[NFP] April Update Video

[Leucarum]

It's notna few stray pixels though. Could be a bug, but there's definitely something wrong with that map.

Could be an 'overflow continent' for civs with start locations too close to one another? *Cough*Byzantium*Cough*Ottomans*Cough*

 

[Virdrago]

Hammurabi already leads Atlantis. They just renamed it Babylon, so they could have a leader and so Babylon could be in the game. Two birds, one stone

 

[SammyKhalifa]

It's notna few stray pixels though. Could be a bug, but there's definitely something wrong with that map.

I think it's just a joke for the map graphic, but the speculation is fun.

 

[bengalryan9]

If you're really excited to play Georgia and really concerned about having enough units to kill to make their new ability worthwhile, just turn on Dramatic Ages. Or Zombies. Or both.

 

[SammyKhalifa]

If you're really excited to play Georgia and really concerned about having enough units to kill to make their new ability worthwhile, just turn on Dramatic Ages. Or Zombies. Or both.

I think the people worried about the value or total amount of faith during the course of the game are underestimating the value of the faith they'll get EARLY in the game. I mean you're going to kill barbs, right? Would people rather have 20 faith on turn 10 or 300 faith on turn 150 . . .

 

[InsidiousMage]

Would people rather have 20 faith on turn 10 or 150 faith on turn 200 . . .

I'd rather have an ability that worked well with Georgia's playstyle. If Georgia got the ability to buy walls with faith then it would be good but as is Georgia has no real reason to be aggressive and nothing interesting to spend the faith in ways that are unique them. Personally, I'm more interested in unique playstyles at this point than rather simply good abilities. Khmer's changes are great because they offer an unique playstyle whereas the rest are just powerful but don't offer anything unique to change up the game.

 

[Jaybe]

The Atlantis location is approximately where the Sargasso Sea is. I would like it to be water where the lack of trade winds in the area make it impassible until steam power.

 

[blackbutterfly]

If they're removing the Relic bonuses from Khmer, I would hope that the remaining ones get some improvements and the system itself is tweaked to be less cheesy.

I think in NFP religious combat just got much harder (and more irrelevant). E.g: in Zombie Defense mode zombies popup anywhere and just kill missionaries.
That made Khmer's missionary martyrs a little out dated. Instead the Prasat gets a culture and tourism boost (from pop).

Certainly in both Dramatic Ages and Zombie mode you wanna be playing tall. So that suits the "new" Khmer much better.

 

[SammyKhalifa]

I'd rather have an ability that worked well with Georgia's playstyle. If Georgia got the ability to buy walls with faith then it would be good but as is Georgia has no real reason to be aggressive and nothing interesting to spend the faith in ways that are unique them. Personally, I'm more interested in unique playstyles at this point than rather simply good abilities. Khmer's changes are great because they offer an unique playstyle whereas the rest are just powerful but don't offer anything unique to change up the game.

WHat's better than getting a Pantheon of choice? That goes with every playstyle.

 

[InsidiousMage]

WHat's better than getting a Pantheon of choice? That goes with every playstyle.

That assumes that you always have barbarians to kill. I've had a couple of games where I didn't see a lot of early barbarians. Not to mention the fact that an early pantheon is a one-off event and I would prefer something that stays relevant the whole game. If you are going for a diplo victory as Georgia you probably aren't going to be killing a lot of unit later in the game. And you have to something to spend the faith on as well, which isn't a given depending on how you play and what's going on in the game.

 

[Kwami]

That assumes that you always have barbarians to kill. I've had a couple of games where I didn't see a lot of early barbarians. Not to mention the fact that an early pantheon is a one-off event and I would prefer something that stays relevant the whole game. If you are going for a diplo victory as Georgia you probably aren't going to be killing a lot of unit later in the game. And you have to something to spend the faith on as well, which isn't a given depending on how you play and what's going on in the game.

1. Diplomacy isn't the only option for Tamar. She's good at culture, too.
2. Faith is pretty much always useful. You can use it to buy the great people that build wonders, to spread your religion, to make parks and rock bands, to buy units, to buy buildings with Jesuit Education, to buy builders and settlers with Monumentality... Faith is super flexible.
3. The pantheon choice might be a one-off, early event, but the effects of the pantheon usually last for the entire game. Getting a good pantheon is important.
4. Not everyone plays exactly the way that you do.

 

[CaptainUnknown]

That assumes that you always have barbarians to kill. I've had a couple of games where I didn't see a lot of early barbarians. Not to mention the fact that an early pantheon is a one-off event and I would prefer something that stays relevant the whole game. If you are going for a diplo victory as Georgia you probably aren't going to be killing a lot of unit later in the game. And you have to something to spend the faith on as well, which isn't a given depending on how you play and what's going on in the game.

After reading this whole thread I think it's safe to say we will never agree, but I can see where you are coming from. I absolutely enjoy this Georgia change because I don't go into a game thinking that I will play with a certain win in mind. I don't play Georgia and think, okay lets go diplo. I find this ability to be very flexible and allows me to use faith mid game for various things, perhaps buying a great person for example.

Sure, having a diplo related bonus might be nice for the way you want to play and even fit her theme better, but I would see it as less flexible and probably enjoy it less. With the way I play with everything random, I enjoy flexible Civs the most and I could see me enjoying a Georgia with a religious war focus.

Just wanted to put my thoughts out here on why I am happy with the changes, and how a diplo bonus would probably not be agreeable to everyone. Personally, I can be friendly with people pretty easily so I think a diplo bonus would be weak, and I can't think of any diplo-based benefit that would be a useful bonus over free faith (even if free faith is boring).

 

[Kaan Boztepe]

I think the TSL map? Wouldn't be the first time civ fanatics has gone into overdrive over a few stray pixels.

hi Leucarum. Glad to meet you , let me introduce ourselves , we are the FANATICS.

Forget about detecting a few pixels or a lack of word in a tweet , we WILL go crazy ( the good kind ) over any details , existing or imaginary. That is half the fun in these forums and i wouldnt miss it for the world.

Kevin has figured out how to get us going and is using it shamelessly. Please dont change and for gods sake give us some more civ6 content , soon ™

 

[Lokreah]

Oooh I hope they buff colonizing other continents in general!

 

[bengalryan9]

If you are going for a diplo victory as Georgia you probably aren't going to be killing a lot of unit later in the game.

You keep talking like Georgia is geared towards a diplomatic victory despite the fact that they have literally no bonuses in that area. I could say the same thing about Genghis Kahn - "why would I want to use his mounted unit combat bonuses if I'm going for a diplomatic victory?" - and it would make just as much sense.

Georgia's no less geared towards a domination victory than a diplomatic one. Hell, they're probably *more* geared towards domination now. You say that Georgia has no real reason to be aggressive - well now they do, with no actual incentive to play peacefully (which they never really had to begin with, either). They have no real reason to chase a diplomatic victory over any other, though. If you want to go for a diplomatic victory with them you certainly can, but that's your choice and pretty clearly not what they're designed to do.

 

[fy00sh]

You keep talking like Georgia is geared towards a diplomatic victory despite the fact that they have literally no bonuses in that area. I could say the same thing about Genghis Kahn - "why would I want to use his mounted unit combat bonuses if I'm going for a diplomatic victory?" - and it would make just as much sense.

Georgia's no less geared towards a domination victory than a diplomatic one. Hell, they're probably *more* geared towards domination now. You say that Georgia has no real reason to be aggressive - well they now they do, with no incentive to play peacefully (which they never really had to begin with, either). They have no real reason to chase a diplomatic victory over any other, though. If you want to go for a diplomatic victory with them you certainly can, but that's your choice and pretty clearly not what they're designed to do.

They're seen as a Diplo civ due to the double envoys to city states you've converted, which is IMHO even more of a tangible Diplo bias than Canada's. To be fair, I never play them as a Diplo civ, I always go for Culture because their Tsikhes give double tourism in Golden Ages, but I honestly feel like they're more biased towards Diplo Victory than towards Religious Victory, and plenty of people say they're a Religious-Victory civ.

 

[7daysofwar]

That assumes that you always have barbarians to kill. I've had a couple of games where I didn't see a lot of early barbarians. Not to mention the fact that an early pantheon is a one-off event and I would prefer something that stays relevant the whole game. If you are going for a diplo victory as Georgia you probably aren't going to be killing a lot of unit later in the game. And you have to something to spend the faith on as well, which isn't a given depending on how you play and what's going on in the game.

The thing with Georgia was that they never were 100% peaceful with the bonus they had, they had a bonus to 100% faith when you had a protecterate war. They are meant to protect their city states and go to war with other civs that declare war on your citystates. To fair, I never make alliances with other civs because I am scared they take my citystate and you can't declare war if you are an ally. The bonus they have now, makes as much sense as the old one they had. When you are playing as Tamar you are basicly the city state protector.

 

[DogeEnricoDandolo]

The introduction of 2 new melee units will make units of this line come and go a lot faster, which will affect the efficacy of unique units. Will Redcoats be as strong as they are considered to be right now, if the Line Infantry is introduced? Probably not. One thing I hope for is if (a big IF) Winged Hussar now becomes a Knight replacement that is unlocked at Mercenaries, it can really be a unit that can compete against the Voi Chien. Voi Chien is currently the one UU that is considered to be the best UU in multiplayer right now, it is like a Camel Archer in Civ5 but turbocharged by 3 other abilities. The Better Balance Game (the official mod used for multiplayer tournaments) introduces a ton of nerfs to Ba Trieu, Thanh and the VC itself and the UU is still unmatched in Medieval it is kinda frustrating.

 

[bengalryan9]

They're seen as a Diplo civ due to the double envoys to city states you've converted

OK, I guess. You might snag a few extra diplomatic favor points per turn but I'm not really convinced it's going to be make you get to 20 diplomatic victory points any faster. In my experience (which includes a ton of diplomatic victories on Deity) it's rarely favor that helps me get there, it's gold and production for emergencies, competitions, and wonder building. You need some favor, sure, but I can't see Georgia bringing in enough extra to make any difference whatsoever.

 

[InsidiousMage]

You keep talking like Georgia is geared towards a diplomatic victory despite the fact that they have literally no bonuses in that area.

They're seen as a Diplo civ due to the double envoys to city states you've converted,

This is basically the reason why. There are so few civs that get any kind of bonus to a diplo victory that Georgia's city-state ability basically counts as a bonus towards that victory type.

After reading this whole thread I think it's safe to say we will never agree, but I can see where you are coming from.

Like I said before, it's not a bad ability but it really feels out of place for Georgia.

2. Faith is pretty much always useful. You can use it to buy the great people that build wonders, to spread your religion, to make parks and rock bands, to buy units, to buy buildings with Jesuit Education, to buy builders and settlers with Monumentality... Faith is super flexible.

Sure, but I'd rather see it with an aggressive civ like the Aztecs or even Japan where they are more likely to be able to make use of it on a more consistent basis that fits better with their overall playstyle. Before the change Georgia wasn't a great aggressive civ and still don't feel like one even with the change.