An Independent Quebec?

[Hamlet]

I don't want to pee in anyones pool, but shouldn't this really be in Off-Topic?

 

[SKILORD]

Get out of my pool!

no because SKILORD never reads those, he likes this discussion.

 

[HotDog Fish]

An Independant Qubec could work if poperly managed, maybe even prosper, but it most likely will not receive the good leadership it needs. But I personally have no problem with Quebec becoming indepedant, but I would see it neccesary to move the Nations capital somewhere else possible (thought highly unlikely) Well anyways as long as I can go to Hull and buy beer there I'm fine with an indepedant Quebec.
I personally thought the Charlles De Gaul speech was really galvinizing, i'm surprised it's not talked about more

 

[baseballtwin86]

Originally posted by Switch625
If Quebec succeeded in gaining independence, I doubt that trade with the United States would suffer. The New England area of the U.S. buys a lot of power from Quebecs hydro plants, and that wouldn't change. I can't imagine Quebec being shut out of NAFTA. However, Quebec would very quickly be drawn into the US economic orbit. It would be a small economy sitting right next to the world's biggest. As part of Canada, Quebec has some clout. On it's own, it would have precious little.

I also think that a united Canada would not long survive the loss of Quebec. I could see Canada probably fracturing, with Ontario possibly remaining an independent nation, but with the rest of Canada eventually joining the United States.

I would seriously doubt this. I am not to knowledgable about the Quebec situation, although I did talk to soda for a little while in chat about it. Why would the US want to accept the rest of Canada into its nation?? North-American de-stability is kind of a scary thought to most Americans. I personally don't think that it will happen. The US wouldn't recognize Quebec, and even if they did, I don't think that the rest of Canada would join the US.

 

[Switch625]

If Quebec gained it's independence from Canada, officially recognized by Canada and all that, what reason would the U.S. have for withholding recognition of the new state? That's not our style.

North-American de-stability is kind of a scary thought to most Americans.

Absolutely. That's why I believe the U.S. would be willing to admit the hypothetical fragments of Canada to the union. Far better to go through the pain of absorbing new territory than to have to deal with a collection of weak and potentially unstable states in our backyard.

 

[Sobieski]

Originally posted by redtom
Why does Quebec want independence I thought just like the Union of Scotland and England the agreement guarantees freedom and non persecution from protestants and from the English speakers.

I met some Canadians in Cuba from Quebec (a bit of tongue twister there) who were positively weird. They were very unsocialble and generally didn't leave there parents for a minute. I met a English speaking Canadian (though from China) they were normal. Maybe its just that Quebecians are too unfriendly too remain apart of Canada.

That is a pretty small sample huh? That is like meeting a communist in San Francisco, and suggesting that Americans are against the idea of free enterprise. Montreal is one of the most open cities in the world.

Truth be told, I met a guy from England once, and he was a little strange (5 foot 4, kind of a weiner) so nnow I am going to assume that the English are a bunch of whiny little weaklings who don't do anything but drink homogenized milk and go to bed a 7:30

 

[Sobieski]

Originally posted by FrosTi

That's not actually a problem for us


What do you mean? I'm not paid because I want to secede!


If it is more than 50% they will... Majority is the key in democracy and USA protect democracy...

Quebec cleverly uses the separation thing to suck money into the province (hey why not play the card if you have it.)

AS for the Americans, do you mean they will protect democracy the way they did in Chile, and the rest of South America over the last 50 years?

 

[Sobieski]

Originally posted by Andu Indorin


Ah, but with Quebec independent, might not the United States seek to "integrate" English speaking Canada as states 51 through 54? After all, through much of its early history, the U.S. has always coveted its northern neighbor.

Try 51-59, and lets not forget the territories.

 

[Sobieski]

Originally posted by Switch625
If Quebec succeeded in gaining independence, I doubt that trade with the United States would suffer. The New England area of the U.S. buys a lot of power from Quebecs hydro plants, and that wouldn't change. I can't imagine Quebec being shut out of NAFTA. However, Quebec would very quickly be drawn into the US economic orbit. It would be a small economy sitting right next to the world's biggest. As part of Canada, Quebec has some clout. On it's own, it would have precious little.

I also think that a united Canada would not long survive the loss of Quebec. I could see Canada probably fracturing, with Ontario possibly remaining an independent nation, but with the rest of Canada eventually joining the United States.

You forget something. 95% of Canadians anywhere don't WANT to be Americans. Really, don't flatter yourselves.

 

[Zarn]

As a French U.S. citizen, I would support Quebec leavbing Canada. It should be independent. If Quebec ever becomes independent, I will support it.

 

[Sobieski]

Originally posted by Damien
I don't think so.Canadians are proud of not being american,more peaceful,not imperialists supporting some dictatorships in the 3rd world,socialists,bound with the mother country etc....
As i said in other threads about Quebec,i think it's bad that many Quebecers wanna secede.While they focus on the secession,they don't focus on other issues(isn't it benefitial for the govt?).

Y do they wanna secede?It's said that Anglos fought n expelled Quebecers n called Quebecers "white negers" n broadcast a "Speak white,speak english"propaganda.It's said that Brits considered all the people not speakin english(even whites) as inferior.They raised taxes on Quebecers for the Canada Pacific(railroads) n settled Anglos in the West.After the american independance,loyalists settled in New-Brunswick n Nova-Scotia n expelled Acadians.They settled in Newfoundland too.
But what now?Do 24 million english-speaking canadians c Quebecers as second-class citizens?
40% of the Canadians are of British descent,27% of french descent,6%of german descent,14%of other euro.descent,10%asian,3%Amerindians.Yet,20% only speak french.It means that even if all the immigrants who ever entered Canada were taught english,more than1/4 of the French-speakers would've let down french for english.
Is there still a risk of assimilation?In the 80's,english was forbidden in Quebec,which upset english-speakers of course.

People in non-Canadian countries are funny when they try to understand the political situations. Things are never that heated here in terms of French-English anymore. Canadians are too mellow, and our history isn't long enough to have had bloodly civil unrest and revolutions.

When Canadians are talking cultural mosaic they are not just talking french-english, but rather those PLUS Chinese (over 30% of Vancouver's 2 million people.) middle easterners, and pretty much everyone under the sun.

Unless that is what you are saying. I am too tired to think right now .

 

[Switch625]

Originally posted by Sobieski


You forget something. 95% of Canadians anywhere don't WANT to be Americans. Really, don't flatter yourselves.

Are you sure? I've talked to plenty of Canadians on various internet message boards over the years, and I've gotten the impression that if Quebec goes independent, the rest of you culture flipping to the US is a distinct possibility.

I should add that this is just an opinion born out of the discussions I've had, I don't have any hard evidence to back it up.

 

[Ozz]

Originally posted by Zarn
As a French U.S. citizen, I would support Quebec leavbing Canada. It should be independent. If Quebec ever becomes independent, I will support it.

Don't let guys like this into your country, notice he's French
first and American second. Citzens like this you don't need.

 

[Damien]

Originally posted by Sobieski


People in non-Canadian countries are funny when they try to understand the political situations. Things are never that heated here in terms of French-English anymore. Canadians are too mellow, and our history isn't long enough to have had bloodly civil unrest and revolutions.

When Canadians are talking cultural mosaic they are not just talking french-english, but rather those PLUS Chinese (over 30% of Vancouver's 2 million people.) middle easterners, and pretty much everyone under the sun.

Unless that is what you are saying. I am too tired to think right now .

A friend of mine is a quebecer independantist living in Hull and working in Ontario.

He told me about all this and i read Canadian history too.(briefly)

He told me that english-speakers in the East(Ontario,New-Brunswick,Nova Scotia,New-Foundland) are normal but that people in the West are rich and assh*les.

French-speakers are discriminated in the economics he says,told me about many cases in companies and decision centers being moved from Montreal to Toronto.

I know him and know his view is biased but what do you think about it?

A long rant and generalization?the way i tend to see it.

Imagine if nationalism were still alive in western europe.
You guys gotta make great shows inviting the audience of the 2 communities to talk.

 

[Damien]

Ozz,about French U.S.,this is the english structure:a US citizen of french descent.
It's like in german,it's the opposite structure compared to latin languages.

I'm sure you know it as you're an english-speaker.

 

[Zarn]

Originally posted by Damien
Ozz,about French U.S.,this is the english structure:a US citizen of french descent.
It's like in german,it's the opposite structure compared to latin languages.

I'm sure you know it as you're an english-speaker.

I should of clarified that. Thank you.

 

[Sobieski]

Originally posted by Switch625


Are you sure? I've talked to plenty of Canadians on various internet message boards over the years, and I've gotten the impression that if Quebec goes independent, the rest of you culture flipping to the US is a distinct possibility.

I should add that this is just an opinion born out of the discussions I've had, I don't have any hard evidence to back it up.

Many Canadians say that, because they forget that they wouldn't be FORCED to join the states. Besides, why would we want to join a country that has more strict marijuana laws. That is our economic future here

 

[Sobieski]

Originally posted by Damien


A friend of mine is a quebecer independantist living in Hull and working in Ontario.

He told me about all this and i read Canadian history too.(briefly)

He told me that english-speakers in the East(Ontario,New-Brunswick,Nova Scotia,New-Foundland) are normal but that people in the West are rich and assh*les.

French-speakers are discriminated in the economics he says,told me about many cases in companies and decision centers being moved from Montreal to Toronto.

I know him and know his view is biased but what do you think about it?

A long rant and generalization?the way i tend to see it.

Imagine if nationalism were still alive in western europe.
You guys gotta make great shows inviting the audience of the 2 communities to talk.

Hahhahah, I am from the heart of the as*holes in western Canada, and most of these people really make me sick, but you also have to understand that it isn't as much a dislike of Quebeckers as a complete ignorance. People out here know so little about what is going on that no one listens to them anyways.

 

[Damien]

I do think you should make talk shows about that issue.

The medias are a great power.

 

[newfangle]

Quebec CANNOT seperate. It IS Canada. When I think of Canadian culture I think of Montreal, Just for Laughs, and Celine Dion (shudder). I would really hate to see Quebec leave, although now it probably won't happen. Lots of immigrants in Quebec came to Canada, not to Quebec. They would vote "non" in any referrendum.