Jason The King
Deity
Yes. If only.
A Brave New World Part 2
- Thread starter EQandcivfanatic
- Start date
Yes. If only.
This is where polite went out the window and scare mongering came into play. Withdraw this absurd idea and politeness will return to the discussion.
Jason The King
Deity
Virginia and other North American nations have plenty to fear from French involvement in North America. Twice Virgina has had to fight French armies on the battlefields of North America. Both of these times it was the French who, through her defensive alliances and other dealings, tried to direct policy in North America.
France again intervened in the Gulf-Georgian War, a war brought about by Georgian aggression and invasion!
The term scare-monger implies that we have nothing to be scared about. But indeed, Italy was probably still suckling at France's teat to notice her mother's interventions in North America. Open your eyes and you may possibly see our reasoning.
Crezth
i knew you were a real man of the left
This, Virginia, is why your argument holds no water. The sins of the past empire have been washed away, and now our leadership is strong, firm, and moral. When we say we shall not intervene as we do, we mean it.
Yup, you all keep joining some group run by Virginia for its own purposes rather than see and understand that France has forcefully evicted the previous government who did these things like support the insane Quebec and kept Italy split in twain. No, don't give the regime a chance to keep its word just prepare to attack it now before it has done anything to you other than say Hi, we like Georgia we're gonna trade and research with her. Italy is done arguing this point with its obviously a waste of time, you are determined to ignore everyone to move your agenda towards a very easily avoidable war if only you all relaxed and listened to rational argument by your neighbors and those who fought with you. We are going to back to improving the living standard of Italy and her friends and trying to deal with this plague and recession.
Good day to you.
Good day to you.
germanicus12
First Citizen of Rome
We do not care for a trade or research agreement, it is the defensive pact that we are opposed, a defensive pact gives the French and Italian governments the right to place troops on American soil. Again, who does Georgia have to be afraid of? Drop the defensive pact and I can tell you that the rest of the American nations will back off and allow the trade and research cooperation to be formed between you.
The defensive pact is the only thing standing in the way, in our opinion. Drop it and we will back off.
The defensive pact is the only thing standing in the way, in our opinion. Drop it and we will back off.
Jason The King
Deity
This is exactly our point as well. Trade all you want, we encourage trade, but the defensive pact must go. The Detroit Accords will be an agreement to stop any further French involvement in North America. You can have your pact, but be aware that any involvement will be met with the whole of the continent against you.
germanicus12
First Citizen of Rome
Then what is the point of a Defensive Pact if you are not sending troops? Aid and materials can be done through trade agreements.
I assume it is now agreed that you have dropped the Defensive Pact?
No, Italy and Portugal are still supportive of Georgia. But again before you go off like crazy why don't you actually read what France says. Good Day.
Edit - And why the hell are Italian Soldiers not permitted? We fought on your side in the war against Imperial France and all of a sudden Italy is subject to France's section of the Treaty of ROME? Deseret I suggest you look back at history and watch the attitude.
Edit - And why the hell are Italian Soldiers not permitted? We fought on your side in the war against Imperial France and all of a sudden Italy is subject to France's section of the Treaty of ROME? Deseret I suggest you look back at history and watch the attitude.
Luckymoose
The World is Mine
Georgia is fearing it's own safety. The whole of the continent threatens war over a defensive alliance? Do you want to bring my allies onto the continent or what?
Jason The King
Deity
Virginia echoes Deseret. What is the point of the defensive pact between France and Georgia if French troops will not set foot on North American soil?
Portuguese troops have fought alongside Virginian soldiers in two wars, we are confident that Portugal is sane enough to know when to interfere and when not to. As for Italy, nobody ever said anything wrong about the Italian-Georgian defensive pact. As far as Virginia is concerned, Italy and Georgia have no treaty obligations that bar them from a defensive alliance. They are free to do what they wish, it is not Virginia's place to judge their actions. Our only qualm was with the French portion of the alliance.
The Detroit Accords are signed to signal any further French incursion into North America will be met with resistance by the members. Go ahead and have your defensive alliance that doesn't include the French military. But as soon as French forces to appear in North America, know that the continent will respond.
Cynovolans
Not in my dimension.
From: The Empire of Haiti
To all those concerned with a Georgian-French Alliance
Haiti does not feel that such efforts to prevent an alliance between Georgia and France and other European nations is necessary. It is a nations right to make an alliance with any nation it wants. Of course haiti feels threatened by this alliance between France and Georgia, but every alliance is a threat to another nation. France has said they wont send an active soldier to North America and it is their decision to make pacts with cowards. But I doubt this is as much of a threat as most countries are making it seem.
To all those concerned with a Georgian-French Alliance
Haiti does not feel that such efforts to prevent an alliance between Georgia and France and other European nations is necessary. It is a nations right to make an alliance with any nation it wants. Of course haiti feels threatened by this alliance between France and Georgia, but every alliance is a threat to another nation. France has said they wont send an active soldier to North America and it is their decision to make pacts with cowards. But I doubt this is as much of a threat as most countries are making it seem.
DarthNader
Destroyer of Worlds
Just got back from a move from Europe...give me some time to read this Great Wall of Text and respond to things.
If you need something from me ASAP, PM me.
If you need something from me ASAP, PM me.
germanicus12
First Citizen of Rome
The latter phrase was an error on our part, we did not mean to add Italy to the list, it was just a slip of the tongue since it was you and France along with Georgia demanding the pact. We meant French troops, Italians are fine, though we will not be happy but the treaty does not bar you from sending troops. You and Georgia can create a defensive pact, as Virginia said, as long as France is not included in it.
This be the 20 hour warning, but seeing how little is being resolved, there might be a delay
Crezth
i knew you were a real man of the left
A slip of the tongue, or has that slip a Freudian undertone? It seems to us that the vindictive neighbors of Georgia wish to decide HER foreign policy for her, using the great paper masquerade of the Treaty of Rome to enforce their brand of a unified front. However, this is clearly not so unified - all of North America, indeed? Even the Communists? What of New England, who holds not the same position? Will you all kowtow to Virginia?
But, no, we are not naive. It is exerting your influence over Georgia, influence which has been rebuffed in the past. You feel threatened that anything could challenge your absolute might so call upon incomplete resolutions to trumpet your cause. It is Georgia's choice, and Georgia's alone, what troops may be allowed to set foot on her soil. They shall not be French because France has agreed it shall not send troops to America, but they may be Portuguese and Italian.
As for the purpose of such a pact? Why, there is more than one way to wage a war. We may not meet on the battlefield but let's just say a trade ship of a belligerent power may find itself not at ease in international waters. You understand.
We won't back down from this. Your objection to a defensive pact, a pact defensive in nature, is petty and poorly supported. Not even the Treaty of Rome is on your side - the formation of a pact is not the formation of an empire, nor is it the placing of French troops in American soil. You have no legal right here.
Jason The King
Deity
Those who wish to sign the Detroit Accords do so by their own will. Your point here has no bearing.
You are merely quoting our own statements. It is Georgia's prerogative should she want Portuguese or Italian soldiers on her soil. It is French soldiers that are not allowed. But as you promised, French soldiers will not step foot on North American ground. The Accords were formed to make sure just that point.
Indeed. Embargoes and the such are not yet against international law. Not yet.
Our objection is not poorly supported. Look in any history book and you will find French manipulation of American nations, with whom she had only a defensive pact, and you will find truth in our words.
The treaty of Rome literally stipulates France to detach herself from North America. A defensive alliance IS an attachment, and as such is bound by the Treaty of Rome.
So long as France keeps its word and refrains from placing French boots on American soil, the Detroit Accords will remain unused.
