Am I the only one missing Sweden as a Civ?

[Jaja]

Not quite,

The Grand Duchy of Finland was the predecessor state of modern Finland that existed in its territory 1809–1917 as part of the Russian Empire.

Or did you mean Old Finland?

This is just getting more confusing for each second. Sweden OWNED Finland for a really long time, from around the 13th-century (and don't come dragging with "uuuh, they didn't own this little piece of land up in samiland", because it doesn't matter. Sweden could have conquered Finland in the 16th century, it would still have been a part of sweden longer than it was a own state) to 1809 when the russians grabbed it.

Not purple, just less blue. Personally, I think that we are more to the middle than many countries - they are the ones who are moving to extremes, not us. But yeah, our people love the "middle ground" far too much but I hope new generations will kill that and the infamous "Jante". I would like to see some politicians with solid ideas on how to guide society in large, not just pathetic issues lake gasoline tax. Socialdemokraterna are the ones who changed the most, a classjourney from worker-party to middleclass-with-two-cars-big-villa-and-4 HDTVs-swedes. In my eyes, they are just another "lightblue" party these days. Like IlyaZ says, there is no real opposition anymore - Vänsterpartiet is stuck in a old and flawed philosophy, they need to modernize if anyone is to take them seriously.

The journey of the socialdemokrats from left to middle is simply due to the fact that the welfare that they created have given people money and created the rich state that sweden is today. (spelar ingen roll vad Niklas Ekdal tycker i dagens ledare...)
This have shrunked the worker-class to a small minority whose votes aren't really that important. All parties are always looking for votes and nothing but votes. Vänsterpartiet aren't even flirting with the workers, they are really only aiming for the confused adolesences these days, kindof like Miljöpartiet. Although I think mp is favourable, their party-leaders are at least not completly out of their minds, like Ohly is.

Det jag menar är att det här kanske inte direkt är rätt forum för såna här grejer...

EDIT: Ok, sorry then. I thought you "not quited" something else in my text. =)

 

[Julian Delphiki]

This is just getting more confusing for each second. Sweden OWNED Finland for a really long time, from around the 13th-century (and don't come dragging with "uuuh, they didn't own this little piece of land up in samiland", because it doesn't matter. Sweden could have conquered Finland in the 16th century, it would still have been a part of sweden longer than it was a own state) to 1809 when the russians grabbed it.

I did not say a word about how long Finland was part of Sweden, did i? I merely answered to "200 years part of Russia". Reading comprehension and all that stuff.

 

[IlyaZ]

This have shrunked the worker-class to a small minority whose votes aren't really that important. All parties are always looking for votes and nothing but votes.

It's no small minority. The lower class probably consists of about 98% of the people here. That's the ones who primarily got to work to live. The rest, the upper class live by what they own. Machines, companies, shares, factories etc, pure money (money from interest rates) etc. And by hiring people to pay their living by working for them. One man can't get rich all by himself. But when he has hundreds of employees that work for him, it's a piece of cake.

It doesn't matter if you drive mercedes. You're still a wage-slave.

 

[Jaja]

Oh come on. That's just marking words. The part of the "worker-class" who work in industries or otherwise heavy, low-paid jobs was what I was referring to.

 

[KillerRabbit]

Uh. Yeah. Kill free speech forever, really brilliant.

Kill free speech? Who said anything about that?

Do the finnish-style school, where the kids get afraid of everything because they have such pressure from first grade. And mentally unstable. Really great.

Ah, to grade peoples efforts in school, yeah I heard you get realy scared and mentally unstable from that.. not.

But to allow kids live out their own revolution in their school as it is in nowdays sweden is a good thing yeah? If a teacher says to the class that they should STFU she gets fired because she offended the children while they talked in their mobile phones in class?

Already the statistics they do in *all* nordic countries shows swedens school system and "grades" are failing heavily. I don't remeber how many years ago Sweden was infront of finland on the education study, but now Finland is way before you.

As a side note, I happen to know that even the swedish king thinks nowdays school system in Sweden is a failure. How can I know that the swedish King thought? Well maybe he mentioned it on his visit to Finland, Vaasa on it's 400th birthday last year

Besides, Sweden created Finnish civilization, you wouldn't want to be a part of the old iron curtain states, would you? Without Swedens colonization in your country, you would have slavs walk in there which would (most likely) a part of Russia. During the winterwar, most of the food to Finland came from Sweden, and a lot of weapons too for that matter.

Besides, all that Finland seem to do these days is build nuclear power plants because they want "their own electricity".

What "swedishguy" means is that swedish economy is on a high right now, although that is declining.

My thanks for you help in the war Sweden yes, I had no intention in beeing ungratefull, my previouse statment about sweden's goldenage was just to point out the inaccuracy of it.

Nuclear power plants? Something wrong with it? It's for sure better alternative than Coal or Oil powerplants. Nuclear power plants don't produce pollution that damages enviroment if the waste is stored correctly, which it is.

And I guess Finland will have to sell some of it power to Sweden while you shut down your infrastructure


"But the nuclear disaster in tjernobil for 20 years ago"

I don't see any reveleance to an old, dusty, undermaintaned, under staffed, with old technology built nuclear powerplant anymore... honestly.

 

[Henrik]

I don't see any reveleance to an old, dusty, undermaintaned, under staffed, with old technology built nuclear powerplant anymore... honestly.

Guys, you don't think you've gotten a little off topic now?


My two cents about nuclear plants:
I wouldn't trust atleast Swedish nuclear plants. One of those quite close to Stockholm had to be shut down repeatedly and for long periods of time this summer due to several security failures and such.
A later investigation proved that the security was so sorely lacking that as to seem a joke. The personel would frequently disobey any or all security instructions and would be drinking large amounts of alcohol at work and so on and so on.

Sweden isn't Finland, but my entire life I've been feed the "oh we're so much safer" argument which this summer was proven quite false.
A coal plant won't quite meltdown in the same way as a nuclear one
A nuclear plant will only ever be as safe as the humans who man it (quite the reason for chernobyls failure as well actually).

 

[KillerRabbit]

Yes but the coal plant "melts down" the nature around it, constantly

And the nuclear powerplant close to stockholm, has not blown up, to my knowledge? That means it's safe - monitoring equipment shuts down the plant if there are questions, as have happened a couple of times in the swedish nuclear powerplant.

If people are drunk at work at a nuclear powerplant, well then something is wrong about the whole staff @ that plant but....

Or have they just taken 1 beer to the lunch and media is making them look like drunks again?

 

[Henrik]

A state commision shut them down for a while due to their failing security routines (they where the one fronting the alcohol thingie)

 

[Jaja]

Ah, to grade peoples efforts in school, yeah I heard you get realy scared and mentally unstable from that.. not.

But to allow kids live out their own revolution in their school as it is in nowdays sweden is a good thing yeah? If a teacher says to the class that they should STFU she gets fired because she offended the children while they talked in their mobile phones in class?

Already the statistics they do in *all* nordic countries shows swedens school system and "grades" are failing heavily. I don't remeber how many years ago Sweden was infront of finland on the education study, but now Finland is way before you.

As a side note, I happen to know that even the swedish king thinks nowdays school system in Sweden is a failure. How can I know that the swedish King thought? Well maybe he mentioned it on his visit to Finland, Vaasa on it's 400th birthday last year

Japan has (I think) the highest suicide-rate in the world. This is due to almost nothing but the extreme pressures the children are put under from the time of their first day in school to the last. So yes, that DOES make you mentally unstable.

Concerning the whole "test" thingie, I'm going to be horribly racist. Whilst a lot of other countries (denmark for example) shut their borders more or less completly against fugitives, Sweden has gotten 50% of all the emigrants from Iraq who came to Europe. That's a lot. Just a few months ago, I believe that the swedish city of Södertälje received around 1 800 iraqis A WEEK. Thinking that all these children will just jump into school directly and do perfectly is just imbecile.

I have nothing against nuclear power plants. I like them. It's just the way Finland are buildning them. Their main target seems to be to show Russia that they are good at stuff and thus don't need stuff from them, not as much give their people electricity.
And Sweden hardly lacks electricity... What do you thing we do with all the rivers in the north? Bade?

And the whole "accident" with Barsebäck, or whichever it was, was hardly as serious as Chernobyl was, not ever even close of being so. They just shut it down a couple of times cause there was a machinal problem somewhere. Thus, the media writes "Panicstop".

Plus, the king is a goddamn kristdemokrat, ie as far to the right as you can get really, his heart wish is probably that only the nobles (Östermalm) should be able to go to school anyway.

 

[Enigma256]

Vikings are enough

 

[Love]

No, away with vikings and on whith Sweden!

 

[Erik_3E]

I voted Yes!
I think that ther cold be both a Swedish civ and a Danish and posible a Norwegian civ, the more the merier

 

[dpaajones]

I voted yes - Sweden was, believe it or not, a major power in Europe in the 17th and 18th centuries.

 

[Wodan]

But, historically, the main reason Sweden (and Denmark) were major powers was because German peoples were so fractious and divided. The Scaninavian nations simply could not compete with the vastly higher populations down south unless that were the case.

Wodan

 

[Love]

Cant you just shut up and let me live happy?

 

[Erik_3E]

But, historically, the main reason Sweden (and Denmark) were major powers was because German peoples were so fractious and divided. The Scaninavian nations simply could not compete with the vastly higher populations down south unless that were the case.

Wodan

Yes so what a great nation must be abel to keap ther nation together and the scandinavian nations did a hell of a good job ther. Dident they

so what you are saying is that Germany sholdent be a Civ

 

[Wodan]

Yes so what a great nation must be abel to keap ther nation together and the scandinavian nations did a hell of a good job ther. Dident they

so what you are saying is that Germany sholdent be a Civ

I'm saying the HRE shouldn't be a Civ.

Wodan

 

[Erik_3E]

I'm saying the HRE shouldn't be a Civ.

Wodan

I now I am just mesing whith you.
but dont you think the more the merier?

 

[Wodan]

Yes, I know.

Oh, sure, it'd be nice to have more Civs. And I agree that Sweden in particular is a natural choice. The problem is what do we remove to add them? Programming time is a limited resource....

Wodan

 

[Angst]

I now I am just mesing whith you.
but dont you think the more the merier?

Depends. See, world maps can be problematic. But I agree with you (Not Norway)

...

and so the thread is revived