Uruguay, who have really made hard fouls committed under the ref's radar into an art form.


I agree with Vickery (who is a rare example of an excellent BBC football writer) - Brazil got away with countless fouls all night, they wiped out James Rodriguez every time they got the ball, and they barely received any punishment from the ref. The ref was unbelievably biased towards Brazil. Just terrible referring.

Anyway I agree that Neymar's injury was tragic but Brazil are hardly saints... They played some ugly football that night, and I can't get behind them any more than I could get behind Atletico Madrid in the UCL final. Way worse than diving if you ask me.
Nobody is saying Brazil are saints. I don't think any Brazilian, here or anywhere else, has analysed that game as "poor Brazilians being constantly beaten by thuggish Colombians". That's just not what happened, and any talk of that game must recognize that Brazil fouled often and embraced tactical fouling as a strategy. But Vickery is full of crap. I already challenged anyone here to produce a picture of any foul committed on Rodriguez or any other Colombian that even approached the severity of what Zuniga did to Hulk's knee on the first half or, much worse, to Neymar's back on the second. There's a difference between fouling all the time, even with dirty anti-football fouls aimed at killing the play, and to go all-out with clear intent to cause injury. Look at that picture of Zuniga's strike against Hulk's knee and tell me the intent was not to injure. That's why FIFA's medical committee has asked that he be severely punished. That's why he will be punished, but not anyone else on either side. He deserved a red card on the first half after trying unsuccessfully to break Hulk, and didn't get a yellow even after successfully breaking Neymar. So it's very hard, indeed impossible, to argue the ref favored Brazil. I don't think he favored Colombia either, he simply screwed up, and the result ended up being worse for Brazil because of Zuniga's assault.

Vickers narrative of the game with Chile is even more full of crap. His narrative, which borders on the cartoonish, is that Brazil started playing dirty on Chile and they, the poor kids who just wanted to have some fun, had no alternative other than to "fight back" and hunt Neymar (they almost got him out of the game against Colombia). I wonder if he saw the game at all. Chile committed the first fouls of the game! The first half, all the way to the Chilean equalizer towards the end, was marked by Brazilian dominance and constant attacks, with Chile fouling all the time to stop them, sometimes pretty hard indeed (see the strike on Neymar that he mentioned). Only in the second half, when Chile was playing better, did Brazil start fouling all the time. So Vickers made up a narrative to support his point. That's called bad journalism.
 
The teams that play creatively rarely win the competition, which is sad. Happens also with various Dutch teams, and the Romania of 1994 which - again - was a great collection of players :)
To kick a very strong Argentina out (with Batistuta at the time) and then be sent off in the lame penalties by eternally average/boring Sweden :(
 
Thats the German pronunciation I am familiar with. I would have assumed it would be similar in Dutch too - but apparently, Flems
Just to come back shortly to this question: In Dutch/Flemmish, the "ui" sound is pronounced slightly different as in German, so the Germans would proabbaly say " Duh Broey-nuh" indeed, but the Flemmish version sounds like this:
http://nl.forvo.com/word/fred_de_bruyne/ (click on the blue triangle to play back the pronunciation)
(btw, this is clearly spoken with a Flemmish voice)
And indeed, "De Bruyne" means "The Brown One" in Dutch, so it's similar to the English surname "Brown"
 
That's why he will be punished, but not anyone else on either side.

So, does the fact that he won't be punished change your interpretation of events at all?

From today's update from the disciplinary committee:

"It is important to note that the conditions by which the FIFA Disciplinary Committee can intervene in any incident have to be considered independently of the consequences of that incident, such as an unfortunate injury suffered by a player."

For the record they also summarily rejected Brazil's totally unfounded request that Silva's yellow card for interfering with the goalkeeper be overturned. I would dearly love to know what they presented as grounds on that one, since I think kids playing in the U-8 division would have known better than to do what Silva did on that play.
 
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