Atlantis: What is it all about?

Was Atlantis real?


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You failed elementary physics, didn't you...because that, or selective blindness, are the only explanations I can think of.

Show me the point on these diagrams where liquid water and liquid silicon dioxide can coexist. Not supercritical water, actual liquid.

I never said magma doesn't vaporize water, I said an ocean can exist on a molten planet and predate land.

As for those "some scientists" of yours, do you realize that Earth's mantle is not a static thing? New material is pouring in from the depths and burying old material, descending into the bowels of Earth to be heated up and ascend again...and in the end, most of Earth's surface is less than a billion years old. Few fragments survive such cycle without some serious changes. That's why there are so many minerals that absorb water and bring it down to be trapped under the surface. They either formed when they were churned out into the ocean or water body, or they absorbed ambient moisture (many minerals are hygroscopic).

The researchers know about plate tectonics and we have evidence of what existed 4.4 bya. Zircon crystals have survived and they show the rock they came from formed in water. If the crust came first where's the rock that didn't form in water? Thats partly why some scientists think the planet formed surrounded by water, that was the world before plate tectonics.

So you stick your nose in the air at a university-educated astrophycist with a doctorate and say the Babylonians knew more than she does?

Oh, right. Your space aliens gave telescopes to the Babylonians so they found planets the Enlightenment-era astronomers couldn't find without telescopes because they are not visible to the naked eye. :rolleyes:

Berzerker, this is someone who cackles over the efforts to reclassify Pluto as a planet. She has no room for anything that isn't CURRENT theory or fact. If you were to tell her your ideas of the formation of the solar system and Earth, she'd fall off her chair, laughing - and show it in the blooper section of her videos.

Which astronomer? Citation and link, please.

She (the grand tack theory) was supporting the Babylonian version of events. I never weighed in on Pluto's status, I think you did that because Sitchin counted it as 1 of the 12 members of the solar system. I remember repeatedly telling you it doesn't matter if Pluto was demoted, it still played a role in the Babylonian cosmology.

The Titius–Bode law (sometimes termed just Bode's law) is a formulaic prediction of spacing between planets in any given solar system. The formula suggests that, extending outward, each planet should be approximately twice as far from the Sun as the one before.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Titiu...ius–Bode law (sometimes,Sun as the one before.

If the Earth was at the asteroid belt it would fit the formula.
 
She (the grand tack theory) was supporting the Babylonian version of events. I never weighed in on Pluto's status, I think you did that because Sitchin counted it as 1 of the 12 members of the solar system. I remember repeatedly telling you it doesn't matter if Pluto was demoted, it still played a role in the Babylonian cosmology.
Okay, exactly where did she support the Babylonian version? The exact minute and second of the video, please. This woman is a genuine astrophysicist, and though I find her squeaky voice annoying to listen to, I don't doubt her credentials. She's got no room for mythology in her work. There's another video in which she mentions Pluto and a paper in which some people have cited another definition of "planet" that would mean basically any round thing orbiting a planet or the Sun itself would be a planet, so Pluto would be un-demoted.

And I'm beyond fed up with pointing out to you that nobody knew of Pluto's existence pre-telescope. The Babylonians did not have telescopes, no matter how much you want to pretend they did.

The Titius–Bode law (sometimes termed just Bode's law) is a formulaic prediction of spacing between planets in any given solar system. The formula suggests that, extending outward, each planet should be approximately twice as far from the Sun as the one before.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Titius–Bode_law#:~:text=The Titius–Bode law (sometimes,Sun as the one before.

If the Earth was at the asteroid belt it would fit the formula.
Well, we're not there.
 
Bode's Law doesn't predict that the Earth should be at the position of the asteroid belt. The law goes like this: take the sequence 0, 3, 6, 12, etc. Then add 4 to each number. Divide by ten, and you get the approximate distance of the corresponding planet from the sun, measured in AU, at least up to Uranus, and counting Ceres as a planet. In that sequence, Earth is exactly 1 AU from the sun, which is correct. (AU is defined as the distance from the Earth to the sun.)

Your explanation of Bode's Law forgets about the "adding 4" part.

Also, interesting historical note: the law was apparently first formulated by Christian Wolff, who is famous for precisely three things: (a) He was the first philosopher to write extensively in German; (b) He was a populariser of Leibniz's philosophy; and (c) He, and not Leibniz, is the inspiration for Dr Pangloss in Voltaire's Candide. Voltaire seems never to have read Leibniz himself. So there you go.
 
I never said magma doesn't vaporize water, I said an ocean can exist on a molten planet and predate land.

In order to have such situation stable for more than mere fraction of second, you'd need either a point where both liquid phases can coexist-which is not possible in this case, as demonstrated by phase diagrams, or both compounds have to be great thermal insulators. Silicon dioxide isn't great conductor but isn't a good insulator, and water...well, there's a reason why it's most used coolant. Its heat capacity and transfer rate is phenomenal.


The researchers know about plate tectonics and we have evidence of what existed 4.4 bya. Zircon crystals have survived and they show the rock they came from formed in water. If the crust came first where's the rock that didn't form in water? Thats partly why some scientists think the planet formed surrounded by water, that was the world before plate tectonics.

Few fragments remain. They're not representative of the whole situation. Oh, and...just because they formed in presence of water, it doesn't mean it was actual liquid water. Could be supercritical fluid or vapour.


She (the grand tack theory) was supporting the Babylonian version of events. I never weighed in on Pluto's status, I think you did that because Sitchin counted it as 1 of the 12 members of the solar system. I remember repeatedly telling you it doesn't matter if Pluto was demoted, it still played a role in the Babylonian cosmology.

The Titius–Bode law (sometimes termed just Bode's law) is a formulaic prediction of spacing between planets in any given solar system. The formula suggests that, extending outward, each planet should be approximately twice as far from the Sun as the one before.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Titius–Bode_law#:~:text=The Titius–Bode law (sometimes,Sun as the one before.

If the Earth was at the asteroid belt it would fit the formula.

You have not even checked the wiki link you posted, did you...
Titus-Bode_law.svg
 
IIRC this is your source on water over magma.
"Rocks formed as a result of the thermal energy from meteorite impacts would be bone dry and melt at greater than 900 degrees Celsius," said Harrison. "In contrast, our study has found that Hadean rocks melted at a consistent average temperature of 690 degrees Celsius. Water, which is a very powerful catalyst, must have been present in very large amounts for rocks to melt at such a relatively low temperature."

This discovery supports the proposal by Harrison's group four years earlier that a heavy oxygen isotope signature in the Hadean zircons is evidence for liquid water at or near the Earth's surface by 4.3 billion years ago.
From a 2005
document.

The creation of the 4+billion years old Jack HIlls zircons (JHZ) are different than other zircons. They have more oxygen. Zircons form in magma; they do not form in water. Water covered magma as you propose is another of your fitting events to your solution.
Zircon is common in the crust of Earth. It occurs as a common accessory mineral in igneous rocks (as primary crystallization products), in metamorphic rocks and as detrital grains in sedimentary rocks.[2] Large zircon crystals are rare. Their average size in granite rocks is about 0.1–0.3 mm (0.0039–0.0118 in), but they can also grow to sizes of several cm, especially in mafic pegmatites and carbonatites.[2] Zircon is fairly hard (with a Mohs hardness of 7.5) and chemically stable, and so is highly resistant to weathering. It also is resistant to heat, so that detrital zircon grains are sometimes preserved in igneous rocks formed from melted sediments.[13] Its resistance to weathering, together with its relatively high specific gravity (4.68), make it an important component of the heavy mineral fraction of sandstones.[5]
Originally formed by crystallization from a magma or in metamorphic rocks, zircons are so durable and resistant to chemical attack that they rarely go away. They may survive many geologic events, which can be recorded in rings of additional zircon that grow around the original crystal like tree rings. Like a tiny time capsule, the zircon records these events, each one of which may last hundreds of millions of years. Meanwhile, the core of the zircon itself remains unchanged, and preserves the chemical characteristics of the rock in which it originally crystallized.
https://www.amnh.org/learn-teach/cu...hronology-dating-the-oldest-material-on-earth

The JHZ (Hadean age zircons) have changed thinking about the formation of the earths first crust. Crusts came first.
The conditions and mechanisms that led to formation of the earliest felsic (Si- and Al-enriched) crust on Earth and Mars are the subject of debate (e.g., Kemp et al., 2010; Burnham and Berry, 2017; Harrison et al., 2017; Turner et al., 2020). In terms of general context,
  1. one possibility is that the Hadean Eon was very similar to the modern Earth; i.e., a voluminous granitic continental crust shaped by plate tectonics (Armstrong, 1981; Harrison, 2009).
  2. A contrasting scenario is a single-plate basaltic protocrust that formed after the solidification of the global magma ocean (Kramers, 2007).
In either case, various scenarios have been proposed to account for Hadean felsic crust formation, either through processes resembling those of Archean tonalite-trondhjemite-granodiorite (TTG) formation, such as melting of a garnet-bearing igneous protolith at depth (Burnham and Berry, 2017), or through shallow-level hydration of an igneous mafic protolith before subsequent melting to generate Hadean felsic crust (e.g., Drabon et al., 2021). For example, Kemp et al. (2010) suggested that a thin KREEP-like crust accumulated at Earth's surface just after crystallization of the magma ocean and interacted with the hydrosphere (where KREEP indicates residuum with high abundance of incompatible elements such as K, rare earth elements [REEs], and P). This hydrated protocrust was subsequently buried by later komatiitic and basaltic lava flows and finally remelted due to radioactive self-heating to generate the magmas that crystallized the Hadean zircons. As an alternative scenario, Borisova et al. (2021) assumed that a primitive protocrust quenched on top of the magma ocean, as observed in a permanent lava lake (Helz, 2009). In the case of the Hadean, this protocrust would have been of peridotite composition and become rapidly hydrated (e.g., serpentinized) in its uppermost part by the readily available liquid hydrosphere (Valley et al., 2002; Elkins-Tanton, 2012), as proposed by Albarède and Blichert-Toft (2007). The residual part of the magma ocean then evolved beneath the early quenched crust to yield basaltic magmas, likely enriched in incompatible elements, with some similarity to lunar KREEP basalts (e.g., Cronberger and Neal, 2018). Borisova et al. (2021) performed experiments on the interaction between serpentinite and basaltic magma that demonstrated that tonalite to granodiorite compositions can be formed in this way at shallow depths (<10 km). In this scenario, partial melting is triggered by dehydration driven by intrusion of basaltic magmas or by meteorite impacts.

The most common approach to address the question of the origin of the felsic Hadean crust is to investigate the possibility to crystallize zircons analogous to the Hadean zircons, the only mineral remnants of Earth's Hadean crust identified so far. Most samples are detrital zircons from the Jack Hills (JHZ), Western Australia (Harrison, 2009), but other localities are also known (Harrison et al., 2017), including a recent discovery in South Africa (Drabon et al., 2021). While the Hadean zircons provide valuable information about their crystallization environment, no clear consensus exists for the genesis conditions of their parental magmas. In any case, mechanisms for the generation of Earth's earliest felsic crust should be compatible with the mineralogical and geochemical features of the Hadean detrital zircons.

Our study tested the hypothesis that an early felsic crust may have formed by low-pressure, fluid-present melting of hydrated peridotite interacting with basaltic magma through assessment of the capacity of experimental felsic melts (Borisova et al., 2021) to crystallize zircon (referred to here as “model zircon”) and then comparison of the temperature conditions, co-crystallizing mineral assemblages, and isotopic and trace-element patterns of these model zircons with data from detrital Hadean zircons.
https://pubs.geoscienceworld.org/gs...dean-zircon-formed-due-to-hydrated-ultramafic

Abstract
Hadean zircons, from the Jack Hills (Western Australia) and other localities, are currently the only window into the earliest terrestrial felsic crust, the formation of which remains enigmatic. Based upon new experimental results, generation of such early crust has been hypothesized to involve the partial melting of hydrated peridotite interacting with basaltic melt at low pressure (<10 km), but it has yet to be demonstrated that such liquids can indeed crystallize zircons comparable to Jack Hills zircon. We used thermodynamic and geochemical modeling to test this hypothesis. The predicted zircon saturation temperatures of <750 °C, together with the model zircon Th, U, Nb, Hf, Y, and rare earth element (REE) contents at 700 °C, δ18OVSMOW (Vienna standard mean ocean water) signatures, and co-crystallizing mineral assemblage were compared to those of the Jack Hills zircon. This comparison was favorable with respect to crystallization temperature, most trace-element contents, and mineral inclusions in zircon. The discrepancy in δ18OVSMOW signatures may be explained by hotter conditions of Hadean protocrust hydration. Our work supports the idea that felsic magma generation at shallow depths involving a primordial weathered ultramafic protocrust and local basaltic intrusions is indeed a viable mechanism for the formation of felsic crust on early Earth.

https://pubs.geoscienceworld.org/gs...dean-zircon-formed-due-to-hydrated-ultramafic
 
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I just woke up and stepped on a peanut. Must have dropped it when I was eating peanuts yesterday.

This proves that yesterday my livingroom was made out of peanuts.

maybe your land before water was made out of peanuts

Okay, exactly where did she support the Babylonian version?

9 minutes in she described the grand tack theory, the migration of the outer gas giants beginning with Jupiter entering the asteroid belt region preventing a planet forming there while robbing Mars of building blocks. One of the problems with the theory is a planet would form at the frost line before the outer gas giants and thats what both the Babylonian and Norse myths say.

And I'm beyond fed up with pointing out to you that nobody knew of Pluto's existence pre-telescope. The Babylonians did not have telescopes, no matter how much you want to pretend they did.

I never said they had telescopes, the people from the sky were the source of information about the solar system. The Enuma Elish says the olden god Anshar (Saturn) encountered Marduk and sent his emissary Gaga out to announce his arrival and ascendancy. Pluto sits on Saturn's equatorial plane near perihelion. The same myth says Anu (Uranus) provided Marduk with 4 whirling winds.

"A computer simulation published in 2018 suggests Uranus was hit by a huge proto-planet around 4 billion years ago. Supposedly, this collision gave the ice giant its exaggerated tilt. Then again, perhaps there were multiple impacts. A long-gone circumplanetary disk might've also played a role here."

The late heavy bombardment was around 4 bya, maybe the two events are linked.

Bode's Law doesn't predict that the Earth should be at the position of the asteroid belt. The law goes like this: take the sequence 0, 3, 6, 12, etc. Then add 4 to each number. Divide by ten, and you get the approximate distance of the corresponding planet from the sun, measured in AU, at least up to Uranus, and counting Ceres as a planet. In that sequence, Earth is exactly 1 AU from the sun, which is correct. (AU is defined as the distance from the Earth to the sun.)

Your explanation of Bode's Law forgets about the "adding 4" part.

People saw the 2 to 1 ratio and added the formula to account for the Earth being here, they didn't need the adding 4 part if the Earth formed at the asteroid belt. Why is the solar system tilted? The planets dont orbit the Sun's equatorial plane.
 
Berzerker, here's an idea: Send all your data and posts to Dr. Becky, and ask her to make a video of them. I'd watch it.
 
People saw the 2 to 1 ratio and added the formula to account for the Earth being here, they didn't need the adding 4 part if the Earth formed at the asteroid belt.

This isn't true, and doesn't even make mathematical sense (if the second planet were twice the distance from the Sun, then the "adding 4" thing would not match the patter. The distances of the inner planets and the asteroid belt from the Sun, in AU, are:

Mercury - 0.39
Venus - 0.72
Earth - 1
Mars - 1.52
Asteroid belt - 2.2-3.2

Venus is not twice as far from the Sun as Mercury. And the asteroid belt is much further from the Sun than twice Venus' distance. So the "2 to 1" ratio doesn't hold even for the first two planets, and if it did, the expected position of the Earth would not be within the asteroid belt.

The point of this is that Bode's Law doesn't say what you're claiming it does - not even close. There is no astronomical law that predicts that the Earth "should" be in the location of the asteroid belt.

Why is the solar system tilted? The planets dont orbit the Sun's equatorial plane.

Your question is misleading, because it implies that the planets all orbit on the same plane and the Sun is the anomaly. This is not the case. Here are the inclinations of all the planets relative to the Sun's equator (i.e. the angle of their orbit to the Sun's equatorial plane):

Mercury - 3.38
Venus - 3.86
Earth - 7.16
Mars - 5.65
Jupiter - 6.09
Saturn - 5.51
Uranus - 6.48
Neptune - 6.43

(Note that they're all positive values, which might make them seem more similar than they really are; obviously any planet that has an inclination other than zero will spend half of its time "above" the solar equator and the other half "below" it, so there's no meaningful distinction between positive and negative degrees of inclination. Equally obviously, the different planets don't all move from one side of the solar equator to the other at the same time, because they all orbit at different speeds, so at any given moment some will be "above" and others will be "below".)

So they're all pretty close, but to varying degrees. The highest inclination is more than double the lowest. So to describe this situation as the solar system's being "tilted" doesn't make much sense. It would be more accurate to say that the planets all orbit the Sun roughly in its equatorial plane, but none of them does so exactly. And why would you expect them to?
 
This isn't true, and doesn't even make mathematical sense (if the second planet were twice the distance from the Sun, then the "adding 4" thing would not match the patter. The distances of the inner planets and the asteroid belt from the Sun, in AU, are:

Mercury - 0.39
Venus - 0.72
Earth - 1
Mars - 1.52
Asteroid belt - 2.2-3.2

Venus is not twice as far from the Sun as Mercury. And the asteroid belt is much further from the Sun than twice Venus' distance. So the "2 to 1" ratio doesn't hold even for the first two planets, and if it did, the expected position of the Earth would not be within the asteroid belt.

The point of this is that Bode's Law doesn't say what you're claiming it does - not even close. There is no astronomical law that predicts that the Earth "should" be in the location of the asteroid belt.

Here is what I quoted:

"The formula suggests that, extending outward, each planet should be approximately twice as far from the Sun as the one before."

To which I said:

"If the Earth was at the asteroid belt it would fit the formula."

I specifically left out the 'adding 4 part' because that was added to the formula to account for Earth being here instead of the asteroid belt. So remove the Earth at 1 AU on your list and place it at the asteroid belt. The planets out to Uranus follow a 2:1 ratio. Neptune is 1.5x Uranus' distance (30 to 20 AU), maybe 10 AU is enough space (and material) to build a planet that far from the Sun and the 2:1 ratio breaks down.

As for Venus and Mercury, you're using mean distances. Mercury has a highly eccentric orbit that easily accommodates a 1:2 ratio with Venus. And Mars is .08 AU more than twice Venus' distance from the Sun, but Mars also has an eccentric orbit.

Your question is misleading, because it implies that the planets all orbit on the same plane and the Sun is the anomaly. This is not the case. Here are the inclinations of all the planets relative to the Sun's equator (i.e. the angle of their orbit to the Sun's equatorial plane):

I said they dont orbit the Sun's equatorial plane, that does not imply they're on the same plane. That implies the solar system is tilted and it is.

Mercury - 3.38
Venus - 3.86
Earth - 7.16
Mars - 5.65
Jupiter - 6.09
Saturn - 5.51
Uranus - 6.48
Neptune - 6.43

Not only is the solar system tilted but the Earth is the most tilted while Venus and Mercury are the least. Now I can understand why Venus and Mercury would be tougher to drag off the Sun's equatorial plane given their close proximity to the Sun, but the Earth is close to them. Every other planet most affected by a rogue intruder on an elliptical inclined orbit with perihelion near the asteroid belt is more tilted.

Now, researchers suggest that Planet Nine's influence might have tilted the entire solar system except the sun.

"Planet Nine may have tilted the other planets over the lifetime of the solar system," said study lead author Elizabeth Bailey, an astrophysicist and planetary scientist at the California Institute of Technology in Pasadena.

Prior work found that the zone in which the eight major planets orbit the sun is tilted by about 6 degrees compared to the sun's equator. This discrepancy has long been a mystery in astronomy.

https://www.space.com/34448-planet-nine-solar-system-tilt.html

not a mystery to the Babylonians
 
In order to have such situation stable for more than mere fraction of second, you'd need either a point where both liquid phases can coexist-which is not possible in this case, as demonstrated by phase diagrams, or both compounds have to be great thermal insulators. Silicon dioxide isn't great conductor but isn't a good insulator, and water...well, there's a reason why it's most used coolant. Its heat capacity and transfer rate is phenomenal.

Few fragments remain. They're not representative of the whole situation. Oh, and...just because they formed in presence of water, it doesn't mean it was actual liquid water. Could be supercritical fluid or vapour.

You have not even checked the wiki link you posted, did you...

Your phase diagram says magma vaporizes water, what does it do to water sitting atop a 100 mile deep ocean? You disagree with 100 miles, okay, 40 miles, or 20 miles. I never said magma doesn't vaporize water, I did say eventually that magma will cool and a crust will form under that ocean just like it does now and nobody calls that land.

Are you saying that ocean didn't exist but rock could have formed in supercritical fluid or vapor? Dont you need water for that? As for what a few fragments represent, they represent water 4.4 bya long before plate tectonics and life. What they dont represent is 'land' before water.
 
I thought Nibiru was planet 9? It passes by the sun every 3600 years and has an orbit way off from the solar equator. How come humans have never made note of its passing in the last 7000 or so years?
 
I thought Nibiru was planet 9? It passes by the sun every 3600 years and has an orbit way off from the solar equator. How come humans have never made note of its passing in the last 7000 or so years?

They described it

"When the stars, those of Enlil, are finished, the great star’s light is dim/brown-red, causes the sky to be bisected and stands [there], the star of Marduk, the Crossing."

"The brown-red star which (in the direction of) the rising of the South wind,
after the gods of the night are finished,
divides the heavens and stands there, that star
is Nēbiru-Marduk."


https://cdli.ucla.edu/pubs/cdlb/2015/cdlb2015_003.html

He thinks Nibiru relates to objects crossing the equinox
 
The phase diagram I posted shows those pressures. 11 Km is 110 MPa, 100 miles ~1.6 GPa.

Thx... Since we're dealing with saltwater on a larger planet presumably with a thicker atmosphere I'd assume the pressure is higher than 1.6 GPa, but your diagram says 647K at 22 MPa. What would the critical point be for water at those higher pressures? Since that refers to water close to magma what would happen to the ocean above the magma? I'm picturing a thin layer of water being vaporized rising up thru the water column.
 
In your link, he concludes that Nibiru is not a planet at all. It could not be planet 9. And why is there no record of its passing in the last 6,000 or so years?

§1. Introduction
§1.1.
The Marduk star Nēbiru has long been a source of confusion in scholarly and popular opinion. This article demonstrates cuneiform support for the hypothesis that the name Nēbiru may be assigned to any visible astronomical object that marks an equinox. In a footnote to his translation of Enûma eliš (in the following Ee) tablet v, Langdon (1923: 156) states that “It is on the whole clear that Nibiru (the crossing) refers to the intersection of the celestial equator and the ecliptic and that the name was applied to Jupiter as representative of the planets which cross from the southern to the northern part of the Way of Anu and vice versa.”
.
.
.
.
§3. Discussion and Conclusion
§3.1.
It is likely that the detailed assignment of visible markers of the Crossing to astronomical objects may have evolved over time. It is clear that the Crossing indicates the position of the equinoxes by bisecting the sky. From ca. 5439 to 3050 BC, the equinoxes were present within the visible band of the Milky Way. Assuming an astrological orb of 5°, the ecliptic longitude of Antares was about 185° ca. 2685 BC, so from then to the last currently known tablet whose colophon has been dated (ca. 76 AD), the equinoxes may have been clearly distinguished from the Milky Way.

§3.2. I conclude that the hypothesis that the name Nēbiru may be assigned to any visible astronomical object that marks an equinox is supported by cuneiform evidence.
 
Thx... Since we're dealing with saltwater on a larger planet presumably with a thicker atmosphere I'd assume the pressure is higher than 1.6 GPa, but your diagram says 647K at 22 MPa. What would the critical point be for water at those higher pressures? Since that refers to water close to magma what would happen to the ocean above the magma? I'm picturing a thin layer of water being vaporized rising up thru the water column.
The critical point is the temperature and pressure that a supercritical fluid forms, anything above that will but supercritical. Sarins answer would be the best idea I have of what it would be like.
 
The critical point is the temperature and pressure that a supercritical fluid forms, anything above that will but supercritical. Sarins answer would be the best idea I have of what it would be like.

Do you mean increasing pressure way beyond that point doesn't increase the supercritical temperature? Thats for water close enough to magma to vaporize, not an entire water column dozens of miles deep, right? Venus is very unlike the Earth, rotation is minimal, no magnetic field or water to speak of, and has a thick atmosphere of co2 trapping heat from the Sun. A proto-Earth forming 4-5x further from a dimmer Sun surrounded by water at the frost line would have an ocean long before it grew to a comparable size. Europa shows a deep ocean is possible even on a small world.

In your link, he concludes that Nibiru is not a planet at all. It could not be planet 9. And why is there no record of its passing in the last 6,000 or so years?

§1. Introduction
§1.1.
The Marduk star Nēbiru has long been a source of confusion in scholarly and popular opinion. This article demonstrates cuneiform support for the hypothesis that the name Nēbiru may be assigned to any visible astronomical object that marks an equinox. In a footnote to his translation of Enûma eliš (in the following Ee) tablet v, Langdon (1923: 156) states that “It is on the whole clear that Nibiru (the crossing) refers to the intersection of the celestial equator and the ecliptic and that the name was applied to Jupiter as representative of the planets which cross from the southern to the northern part of the Way of Anu and vice versa.”

§3. Discussion and Conclusion
§3.1.
It is likely that the detailed assignment of visible markers of the Crossing to astronomical objects may have evolved over time. It is clear that the Crossing indicates the position of the equinoxes by bisecting the sky. From ca. 5439 to 3050 BC, the equinoxes were present within the visible band of the Milky Way. Assuming an astrological orb of 5°, the ecliptic longitude of Antares was about 185° ca. 2685 BC, so from then to the last currently known tablet whose colophon has been dated (ca. 76 AD), the equinoxes may have been clearly distinguished from the Milky Way.

§3.2. I conclude that the hypothesis that the name Nēbiru may be assigned to any visible astronomical object that marks an equinox is supported by cuneiform evidence.

They recorded it in their texts as a red-brown object, when they saw it is another matter. Sitchin thinks it came thru the solar system ~3800 BC for a number of reasons, like the beginning of the Nippurian lunar calendar and texts that talk of kingship descending from Heaven and kings lists. That would put it in the vicinity of the onset of the Younger Dryas during an earlier visit. But that would mean it came thru around 200 BC and I dont know how it was recorded. Myths of the disappearing and reappearing god are a common feature and led to the demise of the Aztec empire.

The Enuma Elish describes Nibiru as a location associated with Marduk after he created Heaven and Earth from Tiamat's corpse, it refers to a crossing point which is why my link argues for the equinox. But the text he quotes says Nibiru/Marduk is a red brown object, not any object at the equinox.

I think the authors of the Enuma Elish were facing a similar dilemma as the people writing Genesis, they were dealing with an older story they used to elevate their tribal/city state gods to the role of hero. Marduk for the Babylonians, Ashur for the Assyrians and so on. Tiamat and Nibiru were the combatants but the roles of both were downplayed in Genesis and the Enuma Elish.
 
Do you mean increasing pressure way beyond that point doesn't increase the supercritical temperature? Thats for water close enough to magma to vaporize, not an entire water column dozens of miles deep, right? Venus is very unlike the Earth, rotation is minimal, no magnetic field or water to speak of, and has a thick atmosphere of co2 trapping heat from the Sun. A proto-Earth forming 4-5x further from a dimmer Sun surrounded by water at the frost line would have an ocean long before it grew to a comparable size. Europa shows a deep ocean is possible even on a small world.
That is my understanding. Above that it forms a supercritical fluid which is a distinct state of matter from a liquid or a gas.
 

planet 9 researcher leads a discussion

38 minutes in he gives data for it

5 earth masses
10,000 year period (we're getting it down closer to 3600)
eccentricity 0.25
inclination 20 degrees

The last one caught my eye, I estimated 22 degrees a while back in the thread based on the slope and position of the Great Pyramid - 52 degrees at a latitude of 30 degrees - 22 degrees

at 50 minutes in he is asked about the 6 degree difference between the Sun's equatorial plane and the invariable plane or plane of the planets and he says that looked feasible back in 2016 with their estimates but now that they're fine tuning orbital parameters (reduced earth masses) its unlikely, they get maybe a 1/4 degree of tilt. Problem is they think planet 9 never approaches the inner solar system.
 
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