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2020 NFL offseason thread

Discussion in 'Sports Talk' started by Timsup2nothin, Dec 24, 2019.

  1. Sommerswerd

    Sommerswerd I never yielded

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    See all that is way more expensive and complicated... the Ground-and-Pound is faster, simpler and cheaper to implement than a Power Passing attack. The Bears could do the Ground & Pound now if they went all-in on a star back or a core of backs to be their back-by-committee. They wouldn't have to make many other changes because their defense is solid and they already have a QB that can clock-manage. You need elite, expensive Tackles (and Guards TBH) to deliver the necessary protection for a Power Passing game.
     
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  2. Timsup2nothin

    Timsup2nothin Quad B

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    No argument. But that doesn't change the fact that Nagy is fruit of the Andy Reid coaching tree, and there is no ground and pound in that orchard.
     
  3. caketastydelish

    caketastydelish By any means necessary

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    Jason Garrett becomes the offensive coordinator of the New York Giants. I think that’s the amount of responsibility he can handle and deserves.
     
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  4. caketastydelish

    caketastydelish By any means necessary

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    Based on my limited knowledge of the 2020 draft (only going off of someone has payed close attention to mock drafts and what sports journalists have been saying I don’t watch college football.)

    It seems this draft will have more talent offensively than there has been in a long time. If the analysis are right, expect a lot more touchdowns.
     
  5. Timsup2nothin

    Timsup2nothin Quad B

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    I've seen mocks with as many as eight wide receivers in the first round, which is certainly strong. However, rookie wide receivers very seldom stand the league on its head. It's a position that generally takes a season or two to transition to the NFL level. The quality of coverage they face in the NFL takes some getting used to.
     
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  6. caketastydelish

    caketastydelish By any means necessary

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    I’m also impressed with this years crop of QBs as well. Tua and Joe Borrow seem to be sure things but there are several other promising ones.
     
  7. Sommerswerd

    Sommerswerd I never yielded

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  8. caketastydelish

    caketastydelish By any means necessary

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    Eli Manning retires. Personally, I think he’d have done decently as a free agent on a one or two year contract, but he decided to hang it up for good.
     
  9. Sommerswerd

    Sommerswerd I never yielded

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    It was the right call for the sake of his legacy. He really should have done so last season while he was still at or above .500 lifetime record. Brady should retire too, rather than pull a Montana.
     
  10. rah

    rah Deity Supporter

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    And the stat I heard this morning was that he was the highest earning QB ever so i guess he didn't need the money bad enough to go through being a back up.
     
  11. Serutan

    Serutan Eatibus Anythingibus

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    If it were'nt for Von Miller & friends, you'd be saying that about Eli's brother instead of Montana.

    The one and only nice thing about teams being more ruthless about getting rid of players is that we are unlikely to see
    another Unitas with the Chargers or Namath with the Rams - both of which were much worse than Montana in KC.
     
  12. Sommerswerd

    Sommerswerd I never yielded

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    Oh he waited too long to retire too, he just ended up getting a windfall. Manning should have retired when he hurt his neck that last time instead of sitting out the 2011 season and then mounting a comeback. He ended up lucking out and getting a fairytale style ride-into-the-sunset ending, courtesy of the Broncos Defense. I thought Brady would take his Fairy-tale ending ride-into-the-sunset too when they beat the Falcons, but I guess he is going the Montana/Favre route.
     
  13. Serutan

    Serutan Eatibus Anythingibus

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    Brady had another chance for that last year and passed it up, too.
     
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  14. caketastydelish

    caketastydelish By any means necessary

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    He had two more Super Bowl visits, one of which got him another ring, both of which wouldn’t have happened if he retired after Atlanta. Even this year they had a great regular season record and at least made the playoffs. So far, not retiring hasn’t been a bad decision.
     
  15. Sommerswerd

    Sommerswerd I never yielded

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    Absolutely correct, but by then I was sure that he wouldn't quit while he was ahead. The comeback win over Atlanta was a perfect mic-drop opportunity, particularly given Goodell's suspension of him and he gave it up, so I figured then that he was really just going to play until he was 45, or the wheels fell off, whichever came first.
     
  16. TheMeInTeam

    TheMeInTeam Top Logic

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    The reason run-heavy schemes have declined in usage is that you need more people to outright win/not lose for it to work than passing schemes. Single OL simply not moving/winning outright vs target DL can be a massive problem in run game, but in passing situations he has to outright lose for it to be a problem.

    One reason the Shanahan stuff is so effective is how the run + pass stuff interchange. Play action is a very effective pass type on average, and run action vs pass often force the LBs to move in different directions to cover one vs the other (forced hesitation or badly out of position with wrong guess). There are fewer reads on this sort of play and potential target WRs tend to be more open, even against man. There's more to it than that but it makes a big difference.

    But when it comes to difficult of pass blocking vs run blocking, run blocking is harder. PFF stats tell us this, but I also experienced it myself. Moving someone equal/higher strength is a lot more difficult than preventing them from moving you significantly.

    You need a very elite running team and a very bad passing attack for running to have higher expected value on average. But unless the rules change drastically there will always be room for running as constraint plays. Defenses are using nickel as their base package now. What if they use dime? Quarters? At some point running will have more EV if you keep doing that and wind up with 3 DL and 1 LB with 7 DBs. But right now passing is still more valuable, even average passing.

    While he did fall off a cliff in terms of production and ultimately got carried to his 2nd ring, Manning was amazing in Denver for more than a year, and at least during that period was worth his contract (for both sides).
     
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  17. Sommerswerd

    Sommerswerd I never yielded

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    I will counter by saying that the reason the Ground-and-Pound is an attractive option is because while you do need more decent players to make it work, the players that you do need, are typically paid less on average. A decent Ground-and-Pound needs decent inside linebackers, D-tackles, Guards, and running backs. Everyone else can be mediocre. PowerPass requires elite QBs, elite WRs, elite OTackles, elite Defensive Ends and/or Outside Linbacker Edge Rushing specialists and/or elite Cornerbacks. Those position are the expensive ones so its harder to maintain that kind of team.
    I disagree, both from my personal anecdotal experience doing both, as well as my coaching experience teaching both. Pass blocking is much more complicated. There are so many other differences that makes pass blocking much harder. One difference is all the footwork involved to stay in front of a rusher who can use a variety of approaches to get past you and you don't have any idea which one he will use. You also don't know for sure which rusher you are supposed to block until the ball is snapped (because of stunts/blitzes). With run blocking you know in advance who you are blocking with a greater degree of certainty. With run blocking you can drive forward and the defender has more limited options since avoiding you creates holes that the back can run through. When you are pass blocking, you are more at the rushers mercy, and you have to react to what he does. With run blocking you are in control because you are the one going forward and you know which man you need to block/trap/combo/reach/cut/chop/obstruct etc. I imagine that NFL lineman are better at pass blocking out of necessity because that's what they need to focus on, since passing is so essential for most teams to win (But See, 49ers last playoff game against the Packers). But I think run blocking is still relatively easier, conceptually.
    I agree but I think we have already reached that tipping point, with teams like the Ravens, Titans and 49ers realizing that they can take advantage of the pass-focused, D-back heavy defenses to just run it down their throats. Especially with the new Offensive pass interference rules, some teams are returning to more smash mouth running focused approaches to take advantage. It doesn't mean the passing game is dead, just that I think we will see more variety going forward.
    No argument there. He was superb in that first year with Denver, it was like he hadn't lost a step.
     
  18. caketastydelish

    caketastydelish By any means necessary

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    Phillip Rivers gets cut by the Chargers. If he doesn’t want to retire I’m sure there are several times that could use his services. I think the Chargers should use their draft capital and some cap space to bolster their offensive line and then get someone decent in free agency.
     
  19. Sommerswerd

    Sommerswerd I never yielded

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    Rivers should start calling the networks and trying out his best Tony Romo impression.
     
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  20. caketastydelish

    caketastydelish By any means necessary

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    I think he still has a few good years left in the tank.

    I just realized how the pro bowl would be if the 49ers don’t make the Super Bowl. They single handedly guarantee that the NFC will have a strong defensive line. :lol:
     

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