Am I the only one missing Sweden as a Civ?

[Kark]

Sweden a civilization???

Unique unit: Vasaskeppet, a gigantic warship that sank after sailing only a mile into her maiden voyage on 10 August 1628. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vasa_(ship))

Seriously:

Scandinavia is a region, originally only Norway and Sweden (the Scandinavian Peninsula), but most often including Denmark. These three kingdoms was united for an unstable period of 15 years (1379-1412) under the reign of queen Margrete (in Sweden Margareta). So please: Don’t bring back the absurdity “the Scandinavian Empire”.

(Or maybe we’re talking of the civilization of Scandinavia, Wisconsin?)

And please: Forget “Canute”. His real name was Knútr in Old Norse or Knud in modern Danish (Canute the Great = Knútr hinn ríki / Knud den store). Knut in Norwegian.

There’s nothing wrong with the Viking Empire. Ragnar (Ragnarr Loðbrók) may never have lived, but that’s ok.

 

[Drezn]

First of all, sry for going OT... Answers in Bold

Thanks mate, very informative!

 

[Öjevind Lång]

Sweden a civilization???

Unique unit: Vasaskeppet, a gigantic warship that sank after sailing only a mile into her maiden voyage on 10 August 1628. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vasa_(ship))

Seriously:

Scandinavia is a region, originally only Norway and Sweden (the Scandinavian Peninsula), but most often including Denmark. These three kingdoms was united for an unstable period of 15 years (1379-1412) under the reign of queen Margrete (in Sweden Margareta). So please: Don’t bring back the absurdity “the Scandinavian Empire”.

(Or maybe we’re talking of the civilization of Scandinavia, Wisconsin?)

And please: Forget “Canute”. His real name was Knútr in Old Norse or Knud in modern Danish (Canute the Great = Knútr hinn ríki / Knud den store). Knut in Norwegian.

There’s nothing wrong with the Viking Empire. Ragnar (Ragnarr Loðbrók) may never have lived, but that’s ok.

The Scandinavian Empire is no more absurd than the Celtic Empire. As for Canute, that is the name under which he is known in English. Since there are so many versions of his name in various Scandinavan languages (Knútr, Knut, Knud), I think it makes perfect sense to use the customary English version of his name in English. And I would much prefer him as a leader instead of the mythical Ragnar Lodbrok.

 

[Kark]

The Scandinavian Empire is no more absurd than the Celtic Empire.

I suppose the Celtic Empire is more absurd. As an empire. But as a culture it's less absurd. Not because of reality, but because of the myths. This is a game, a lot of us likes the mythical dimensions of Civ. To be honest, there's not much fun associated with the term "Scandinavian". But the Viking myths are fun.

As for Canute, that is the name under which he is known in English. Since there are so many versions of his name in various Scandinavan languages (Knútr, Knut, Knud), I think it makes perfect sense to use the customary English version of his name in English. And I would much prefer him as a leader instead of the mythical Ragnar Lodbrok.

But why Canute/Knud in the first place? Why not his father Svein? Ok, the Danes of today uses Svend, but everybody understands the original Old Norse form. I would accept Svein Forkbeard.

 

[Öjevind Lång]

I suppose the Celtic Empire is more absurd. As an empire. But as a culture it's less absurd. Not because of reality, but because of the myths. This is a game, a lot of us likes the mythical dimensions of Civ. To be honest, there's not much fun associated with the term "Scandinavian". But the Viking myths are fun.



But why Canute/Knud in the first place? Why not his father Svein? Ok, the Danes of today uses Svend, but everybody understands the original Old Norse form. I would accept Svein Forkbeard.

Scandinavian culture is a fact; we have much more in common than we are perhaps sometimes willing to admit. The various Celtic cultures did not always have that much in common and the linguistic deiversity was much bigger. As for saying that Scandinavian is not fun, but Viking is, that is of course a matter of opinion.

I fail to see what was so wonderful about Sweyn Forkbeard. Incidentally, he is called Sven in Swedish, so he has a separate name in each Scandinavian language. Sweyn/Sven/Svend/Svein/Sveinn was certainly a less able and successful ruler than his son, who not for nothing is known as "Knut the Great" in Scandinavia.

 

[Angst]

But why Canute/Knud in the first place? Why not his father Svein? Ok, the Danes of today uses Svend, but everybody understands the original Old Norse form. I would accept Svein Forkbeard.

Canute is a better choice than Svein IMO. Svein did the Christianity thing, but Canute ruled England. The Viking raiding thing is much more represented by Canute, as he conquered, while Svein is renowned for changing the state religion.

 

[SkippyT]

Sweden a civilization???

Unique unit: Vasaskeppet, a gigantic warship that sank after sailing only a mile into her maiden voyage on 10 August 1628. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vasa_(ship))

Seriously:

Scandinavia is a region, originally only Norway and Sweden (the Scandinavian Peninsula), but most often including Denmark. These three kingdoms was united for an unstable period of 15 years (1379-1412) under the reign of queen Margrete (in Sweden Margareta). So please: Don’t bring back the absurdity “the Scandinavian Empire”.

First of all, The Kalmar Union lasted for aprox. 125 years (something between 120-130 years).
Second, Scandinavia is not a geographical region. It's a cultural region that stretches over Sweden, Norway and Denmark and the places where they've held influence (Iceland, Faeroes, Finland and maybe Greenland).
Furthermore, all the Scandinavian countries have a very similar culture and language. More similar than Spain (see Catalonia, Basques and Galicia), France (see Lorraine, Brittany, Provencal), England (see Wales and Scotland) and certainly Celts and Native Americans.

And please: Forget “Canute”. His real name was Knútr in Old Norse or Knud in modern Danish (Canute the Great = Knútr hinn ríki / Knud den store). Knut in Norwegian.

There’s nothing wrong with the Viking Empire. Ragnar (Ragnarr Loðbrók) may never have lived, but that’s ok.

Canute (Knútr, Knud, Knut or Knútur) conquered England. That's more than we know about Ragnar. All we know he might just have been a fictional character made up by Icelanders in the 13th century.

Also, there wasn't a Viking empire and the Viking culture only lasted for 200 years or so.
Scandinavia would represent all that, medieval Denmark, renaissance Sweden and modern-day Scandinavian countries.

 

[Angst]

OMG SkippyT, it's you!! xD Didn't see you in here, as you changed your interface totally Where did the berserker avatar go, and where are all the Earth intruders?

 

[Spearthrower]

In brief - no, I dont support a Swedish civ inclusion in the main game of Civ.... but in scenarios, it's a nice addition.

 

[DemonMaster]

Scandinavia is not a geographical region. It's a cultural region that stretches over Sweden, Norway and Denmark and the places where they've held influence (Iceland, Faeroes, Finland and maybe Greenland).

Yes and No. Scandinavia is both a geographical region and a cultural region. You have already covered the cultural region. Geographically, Scandinavia is the name of the peninsula, where Sweden and Norway are. The mountain range between Sweden and Norway is called the Scandinavian Mountains. or Skanderna in swedish (have no idea what it is called in norway).

Info was taken from the Swedish National Encyclopedia.

 

[skallben]

We're talking Civilization here, capital C, the big cool ones we all know. For sure, the peg has been lowered when it is argued that a nation ought to be in because it's doing it's best to help the poor on a tight budget and overall doing quite allright

Was just bringing in some facts. Im swedish myself and I find the Vikings being in perfectly fine and enough.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

I'd say
1. rename to Scandanavian civ
2. rename UU to Viking
3. add a more modern leader (probably Margaret with Charismatic Creative... a new female leader, and CC is one of the two remaining combos...besides Phi Ind which is overpowered)

Those two remaining allowable combos should be used for adding more detail to vague civs (Protective Organized should go to Hiawatha of the Native Americans for more of an East Coast, empire builder type)

 

[Ethric]

What's the arguments for having a "Scandianavian civ" instead of the vikings? The vikings did exciting stuff, but scandianavians? Yawn. And I am one, so no "Booh, racist"-rubbish

 

[KrikkitTwo]

Combo:
shuts people up
adds a female leader slot
makes the viking civ more of a real civ
gets close to one leader per trait combo

all in all not bad

 

[Ethric]

I daresay vikings weren't less of a civ than many others that are included. One shouldn't look for one solid unified country as a criteria for a civ IMO, that's a bit limiting. And while I think Ragnar is an odd choice for leader (never even heard of him), he does have traits I find fitting for a viking leader. So his actual identity is no biggie, he's just a stereotype viking.

And for my own selfish reasons, scrapping vikings for a later scandianvian civ completely screws over Norway as at that time we were just a dirtfarming vassal, whilst being just as powerful as our neighbours in the viking era.

And bleargh at political correctness-style wanting to cram in a female leader

 

[Henrik]

Compared to other civs that has been included I would agree with Sweden's inclusion. Overall I think not though (even though I would love to play as them).

Also to whoever it was that talked about Sweden being a regional power only as oposed to Denmark, they did have colonies too you know. Neither Denmark or Sweden had any colonial empires to speak of though (the story of Fredriksøarna is a personal favourite though ).
Not that it should have any bearing on if the civ is included or not

Vikings will have to do, though I think they botched the civ in question with Gimli as a leader

And bleargh at political correctness-style wanting to cram in a female leader

Do read up on her... She controlled Denmark at the height of it's medieval power

 

[Angst]

And bleargh at political correctness-style wanting to cram in a female leader

Ehm... Adding Margaret would not be because she was female. It's because she did something awesome. Just wanted to say it

 

[Bad Brett]

Unique building: Systembolaget
Health: +3
Happy: -1

Hahahaha! That's hillarious!

Unique Building (Replaces Forge):

1) +25% , +1

2) +25% , +1 from Iron, Copper

3) +25% , +1 from Iron, Copper

4) +25% , all mines in the city produce +1

5) +35%

Unique Unit (replaces Rifleman)

1) 14 , begins with the "March" promotion

2) 16


What do you think?

 

[Ethric]

Not that I was all that serious re the PO-thing (the and all), but note:

3. add a more modern leader (probably Margaret with Charismatic Creative... a new female leader, and CC is one of the two remaining combos...besides Phi Ind which is overpowered)

Makes it sound like her being a woman makes her "special". One wouldn't say "a new male leader" in the same manner. But I guess I might be reading to much into it. My other comments stand though.

 

[KrikkitTwo]

Well Firaxis is always trying to find good examples of female leaders (Boud, Hatty... and both are definitely less significant Leaders than Margaret) so it is an extra point in her favor (according to them not me)

I'd put the more important points, as getting one step closer to a 'complete Leader Set'. Just need to add a Protective Organized Leader.