Advice as the Japanese?
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DigitalBoy
Emperor
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I've been playing a couple of games as Tokugawa, and with two warmongering traits and no starting scout for goody hut sprees, I find it's pretty easy for your economy to tank if you aren't careful. I might beeline but only after you have all the techs necessary to foster city growth and economy (monarchy, code of laws, currency, calender if you have plantation resources).
futurehermit
Deity
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Yeah, Japan gets off to a slow start. I would say try and rush a neighbour if you have one close. Then hole up for a bit while stabilizing your economy. Bust out again when you have samurai and catas/trebs.
Cabledawg
King
mmmm....advice for playing Japan....lets see......ok, how bout, dont bomb Pearl Harbor or youll get nuked.
ConanKND
Warlord
I'm interested in strategies as Japan, too, because I'd like to win a conquest/dom. game with Japan. Usually, if I'm lucky, I axe rush (Mining- BW of course), then sitback, making a mental note not to forget IW for samurais, and build the Oracle. Now here's the dilemma. What to bulb?
1. Code of Laws - Standard Choice, with a religion and Courthouse. You don't need diplomatic bonuses in war. The Courthouse, of course, helps maintenance in the fragile no-traits bonus Japanese Economy and gives Espionage points which comes in handy for a warmonger.
2. Civil Service - Same As CoL, only more ambitious and risky, requiring CoL AND Maths. Unlocks Bureaucracy the Great.
3. Metal Casting : Early on, the most expensive tech and another common one to slingshot to. Unlocks the Colossus, which a good Toku should have access to its speed-up material, copper, for the rush, though won't be useful cuz water tiles don't have hammers, and hammers are everything for Japan, except for Moai cities.
4. Machinery - Same as MC, but more ambitious and rewarding. Unlocks Crossbowmen.
I think these are the common choices to make as Japan, since they contribute to rushing SAMURAIS, Japan's greatest strength. Which one to choose? The CS path if Kyoto is a research powerhouse? Machinery if Japan's a production maniac?
1. Code of Laws - Standard Choice, with a religion and Courthouse. You don't need diplomatic bonuses in war. The Courthouse, of course, helps maintenance in the fragile no-traits bonus Japanese Economy and gives Espionage points which comes in handy for a warmonger.
2. Civil Service - Same As CoL, only more ambitious and risky, requiring CoL AND Maths. Unlocks Bureaucracy the Great.
3. Metal Casting : Early on, the most expensive tech and another common one to slingshot to. Unlocks the Colossus, which a good Toku should have access to its speed-up material, copper, for the rush, though won't be useful cuz water tiles don't have hammers, and hammers are everything for Japan, except for Moai cities.
4. Machinery - Same as MC, but more ambitious and rewarding. Unlocks Crossbowmen.
I think these are the common choices to make as Japan, since they contribute to rushing SAMURAIS, Japan's greatest strength. Which one to choose? The CS path if Kyoto is a research powerhouse? Machinery if Japan's a production maniac?
futurehermit
Deity
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After your medieval tech needs are complete, beeline communism and assembly line. Workshop spam. Adopt caste system and state property. With the UB, no one should be able to match your production. Conquer the world.
I second all that has been said about the economic issue.
Currency is needed badly.
If you manage the economic aspect well, Toku is a walk in the park.
Samurais are cool, but somehow short lived.
OTOH, drafting protective and agressive riflemen is really THE thing.
My way to place japan is to go for liberalism ASAP, to get nationalism, then trade my way up in the machinery path to get near to rifling, attack with samurais + cats to get a good number of cities, make sure I have a good globe theater city (= 3 or more food resources) to draft samurais every turn.
From there I beeline too rifling, and as soon as possible start drafting those.
No one will stop you, since japanese rifle draftees start with combat 1, drill 1, CG1.
If you can draft a unit every turn in your GT city and build a catapult every turn in your HE city, you're just too strong to beat.
Currency is needed badly.
If you manage the economic aspect well, Toku is a walk in the park.
Samurais are cool, but somehow short lived.
OTOH, drafting protective and agressive riflemen is really THE thing.
My way to place japan is to go for liberalism ASAP, to get nationalism, then trade my way up in the machinery path to get near to rifling, attack with samurais + cats to get a good number of cities, make sure I have a good globe theater city (= 3 or more food resources) to draft samurais every turn.
From there I beeline too rifling, and as soon as possible start drafting those.
No one will stop you, since japanese rifle draftees start with combat 1, drill 1, CG1.
If you can draft a unit every turn in your GT city and build a catapult every turn in your HE city, you're just too strong to beat.
I agree. The mid to late game military push is Japan's strongest suit, though an early push with Swordsmen isn't a bad way to go, provided you can manage the economy.
Essentially, Japan is a teaching game about the economy. Without any crutches, you really have to play the game right not to lose. OTOH, the military game is almost a piece of cake. Japanese military is extremely forgiving. You can even attack a 60% cultural border early game without catas and still expect to win, if you plan it just right. Not having to invest too much hammers on defensive Archers to defend your cities (cheap Walls are good for that) translates into more hammers for Swordsmen.
Essentially, Japan is a teaching game about the economy. Without any crutches, you really have to play the game right not to lose. OTOH, the military game is almost a piece of cake. Japanese military is extremely forgiving. You can even attack a 60% cultural border early game without catas and still expect to win, if you plan it just right. Not having to invest too much hammers on defensive Archers to defend your cities (cheap Walls are good for that) translates into more hammers for Swordsmen.
futurehermit
Deity
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Basically, the way I see the early game with Japan is like this:
1) Attack a close neighbour with axes or axes/swords (if no copper)
2) If there's another close neighbour, go after them too, living off the spoils of war
3) Regardless, once this war phase is declining, be sure to have CoL before it is over; whip courthouses empire-wide; then go after currency as well
4) Then bust out again once you hit maces; don't expand too far prior to the medieval ages; once you hit the medieval ages, however, and your economy has stabilized, you can go nuts and it keeps getting better and better as you get closer to industrializing at which point you are a military juggernaut
Basically, you don't have to go nuts expanding early because you can really go nuts expanding later. You do need some land early lest you get too boxed in, but as long as you get at least 8 cities or so early on and get your economy to stabilize you should become a power-house later.
1) Attack a close neighbour with axes or axes/swords (if no copper)
2) If there's another close neighbour, go after them too, living off the spoils of war
3) Regardless, once this war phase is declining, be sure to have CoL before it is over; whip courthouses empire-wide; then go after currency as well
4) Then bust out again once you hit maces; don't expand too far prior to the medieval ages; once you hit the medieval ages, however, and your economy has stabilized, you can go nuts and it keeps getting better and better as you get closer to industrializing at which point you are a military juggernaut
Basically, you don't have to go nuts expanding early because you can really go nuts expanding later. You do need some land early lest you get too boxed in, but as long as you get at least 8 cities or so early on and get your economy to stabilize you should become a power-house later.
Pretty much, yeah. There's a lot to be said for threatening nearby Civs to give you money and tech even if you have no intention of taking their Cities. Doesn't make sense to take-and-raze if its going to slow down the rate of your tech-cow.
Japan plays the espionage game relatively well provided that you can get the Great Wall early. Steal tech for parity, then kill his armies with yours until you get to your Civ-wide city limits. Brutal, but effective.
Japan plays the espionage game relatively well provided that you can get the Great Wall early. Steal tech for parity, then kill his armies with yours until you get to your Civ-wide city limits. Brutal, but effective.
This is my approach too
Don't forget that drafted muskets are great troops too, better than drafted Samurai IMO. But continue to build Samurai normally as specialist attackers. If you run Theocracy and Nationhood, your draft muskets will have 2 exp and can take pinch if needed or CG2 (brilliant early defenders of newly captured cities
), and your Samurai can be built / whipped as CR2 and quickly get to CR3 . These CR3 Samurai make wonderful attacking riflemen later in the game.Also I recommend trebuchets to lead the attacks and demolish the defences instead of catapults, as cabert says. Trebuchets are more cost effective than catapults (cost 80 versus 50 hammers in BtS) and they give less WW. Also it is cheaper to upgrade trebuchets to cannons once Steel has been researched (and that is another research priority). The combination of draft Japanese riflemen and cannons is overwhelming.
Since you're pushing for domination, I recommend researching Constitution straight after taking Nationalism from Liberalism. The Jails are great buildings giving giving a little reduction in WW (which will start to become painful in that era) and a nice boost to EPs which will start to become very important for keeping track of how your opponents are doing (power curves and research).
So I see the best way to make good use of the japanese traits and UU is by starting out with Samurai and then upgrading those as the elite city cracking troops (CR promotions), and the bulk of the army made up of drafted muskets and riflemen and later infantry. You need to spend quite a bit on espionage but not convert to a full EE, a combined research and espionage approach is most effective. Use spies to sabotage vital resources of your target to reduce their military potential, the missions are cheap if you spend more than them on EPs. They are one of the best nations to use for a Domination win.
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