You must not have followed any of the previous ALC games.
One word that will never be used to describe Sisiutil's invasions is blitzkrieg.
ALC Game #24: Hammurabi/Babylon
- Thread starter Sisiutil
- Start date
You must not have followed any of the previous ALC games.
One word that will never be used to describe Sisiutil's invasions is blitzkrieg.
Dirk1302
Deity
, no i didn't. I'm curious how this turns out then. Seriously though that's one of the reasons you need to try fight to with superior units. At tech parity in this case cannons/rifles for Sal too you'd need to fight tactically, baiting units avoiding his siege etc and yes then a war could drag on for many turns.Also but that might be just me, i focus totally on these sort of wars also while building up only researching techs i need.While at war i keep building units in each city to ensure i keep an advantage, this way i can often split my stack as the first 10 war turns are over and mop up in 10-15 turns.Every research point i'll get during war is a bonus.
Crowqueen
Token forum woman
Sisi is a good player, but I think the ALC games tend towards being convoluted because they are done round by round. He should show us a game which he did start to finish without asking us for advice, just so we can see his normal playing style. I know I play on easier levels, but I tend to find these threads, while fun to read and good learning experiences, just a little too slow and deliberate for my liking. Is it not better to see how someone plays when they aren't having to stop every so often for more advice? I think we should be told...
You must not have followed any of the previous ALC games.
One word that will never be used to describe Sisiutil's invasions is blitzkrieg.
r_rolo1
King of myself
I do really think that his gaming style is just like this. He only makes less errors in the ALCs 
From what I see elsewhere, he does not gambit with his wars and prefers to steamroll slowly a AI then to try a risky but faster aproach.
From what I see elsewhere, he does not gambit with his wars and prefers to steamroll slowly a AI then to try a risky but faster aproach.Peachrocks
Too Fast For Blazing
- Joined
- Jan 8, 2007
- Messages
- 127
I'm too impatient... generally I try to win wars as fast as possible. Most wars are only for me to take more land so I can get my shiny spaceship in the air faster
BlackMage
Warlord
The purpose of the ALC is to be more deliberate. If you look back and read the old ALC's, you can see that certain games Sis has deliberately changed how he plays either for the lulz or to better take advantage of a leaders traits, starting techs, UU, and UB. It gives a better eye on different ways to play, which is why I try to keep up with the ALC's, slow though they may be.
Crowqueen
Token forum woman
Yes, I understand that, but too much deliberation sometimes leaves a game at a standstill. I like the idea of the ALCs, but I'd like to see something much more like "Princes of the Universe" (his epic story on the Stories and Tales board) once in a while because how many people are as cautious as Sisi I wonder? I was just thinking how many people get boxed in like in a lot of ALCs without a number of limited conflicts to rush an opponent or whatever? Perhaps playing the game at a snail's pace isn't as good practice as sitting down and getting absorbed in it and letting your subconscious take over when you make decisions. I am interested in (para)psychology and can see how it is possible to play consciously - ie taking the time to think about every move, as in chess - and subconsciously - thinking on your feet, doing what feels right and playing as if you were on the ground yourself and not just controlling the computer.
However they are a fascinating series and I read every one of them...just saying that sometimes more momentum might be got from longer rounds and less "shall I shan't I?". It's fun to read, but is it fun to play?
I am not trying to troll here, just thinking aloud. Anyway, I enjoy the ALCs as they are, Sis will carry on as usual
.
Sisiutil
All Leader Challenger
That's pretty accurate. It's not so much my being risk-averse, however, as knowing my own nature and limitations. Even with only one stack attacking the AI, I tend to lose track of other things during a war because I become preoccupied with the battles. If I had a multi-stack blitzkrieg going on... well, I'd lose track of everything in the game, probably. I sometimes do it but only to nip away a couple of weakly-defended cities. Often that 2nd mini-stack ends up joining the larger one at some point.I do really think that his gaming style is just like this. He only makes less errors in the ALCs
I do make more mistakes in my off-line games, and in them I'll often roll back to a save several turns back when I realize I've made a major blunder or followed a fruitless diversion which the ALC gang would have warned me away from. This now tends to happen less because the ALCs have improved my game play, but it happens nevertheless.
On the other hand, I tend to experiment more with the ALCs, partly because it's a leader & civ I'm unfamiliar with (I tend to play as Julius Caesar, Elizabeth, or Ramesses in my off-line games). Also because the participants often urge me to try tactics and strategies that I've not considered before.
Posting a complete game report from start to finish wouldn't allow for everyone to weigh in with their advice, which was my whole purpose for starting these threads: to improve my game and hopefully several other people's as well. So I'll be sticking to this format.
Anyway, I played the next round last night and will post the report this evening. We have some crucial decisions to make regarding how I might guide this game through to a victory.
Sisiutil
All Leader Challenger
Round 10: 1310 AD to 1706 AD (81 turns), Part 1
I started the round by doing a little more whipping, so I didn't start the recommended Golden Age, mindful as I was of avoiding use of the whip during a GA (and wanting to recover some of the lost population before it began, too). A few turns in, though, the time was right.
That turn also saw the following tech trade, one that was part of my preparations for the coming war with Saladin.
By the way, I'm slow on the uptake as usual. Pacal owns the Jewish shrine, which probably goes a long way toward explaining why he's able to keep up despite the minuscule size of his civ. (I'm hoping this will evolve into a crude slang term here on the board: "Check out the size of that guy's civ!")
As was expected and recommended, as the Golden Age began I changed some of my civics.
Nationhood for drafting, Caste System for more specialists and great people (and because I was done whipping), and Theocracy for promotions. I kept Hereditary Rule in order to both deal with the inevitable war weariness and to keep Pacal at Friendly so he'd continue to trade techs with me. I also converted to Islam, which had spread to all but two of my cities by this point.
I then made another military-minded tech trade, this time with Justinian, who had loosened up thanks to my running his favourite civic and his religion.
I'd whipped a few monasteries at the beginning of the round, so I had no qualms about getting Scientific Method. Also, Babylon could easily make up for the lost scientists from the Great Library now that Nippur had its tiles developed and could give those clams back to the capital. And in fact, as you'll see, I didn't want scientists polluting the GP types I was trying to generate.
What's a little tech brokering between friends?
Ah yes, I chose Biology as my next tech. I find that it, along with Civil Service for chain irrigation, is a more important tech on Tectonics maps, what with their large swaths of plains tiles unbroken by anything save, usually, food-poor hills. Also, I thought it would make good trade bait, and it was certainly a little more harmless than trading away military techs.
Now I felt ready for war, so I took several steps to prepare. First off, I cancelled my open borders agreement with Saladin.
Saladin had a few units roaming around my territory, you see. Doing this bumped them just outside my borders. I then checked to make sure I wasn't going to get an unpleasant surprise somewhere because one of these units was in a position to attack a relatively unfortified area.
Next off, I checked to see what the diplomatic consequences of a DoW would be.
It was going to earn me a demerit with Pacal, Hannibal, Ragnar, and Justinian, but it couldn't be helped. At the moment, sharing Islam with Rangar and Justinian, as well as running their favourite civics (HR and Theo, respectively) had them at Friendly, so I had some wiggle room with them. Pacal got back up to Friendly again before too long as well.
So... it was time.
As at the end of the last round, Saladin had a large stack of mostly mounted units gathered in Kufah, right on my border. I moved a stack of Cavalry, Rifles, Grenadiers, and a few other spare units into the forested tile next to that city and waited. (The Cannon were left behind in Akkad to avoid being damaged or even destroyed by flanking attacks from all those Cuirassiers.)
I didn't have long to wait, though Saladin did attack this "bait stack" in a strange pattern. He attacked them on the first turn with seige weapons--Catapults and Trebuchets--then waited a whole turn before attacking with the Cuirassiers, War Elephants, and some Grenadiers.
I did lose a few units, but fortunately I was drafting and building several more. I attacked the city and removed most of the defenders, but I didn't have any defenders left myself to hold it, so I waited another turn before capturing it.
Meanwhile, I got my next Great Person, a bit of a pleasant surprise--a Great Engineer:
I held on to him. You'll see why later.
I said above that I usually don't use more than one Stack o' Doom (TM), but I did get a bit of use out of one this time to attack the weakly-defended Arab cities on my eastern flank.
As you can see, that immediately freed up some of the tiles around Kufah, and it would also, I hoped, divert any Arab forces in the southeast from my core cities--especially away from my Akkad, my Heroic Epic city.
The consequences of Saladin's attack against my bait stack were apparent in the power graph:
I lost some units too, but quickly drafted and built more. Saladin's power rating, however, had taken a severe pummeling. I did my utmost to ensure that this would continue, and this had some minor though interesting consequences later on.
I kept marching north, through Arab lands to Saladin's core cities, my eyes on this prize in particular:
The Muslim holy city... now in my hands!
41 GPT from the shrine, a silver mine, a grocer, bank, and even an customs house that survived the capture, mature cottages, lots of food... I think I've found my Wall Street city!
I then finished researching Biology.
And shopped it around.
It was good trade bait, as I'd hoped. I didn't need Liberalism in a big way, but Economics was nice, as was the gold.
I changed civics right away.
And, that done, I continued capturing Arab cities.
War weariness was mounting, however, and all my drafting wasn't helping. It wouldn't be long before I'd have to use the culture slider to manage happiness. And I had to decide what Saladin's ultimate fate would be: did I want him as a vassal, or dead? He had several island cities that would need to be dealt with one way or another. And as Arab power diminished, greedy eyes turned toward Saladin's lands and eyed them with unmitigated lust.
(I really should write pot-boilers, shouldn't I?)
Anyway, stay tuned for part 2...
I started the round by doing a little more whipping, so I didn't start the recommended Golden Age, mindful as I was of avoiding use of the whip during a GA (and wanting to recover some of the lost population before it began, too). A few turns in, though, the time was right.
That turn also saw the following tech trade, one that was part of my preparations for the coming war with Saladin.
By the way, I'm slow on the uptake as usual. Pacal owns the Jewish shrine, which probably goes a long way toward explaining why he's able to keep up despite the minuscule size of his civ. (I'm hoping this will evolve into a crude slang term here on the board: "Check out the size of that guy's civ!")
As was expected and recommended, as the Golden Age began I changed some of my civics.
Nationhood for drafting, Caste System for more specialists and great people (and because I was done whipping), and Theocracy for promotions. I kept Hereditary Rule in order to both deal with the inevitable war weariness and to keep Pacal at Friendly so he'd continue to trade techs with me. I also converted to Islam, which had spread to all but two of my cities by this point.
I then made another military-minded tech trade, this time with Justinian, who had loosened up thanks to my running his favourite civic and his religion.
I'd whipped a few monasteries at the beginning of the round, so I had no qualms about getting Scientific Method. Also, Babylon could easily make up for the lost scientists from the Great Library now that Nippur had its tiles developed and could give those clams back to the capital. And in fact, as you'll see, I didn't want scientists polluting the GP types I was trying to generate.
What's a little tech brokering between friends?
Ah yes, I chose Biology as my next tech. I find that it, along with Civil Service for chain irrigation, is a more important tech on Tectonics maps, what with their large swaths of plains tiles unbroken by anything save, usually, food-poor hills. Also, I thought it would make good trade bait, and it was certainly a little more harmless than trading away military techs.
Now I felt ready for war, so I took several steps to prepare. First off, I cancelled my open borders agreement with Saladin.
Saladin had a few units roaming around my territory, you see. Doing this bumped them just outside my borders. I then checked to make sure I wasn't going to get an unpleasant surprise somewhere because one of these units was in a position to attack a relatively unfortified area.
Next off, I checked to see what the diplomatic consequences of a DoW would be.
It was going to earn me a demerit with Pacal, Hannibal, Ragnar, and Justinian, but it couldn't be helped. At the moment, sharing Islam with Rangar and Justinian, as well as running their favourite civics (HR and Theo, respectively) had them at Friendly, so I had some wiggle room with them. Pacal got back up to Friendly again before too long as well.
So... it was time.
As at the end of the last round, Saladin had a large stack of mostly mounted units gathered in Kufah, right on my border. I moved a stack of Cavalry, Rifles, Grenadiers, and a few other spare units into the forested tile next to that city and waited. (The Cannon were left behind in Akkad to avoid being damaged or even destroyed by flanking attacks from all those Cuirassiers.)
I didn't have long to wait, though Saladin did attack this "bait stack" in a strange pattern. He attacked them on the first turn with seige weapons--Catapults and Trebuchets--then waited a whole turn before attacking with the Cuirassiers, War Elephants, and some Grenadiers.
I did lose a few units, but fortunately I was drafting and building several more. I attacked the city and removed most of the defenders, but I didn't have any defenders left myself to hold it, so I waited another turn before capturing it.
Meanwhile, I got my next Great Person, a bit of a pleasant surprise--a Great Engineer:
I held on to him. You'll see why later.
I said above that I usually don't use more than one Stack o' Doom (TM), but I did get a bit of use out of one this time to attack the weakly-defended Arab cities on my eastern flank.
As you can see, that immediately freed up some of the tiles around Kufah, and it would also, I hoped, divert any Arab forces in the southeast from my core cities--especially away from my Akkad, my Heroic Epic city.
The consequences of Saladin's attack against my bait stack were apparent in the power graph:
I lost some units too, but quickly drafted and built more. Saladin's power rating, however, had taken a severe pummeling. I did my utmost to ensure that this would continue, and this had some minor though interesting consequences later on.
I kept marching north, through Arab lands to Saladin's core cities, my eyes on this prize in particular:
The Muslim holy city... now in my hands!
41 GPT from the shrine, a silver mine, a grocer, bank, and even an customs house that survived the capture, mature cottages, lots of food... I think I've found my Wall Street city!
I then finished researching Biology.
And shopped it around.
It was good trade bait, as I'd hoped. I didn't need Liberalism in a big way, but Economics was nice, as was the gold.
I changed civics right away.
And, that done, I continued capturing Arab cities.
War weariness was mounting, however, and all my drafting wasn't helping. It wouldn't be long before I'd have to use the culture slider to manage happiness. And I had to decide what Saladin's ultimate fate would be: did I want him as a vassal, or dead? He had several island cities that would need to be dealt with one way or another. And as Arab power diminished, greedy eyes turned toward Saladin's lands and eyed them with unmitigated lust.
(I really should write pot-boilers, shouldn't I?)
Anyway, stay tuned for part 2...
JujuLautre
Deity
Die, Sal, die !!! 
Sisiutil
All Leader Challenger
Round 10: 1310 AD to 1706 AD (81 turns), Part 2
While I warred, the world continued to turn. Another AP election came and went, and this time Mehmed won:
Interesting. You'll notice I have very few votes (only one city with Judaism), so I decided to spread that religion in order to have more clout. Even if it meant enhancing Pacal's shrine city. There's a price for everything.
I managed to get a couple of valuable techs from Justinian, even though they didn't come cheap:
And Hannibal created a colony and a new civ joined the game:
I would have preferred someone more friendly--say, Gandhi or Mansa--but I'll have to take what I can get. Because she's appeared out of nowhere, Isabella doesn't have any of the other civs' WFYABTA-inspired reluctance to trade techs; and she possesses all of the techs of the tech leader, Hannibal. However, she'll be very reluctant to part with them unless we share a religion.
I had built several gardens to combat war weariness, and won that quest that appeared in the previous round. I chose the reward that would help with WW even more:
Meanwhile, back on the front...
I did something a little unusual with the next city I captured.
I didn't want to raze the city; at this point I was still undecided about whether to make Saladin a vassal or not and didn't want to incur any more diplomatic demerits with him than was absolutely necessary. But I could see the city would be swamped by Byzantine culture. So I gave it to Justinian. It didn't have much going for it besides the copper on the tile it was on anyway.
I'd been researching Railroad and finished it soon after this:
I had hoped Railroad would also be good trade bait, but unfortunately by the time it was done most of my potential trading partners had it. Nevertheless, it would improve unit movement and production and gave me a good defensive unit. And remember that GE I had sitting around?
Mining Inc.--my first corporation, and one of my favourites. Excellent.
Around this time, Mehmed declared war on the much-weakened Saladin.
This meant I was in a race to claim all the remaining Arab cities. That was fine, the war weariness was mounting, so the sooner the war was over, the better.
Meanwhile, Hannibal busied himself with wonders. He built the Kremlin, and also Versailles... a grand total of 4 tiles from his capital. Go figure.
Speaking of the capital and city maintenance, we need to give some thought to where to put the Forbidden Palace.
Mehmed had a stack next to this, the next-to-last Arab city on the continent, but I just managed to beat him to it.
Meanwhile, I'd been running merchant specialists out my yin-yang in Babylon, and that paid off with the following Great Person:
As you can see, I was researching Medicine, and with a GM now in hand, I was hoping to found Sid's Sushi Co., my other favourite corporation. I was also researching Medicine in the hopes that, once again, it would be good trade bait. However, Hannibal (and, therefore, Isabella) already had Medicine, so if either of them produced a Great Merchant before eight turns were through, I'd be SOL.
It seems I'm not very advanced:
Well, with a war going on and the cultural slider at 20%, what do you expect? Plus, you know, Immortal level and all.
Saladin had captured a barbarian city far to the north earlier in the game. Mehmed just beat me to it:
Oh well, I was just going to raze it anyway (by this time I had decided to kill Saladin off and had no qualms about razing cities). Now it's going to be Mehmed's maintenance/cultural headache.
I finished researching Medicine...
And founded another corporation in Mecca:
Cool! I've also been thinking of using Sid's Sushi Co. as an economic weapon--spreading it to some civs to slow them down thanks to the corporation payments. Give some thought to that.
Medicine was, indeed, good trade bait.
I now had Combustion on Isabella, but she was already researching it and therefore didn't want to part with anything. No biggie, she only had Communism to offer, and I'm not going to run State Property what with now owning the two best corporations in the game.
As I said, I had decided to kill off Saladin--with only 3 island cities left, he was going to be useless as a vassal. Not worth the diplomatic demerits and the elevated maintenance costs. So I had to amphibiously attack his island cities.
I kept Aden. It has a fish tile to contribute to Sid's and is relatively close by.
The other two Arab island cities weren't as lucky.
Despite each having a seafood resource, I razed both. I just didn't want the extra maintenance costs, nor the difficult job of defending them.
With the war now over and Saladin dead, I ended the round. A state-of-the-world post will follow. We now need to talk about rebuilding and catching up (and keeping up) with the competition.
While I warred, the world continued to turn. Another AP election came and went, and this time Mehmed won:
Interesting. You'll notice I have very few votes (only one city with Judaism), so I decided to spread that religion in order to have more clout. Even if it meant enhancing Pacal's shrine city. There's a price for everything.
I managed to get a couple of valuable techs from Justinian, even though they didn't come cheap:
And Hannibal created a colony and a new civ joined the game:
I would have preferred someone more friendly--say, Gandhi or Mansa--but I'll have to take what I can get. Because she's appeared out of nowhere, Isabella doesn't have any of the other civs' WFYABTA-inspired reluctance to trade techs; and she possesses all of the techs of the tech leader, Hannibal. However, she'll be very reluctant to part with them unless we share a religion.
I had built several gardens to combat war weariness, and won that quest that appeared in the previous round. I chose the reward that would help with WW even more:
Meanwhile, back on the front...
I did something a little unusual with the next city I captured.
I didn't want to raze the city; at this point I was still undecided about whether to make Saladin a vassal or not and didn't want to incur any more diplomatic demerits with him than was absolutely necessary. But I could see the city would be swamped by Byzantine culture. So I gave it to Justinian. It didn't have much going for it besides the copper on the tile it was on anyway.
I'd been researching Railroad and finished it soon after this:
I had hoped Railroad would also be good trade bait, but unfortunately by the time it was done most of my potential trading partners had it. Nevertheless, it would improve unit movement and production and gave me a good defensive unit. And remember that GE I had sitting around?
Mining Inc.--my first corporation, and one of my favourites. Excellent.
Around this time, Mehmed declared war on the much-weakened Saladin.
This meant I was in a race to claim all the remaining Arab cities. That was fine, the war weariness was mounting, so the sooner the war was over, the better.
Meanwhile, Hannibal busied himself with wonders. He built the Kremlin, and also Versailles... a grand total of 4 tiles from his capital. Go figure.
Speaking of the capital and city maintenance, we need to give some thought to where to put the Forbidden Palace.
Mehmed had a stack next to this, the next-to-last Arab city on the continent, but I just managed to beat him to it.
Meanwhile, I'd been running merchant specialists out my yin-yang in Babylon, and that paid off with the following Great Person:
As you can see, I was researching Medicine, and with a GM now in hand, I was hoping to found Sid's Sushi Co., my other favourite corporation. I was also researching Medicine in the hopes that, once again, it would be good trade bait. However, Hannibal (and, therefore, Isabella) already had Medicine, so if either of them produced a Great Merchant before eight turns were through, I'd be SOL.
It seems I'm not very advanced:
Well, with a war going on and the cultural slider at 20%, what do you expect? Plus, you know, Immortal level and all.
Saladin had captured a barbarian city far to the north earlier in the game. Mehmed just beat me to it:
Oh well, I was just going to raze it anyway (by this time I had decided to kill Saladin off and had no qualms about razing cities). Now it's going to be Mehmed's maintenance/cultural headache.
I finished researching Medicine...
And founded another corporation in Mecca:
Cool! I've also been thinking of using Sid's Sushi Co. as an economic weapon--spreading it to some civs to slow them down thanks to the corporation payments. Give some thought to that.
Medicine was, indeed, good trade bait.
I now had Combustion on Isabella, but she was already researching it and therefore didn't want to part with anything. No biggie, she only had Communism to offer, and I'm not going to run State Property what with now owning the two best corporations in the game.
As I said, I had decided to kill off Saladin--with only 3 island cities left, he was going to be useless as a vassal. Not worth the diplomatic demerits and the elevated maintenance costs. So I had to amphibiously attack his island cities.
I kept Aden. It has a fish tile to contribute to Sid's and is relatively close by.
The other two Arab island cities weren't as lucky.
Despite each having a seafood resource, I razed both. I just didn't want the extra maintenance costs, nor the difficult job of defending them.
With the war now over and Saladin dead, I ended the round. A state-of-the-world post will follow. We now need to talk about rebuilding and catching up (and keeping up) with the competition.
Sisiutil
All Leader Challenger
The State of the World, 1706 AD
First off, a high-level view of the new, improved, expanded Babylonian empire:
You know, with Sid's Sushi helping out, I might be able to build a southern city on the ice to claim that extra copper tile down there.
Domestic advisor:
Civics:
I'm thinking of making some big, sweeping changes here:
However, that's several turns of anarchy and it complicates diplomacy and tech trading. Justinian is Friendly and willing to trade techs because I'm running Theocracy and share his religion. Pacal is Friendly because I'm running Hereditary Rule. The above civics changes might leave me with only Isabella as a potential trading partner, and she only has a handful of techs to offer.
Foreign Advisor, Relations & Glance:
Active trade deals:
As you can see, several deals to enhance the two corporations.
Even so, there are several resources still available for Sid's Sushi:
...but I currently don't have anything to trade for them. I do have a spare GE sitting around (!). I could use him for one of the entertainment wonders, though Pacal has Electricity and is zeroing in on Radio. I was thinking of using him for the Statue of Liberty, but there's a good chance I'll get beat to it. Cristo Redentor? Again, Pacal might beat me to it unless I rush.
Trade route income and civics:
Techs:
As I said, Communism is a pretty low priority, but it would be nice to get Physics. I can probably obtain it from either Pacal or Justinian for Assembly Line... but probably not if I change away from their favourite civics and Justinian's state religion.
Speaking of religion:
As I said, I'm thinking of spreading Judaism to increase my clout in the AP.
Corporations:
Victory conditions:
I definitely need to commit to a victory condition and path. A domination win is a long ways off. I was thinking space, but I've got some catching up to do.
Power:
Demographics:
Top 5 cities/wonders:
And, finally, espionage:
And there you have it. The main talking points I'm anticipating are civics and diplomacy, which as you can see are extremely related, as well as victory and how to achieve it. I've won the war and as a result I'm the board leader, but I'm far behind in techs and that's a difficult spot to be in if we're talking about winning a space race.
First off, a high-level view of the new, improved, expanded Babylonian empire:
You know, with Sid's Sushi helping out, I might be able to build a southern city on the ice to claim that extra copper tile down there.
Domestic advisor:
Civics:
I'm thinking of making some big, sweeping changes here:
However, that's several turns of anarchy and it complicates diplomacy and tech trading. Justinian is Friendly and willing to trade techs because I'm running Theocracy and share his religion. Pacal is Friendly because I'm running Hereditary Rule. The above civics changes might leave me with only Isabella as a potential trading partner, and she only has a handful of techs to offer.
Foreign Advisor, Relations & Glance:
Active trade deals:
As you can see, several deals to enhance the two corporations.
Even so, there are several resources still available for Sid's Sushi:
...but I currently don't have anything to trade for them. I do have a spare GE sitting around (!). I could use him for one of the entertainment wonders, though Pacal has Electricity and is zeroing in on Radio. I was thinking of using him for the Statue of Liberty, but there's a good chance I'll get beat to it. Cristo Redentor? Again, Pacal might beat me to it unless I rush.
Trade route income and civics:
Techs:
As I said, Communism is a pretty low priority, but it would be nice to get Physics. I can probably obtain it from either Pacal or Justinian for Assembly Line... but probably not if I change away from their favourite civics and Justinian's state religion.
Speaking of religion:
As I said, I'm thinking of spreading Judaism to increase my clout in the AP.
Corporations:
Victory conditions:
I definitely need to commit to a victory condition and path. A domination win is a long ways off. I was thinking space, but I've got some catching up to do.
Power:
Demographics:
Top 5 cities/wonders:
And, finally, espionage:
And there you have it. The main talking points I'm anticipating are civics and diplomacy, which as you can see are extremely related, as well as victory and how to achieve it. I've won the war and as a result I'm the board leader, but I'm far behind in techs and that's a difficult spot to be in if we're talking about winning a space race.
Matthew5117
Emperor
Stack of Doom (TM), lol!
Great Round, just have a question.
If you spread corporations to your own cities, do they get the maintenance costs too (I don't have BtS but I am anticipating that it'll come out for the mac)?
Edit: By the way, I would love a late conquest victory! Beeline to Composites and Computers to get Modern Armor and Flight for Airports and Gunships. Seeing the strategy you would use would benefit my game a lot (I don't think you have an ALC involving modern units).
Great Round, just have a question.
If you spread corporations to your own cities, do they get the maintenance costs too (I don't have BtS but I am anticipating that it'll come out for the mac)?
Edit: By the way, I would love a late conquest victory! Beeline to Composites and Computers to get Modern Armor and Flight for Airports and Gunships. Seeing the strategy you would use would benefit my game a lot (I don't think you have an ALC involving modern units).
Andvare
King
- Joined
- Sep 14, 2007
- Messages
- 788
Yes, corps does induce a maintenance cost in every city they are in, but they also gives the parent city a gold bonus. Which means that you can get a net profit (depending on the amount of resources, and if you have courthouses in your cities. Which is also why HRE's UB is so strong together with corps. Rathaus+Darius+corps=win).
Let's kill Ragnar next. He has a big ole jumbo pile O seafood. The land you have is absolute poop. It wilol take forever to cottage it and work them up to towns. So SE all the way baby. Scientists and spies. Research and steal. With the mega pile of seafood you have and can aquire from raggy you can run mucho mucho scientists and spies. Representation and Bureaucracy. Move the palace to Gondar and build Oxford there as well. You don't have enough towns for Free speech to produce more than Bureaucracy.
Free Religion is good as well. Lowers the Diplomatic penalties for Mehmed and Hanny. If Justinian has issues then punch him in the eye. Twice. He has seafood and is a cultural annoyance.
You played nicey nicey kissy face with Lincoln ZzZZzzzzZ now it's time to unleash your inner beast. You know you want to. Ragnar is backwards and doesn't even have rifling. You are 10 turns from Assembly line. Take a shot at The Pentagon in Akkad with the GE. Then you won't need an exp civic at all. Build 6 hospitals and the redcross in Aksum. You can give all your infantry and siege units produced there march and still have one promotion left. With a mash unit they heal by the time they reach the next city. Garrison troops can be produced elsewhere. If you manage to get the Pentagon, then nationhood. Drafting from all those juicy cities is a good thing. Especially Nidaros. i bet Ragnar has a GG there or maybe two from his long wars with Justinian. Globe goes there.
Spread just enough corps to hannibal to force him into free market. This gets you positive diplopoints. But be careful you don't give him all the benefits of having the corps. i would just spread sid's there. Keep mining inc for yourself.
You really don't have the best set-up to compete in techs. but with Mining Inc and Sids to feed those plains hills cities formerly belonging to Sal you have monster production. You can wage war a la monty. Unit spam like a mad man. Who cares if they die. You can always get more....LOTS more.
So be the bully. You made the decision to be a warmonger when you fell behind in techs to take out Zara, well BE a warmonger, it's too late to change now.
Pacal could be nuetralised in about 3 turns. this will put the brakes on ole Memmy. Mehmed's core cities are on a penninsula. So taking them is sumply a matter of walking in a straight line. I bet if you knock off Paccy's two good cities he will break free and capitulate. Then taking Mehmed's core cities will cause him to kneel before the Might of Babylon.
You are the production leader already and haven't spread mining Inc yet. Once you do you will be able to produce massive amounts of troops. Your people are hard working but stupid. Perfect for the army. The Ai have been relatively peaceful so there is no large sprawling empire to challenge you.
war war war, then more war followed by military aggression then commence Weapons assisted Rexing (W.A.R. for short).
1. Spam corps to your cities
2 Spam units
3 Spam DoW's
4. begin new ALC
Free Religion is good as well. Lowers the Diplomatic penalties for Mehmed and Hanny. If Justinian has issues then punch him in the eye. Twice. He has seafood and is a cultural annoyance.
You played nicey nicey kissy face with Lincoln ZzZZzzzzZ now it's time to unleash your inner beast. You know you want to. Ragnar is backwards and doesn't even have rifling. You are 10 turns from Assembly line. Take a shot at The Pentagon in Akkad with the GE. Then you won't need an exp civic at all. Build 6 hospitals and the redcross in Aksum. You can give all your infantry and siege units produced there march and still have one promotion left. With a mash unit they heal by the time they reach the next city. Garrison troops can be produced elsewhere. If you manage to get the Pentagon, then nationhood. Drafting from all those juicy cities is a good thing. Especially Nidaros. i bet Ragnar has a GG there or maybe two from his long wars with Justinian. Globe goes there.
Spread just enough corps to hannibal to force him into free market. This gets you positive diplopoints. But be careful you don't give him all the benefits of having the corps. i would just spread sid's there. Keep mining inc for yourself.
You really don't have the best set-up to compete in techs. but with Mining Inc and Sids to feed those plains hills cities formerly belonging to Sal you have monster production. You can wage war a la monty. Unit spam like a mad man. Who cares if they die. You can always get more....LOTS more.
So be the bully. You made the decision to be a warmonger when you fell behind in techs to take out Zara, well BE a warmonger, it's too late to change now.
Pacal could be nuetralised in about 3 turns. this will put the brakes on ole Memmy. Mehmed's core cities are on a penninsula. So taking them is sumply a matter of walking in a straight line. I bet if you knock off Paccy's two good cities he will break free and capitulate. Then taking Mehmed's core cities will cause him to kneel before the Might of Babylon.
You are the production leader already and haven't spread mining Inc yet. Once you do you will be able to produce massive amounts of troops. Your people are hard working but stupid. Perfect for the army. The Ai have been relatively peaceful so there is no large sprawling empire to challenge you.
war war war, then more war followed by military aggression then commence Weapons assisted Rexing (W.A.R. for short).
1. Spam corps to your cities
2 Spam units
3 Spam DoW's
4. begin new ALC
Jet
No, no, please. Please.
- Joined
- Mar 16, 2006
- Messages
- 2,431
Domination is thematic for Agg/Org, but space is thematic for Babylonian astronomy. For domination, you have high production. For space, you can use Sushi to support plains cottages and raze Carthage with suicide Marines and Artillery.
In general I agree with your analysis. Spam corps and then
. I wouldn't worry about building a lot of infrastructure or wonders.The only question is who the victims will be. This I think comes down the easiest path to reaching the domination limit.
I don't see any reason to go after Pacal. He doesn't have enough land to be worthwhile, and he's the best trading partner.
The easiest approach would be to go after Ragnar and Justinian since most of their cities can be taken without a naval invasion. Ragnar can be taken out any time since he's so backward. Justinian won't be easy, but he doesn't have a tech or power advantage at the moment, so superior production will win the day.
Once the entire continent is conquered we can see how much more land is needed to determine who should be next.
With so many AIs running FR you really won't get much of a penalty by staying with Islam and Theocracy. I'd stay in HR for a while longer to stay Friendly with Ragnar and Pacal. I don't think the extra
from Rep would be worth the diplo hit.Isabella will be teching slowly, so you should be able to get whatever techs she has eventually.
Jet
No, no, please. Please.
- Joined
- Mar 16, 2006
- Messages
- 2,431
Is the Corporation payments part of the Maintenance mouseover in the city screen bugged? It doesn't seem to match the summary in F2, nor does it match what I would expect.
(For example in Akkad, I would expect the 13G shown in the Mining Inc mouseover, modified by -25% Free Market and possibly +55% inflation, rather than the 26G shown under Maintenance.)
(For example in Akkad, I would expect the 13G shown in the Mining Inc mouseover, modified by -25% Free Market and possibly +55% inflation, rather than the 26G shown under Maintenance.)
In terms of winning, I think you're best off with Domination. Vassalise your opponents at the earliest opportunity, and turn yourself into a 'snowball' of power - you'll have the world soon enough. The only wrinkle is that you probably need Assembly Line first - but that shouldn't take long.
In terms of targets, you've got two options. Ragnar is nearby, weak and only friends with the Muslims... from whom you can probably take the hit. Still, it's hardly ideal to get demerits with your trading partners. Alternatively, Darius is still well below you in power, he's friends with absoloutely no-one, and he's second for land. Of course, if you want domination you'll probably have to do both eventually...
Btw, if you go for space instead this is probably one of those times when you want the internet. You might also want to start focusing espionage with a view to disrupting your closer rivals.
In terms of targets, you've got two options. Ragnar is nearby, weak and only friends with the Muslims... from whom you can probably take the hit. Still, it's hardly ideal to get demerits with your trading partners. Alternatively, Darius is still well below you in power, he's friends with absoloutely no-one, and he's second for land. Of course, if you want domination you'll probably have to do both eventually...
Btw, if you go for space instead this is probably one of those times when you want the internet. You might also want to start focusing espionage with a view to disrupting your closer rivals.
Similar threads
