I really appreciate you offering a opportunity to ask questions in a medium where you have expressed an intention to allow some leeway as far as the questioner coming off as offensive, because it allowed me and continues to allow me, to ask things that I would have just kept to myself, opting to remain ignorant rather than risk hurting the feelings of a trans friend, whether online, or in person.
I used to feel like that for many years, feeling afraid that I might ask the wrong question or say the wrong thing to a trans person that might offend to make fun of their situation and all the suffering they had to go through. Now I wonder if I did ask those questions, maybe I would've realised that I'm trans a lot sooner than I did.
 
Surely you recognize how bad thing's have gotten, right?

We're being treated and viewed like We're a problem that needs to be "solved".
I thought @Perfection perceived some of my questions as hostile and/or an attack on trans identity and he tried to step in to defend trans folk by being sarcastic/mocking/condescending towards me. I responded by snapping at him, essentially to mind his business, I also added a bit that he was misreading my politics and feelings towards trans identity. At the time, I was also irritated because I thought Perfection was projecting a damsel-in-distress trope onto trans folk... then @Evie stepped in to defend Perfection and question my motives/approach, and at that point I realized I was wrong.

The point is I got offended too easily and made it all about me, which was just another version of what I was accusing Perfection of... but more importantly I risked de-railing this beautiful thread. The bottom line is I was wrong.

Do you think that on balance, introducing trans identity issues to children in school helps create a more accepting environment for trans people and trans identity, or on balance/in comparison, does it more inflame anti trans sentiment and resistance to trans rights? Or does it do both at the same time relatively equally? Out of popular movies/music/entertainment, news media, school curriculums, and social media, which does your gut tell you is more/most effective in educating/persuading people towards being more accepting of trans identity?
 
I would say it doesn't matter.

Because introducing trans identity to children in school isn't about changing society. It isn't about making people more or less tolerat (I mean, we hope it helps, but that's not the main point).

It's about making sure the next me, the next Sophie, the next Emzie, the next Igloo isn't left to suffer in ignorance like we were (often gaining lifelong scars in the process). It's about giving them the words and the tools to understand themselves, and be happy at an age when we couldn't be.

And that's precisely why teaching kids about being trans inflame the conservatives so much.
 
Can any of the trans people in here give me the temperature on when we're going to slough off all our narcissistic personal image issues, love and embrace ourselves as our true identified genders, and stand together and fight the Man? I'm ready to go, sick of hopepunk bullsh*t, and thinking I've met one too many transwomen at this point who didn't have the fire in their belly. We gotta give them that fire. It's up to all of you. Any of you worried you don't pass or you're not beautiful enough to be a woman, that is complete nonsense and a boat that billions of fellow women are in. The only way out is up. Smash the patriarchy.

But phrased as a question.
 
As someone who consumes a lot of entertainment media, I've become aware of several trans actors and actresses (and a small handful of trans musicians) in what seems like just the last few years. I wonder what the trans community - on this forum and in general - thinks and feels about trans celebrities. I'm curious about what each of you individually might think or feel, but also about whether there's any kind of consensus or common opinion(s), if you have any sense of that.

Celebrities in general enjoy a lot of privilege, but they also have to endure a level of scrutiny most of us don't. Do you admire the celebrities who choose to transition publicly, or who come out, if they transitioned before becoming famous? (Is 'come out' the right phrase?) Are they aspirational? Do you regard them as trail-blazers, or role-models, or positive representatives? Do you think their status as celebrities is a sign of progress? Are they helping? Are they 'taking one for the team'? "Leaders" seems like a strong word, but do you regard any of them that way? Also, I do think there are a handful of trans celebrities that I wouldn't know were trans if they hadn't told us, so I suppose there are probably celebrities I don't know are trans, who haven't made it public. Assuming there are, do you wish they would?
 
I'm not aware of many trans celebrities myself, I'm kind of out of the loop for modern pop culture, but I do know one thing, it can definitely help with trans awareness, to show that trans people are people and not just existing as jokes. If there were more trans celebrities ten or twenty years ago, maybe it would've helped me become aware of my own trans nature a lot sooner.

There's the problem that any famous trans person will have to act like the best person possible as to the eyes of many people they will have to represent every trans person while not just being themselves and any flaws and mistakes will be attributed to all trans people and not to that individual person, but this is something that's true with any person belonging to a minority group.

As for a trans celebrity making their nature as transgender public, I guess that's ulimately left up to the individual person. Maybe in some future where being trans is treated the same as being left handed, a trans person could say they're trans and the reaction is just that it's just an interesting part of themselves and only just that but that's not true right now (even if there's a lot of anger from conservatives that being trans is 'trendy').
 
Trans celebrities are a mixed bag. They're good for visibility, but then it depends a lot on how they're framed, and what they do with their fame. Kaitlyn Jenner is an example of a terrible trans celebrity. Elliot Page is a very positive trans celebrity. Here is Spain there were a number of trans people who became famous towards the end of the last century but they belonged to entertainment or outright prostitution, which yes, visibility, but it does highlight and reproduce the stigma against us.

Also, @Sommerswerd , I watched the thread in horror as I thought you were an ally and kept acting in a "just asking questions" way which was extremely suspect, which was... shocking to me, having known you a bit. If I were a more regular user, I'd probably have tried to call you out on it.
 
Also, @Sommerswerd , I watched the thread in horror as I thought you were an ally and kept acting in a "just asking questions" way which was extremely suspect, which was... shocking to me, having known you a bit. If I were a more regular user, I'd probably have tried to call you out on it.
I worried about that a little, maybe a lot... but like I said, I took @schlaufuchs offer as genuine and saw it as an opportunity to increase my understanding with a little bit less risk of coming off as offensive. Like I've said here and elsewhere. I didn't, and still don't understand everything about trans identity, but I realized that don't have to understand everything in order to embrace it. So I'm embracing. :hug: . My understanding is going to have to be backfilled as I go. As I also said, I can certainly see how my questioning could have come across as negative/hostile. It's completely understandable from my standpoint for you to have been taken aback. I'm grateful that folks have been patient and willing to answer my questions and I think I've learned a lot from it. I'm sad that I scared you, and I hope what I've learned was worth it.

As an aside, my position hasn't changed over the course of this thread. I'm embracing trans identity and I am going to continue to keep trying to enhance my understanding, as well as encouraging others to do the same on both counts.
 
Last edited:
I would say it doesn't matter.

Because introducing trans identity to children in school isn't about changing society. It isn't about making people more or less tolerat (I mean, we hope it helps, but that's not the main point).

It's about making sure the next me, the next Sophie, the next Emzie, the next Igloo isn't left to suffer in ignorance like we were (often gaining lifelong scars in the process). It's about giving them the words and the tools to understand themselves, and be happy at an age when we couldn't be.

And that's precisely why teaching kids about being trans inflame the conservatives so much.
Doesn't giving young people any fair, meaningful opportunity to utilize puberty blocking treatments depend on introducing them to trans identity at a young age? I recognize the potential catch-22 here but I can't see any way to separate those two things.
 
I’m starting this thread because @GenMarshall mentioned that he wanted a place where he could ask questions without being attacked, and there’s been no real place for that since the original ask a trans person thread got shut down.
I know this is months later, but thanks for creating the thread.

Is it normal for a trans person regret being a transphobe when they were younger before questioning?

If you're gay then realize you're trans and go thru transition do you still identify as gay?
Somewhat similar though different situation. I’m going to be a bit embarrassed about it since I’ve held it in for so long. I’ve always resisted the whole “trans woman is a woman”, in context outside of the broader culture war. In that, I find myself, a straight man, questing if I’m gay if I find say Blair White (I know, she’s a bad example. But an example I know off the top of my head that passes for a cis woman that most would know) attractive. I always had it in my head “does it make me gay if I find a trans woman who passes as a cis woman, irregardless if she had bottom surgery or not, attractive?”.

I may have more questions later on since I have to peruse ID’s link.
 
It only makes you gay if you're a woman. Think about that.
 
Cis-gendered people making it a point to their regular third personal pronouns in their social media profiles: a good thing or are they kind of horning in on your racket?
Typically a good thing. If everyone lists their pronouns, then me listing mine doesn't automatically flag me as trans. This is the reason allies and sympathetic folks will do so.

There's also the vocal hateful contingent that is doing it as part of some mocking angle, but they should be ignored.
 
Cis-gendered people making it a point to their regular third personal pronouns in their social media profiles: a good thing or are they kind of horning in on your racket?
Typically a good thing. If everyone lists their pronouns, then me listing mine doesn't automatically flag me as trans. This is the reason allies and sympathetic folks will do so.
That's good to know. I always worried it would come across as virtue-signaling (or worse, as you point out, as mocking).
 
I do it because we should normalise the concept of gender identity and because it's a really simply way to support the trans community. (Plus it's helpful to know who you're talking to.)
 
That's good to know. I always worried it would come across as virtue-signaling (or worse, as you point out, as mocking).

When I was looking at a company where I was about to accept an offer of employment, in looking up the CEO's LinkedIn profile, I saw that he had listed his pronouns there (and he is AFAIK cisgender) and I took that as a really good sign. And, sure enough, he was super supportive of me as far as transgender issues - for example at one point asking how our health insurance fared as far as gender affirming care, and kind of vaguely implying that if it wasn't good enough he'd figure out a way to make it so.
 
Top Bottom