BB-01 open succession game--fast space race

[Lord Emsworth]

So I have played a few turns. It's 1650 and the Incans have Writing! They are exactly on par with us, i.e. they lack HB, Myst, Math, and IW. Ughhh. We still have 5 turns to CoL and then some for Phil.

There are also some good news. The northwest turns out to not be so barren:

Spoiler :

I am not done yet though. I'll play the rest tomorrow.

 

[brasilbear]

To be honest, its more a combo of a few false steps and then a poor start. take a look at the map. We are on a short river system between mountains to the south and tundra to the north. Without going CxC out settling options were poor. We are bonus grassland poor as well.

The dotmap looks good. The FP location needs to be explored.

I also agree that on monarch, we could almost abandon every city and start over and we'd still won, we just won't do it quickly at this point.

I'm seeing lots of population 1 scientist farms in the tundra/mountains in our future.

good luck lanzealot

What mod gives you the shield runover on the city tag thing? Looks like this warrior 3 (+3)

 

[Kulko]

Well sorry about that. I should definitely have waited longer for more feedback on this point in time.

City locations:
Lets decide C6 when we know a bit more. I would like tit one space farther out, but you are right there might not be enough space.

Curraghs
Counterclockwise also look a bit more likely to find the potential other continent. What do we do when we discover a potential crossing which is not save to sail? Do we set out immediately or do we continue mappoing and wait for a new boat?

 

[templar_x]

However, this statement is a bit exaggerated...

maybe a tiny bit.

t_x

 

[templar_x]

...and then a poor start. take a look at the map. We are on a short river system between mountains to the south and tundra to the north. Without going CxC out settling options were poor. We are bonus grassland poor as well.

sorry, but except the fact that there is tundra in your north, i do not feel that any of this is true.
- the "short river system" is quite a well-developed river system
- the settling options are very ok, and only in 1 or 2 cases CxC was or could have been possible or necessary.
- there are quite a few bonus grasses around.

altogether, this is in my eyes *not* a poor start. most of my HoF-game starts were WORSE than this one. ok, they were played out as military games, but still, a poor start looks very different to me than 2 food ressources, a river and two close luxes...

t_x

 

[brasilbear]

sorry, but except the fact that there is tundra in your north, i do not feel that any of this is true.
- the "short river system" is quite a well-developed river system
- the settling options are very ok, and only in 1 or 2 cases CxC was or could have been possible or necessary.
- there are quite a few bonus grasses around.

altogether, this is in my eyes *not* a poor start. most of my HoF-game starts were WORSE than this one. ok, they were played out as military games, but still, a poor start looks very different to me than 2 food ressources, a river and two close luxes...

t_x

Will you quit bursting my bubble!!! i'd argue on the other hand that we were not going to get 2 good rings (see mountains/tundra), i see 7 bonus grasslands in a possible first core.

yes the two food bonuses, and two luxs close are great. and the more i type the better it does sound. yada yada yada....ok, ok, ok......

I appreciate having you lurking, keeps my head on straight.

 

[templar_x]

sorry i forgot it was again you. it is just my typical reaction when i see a bubble... need... to... burst... it! *ggg*
t_x

 

[templar_x]

Ok, how does this look like:

i like Lanzelots dm.

if there were not these two volcanoes, i would make it quite differently. but one would be very daring to put a FP town next to a volcano, wouldn't he?

only town #4 i would
a) found much later than 4th next
b) found like, 2N. there is not much sense go give it such a low rank number.

t_x

 

[brasilbear]

sorry i forgot it was again you. it is just my typical reaction when i see a bubble... need... to... burst... it! *ggg*
t_x

keep doing it, the bubbles represent weaknesses in my game play and thinking. i've actually learned a little on these 5 pages of posts. i know how to play, now I need the fine tuning that lurkers can bring.

These are the problem areas in my game:

(1) opening worker moves
(2) when to CxC to take advantage of starts
(3) settler first v granary
(4) reading a map beyond the basics

I can win at monarchy consistently, but always notice i could do things faster/better. Don't worry about offending me, its a game. You can burst any bubbles you want.

 

[Lord Emsworth]

OK, here is the turnset:

Spoiler :

Preturn: Mircomanagement

IBT
Babylon grows and completes Settler --> Warrior


1750 (1)
MM and moving units. Portugal and France have Math now. I hope that Henry does not get Writing; may all goody huts be cursed.

IBT
Nineveh completes Warrior --> Worker
Ashur completes Curragh --> Curragh


1700 (2)
Found Ellipi (NewTown1). It is making 2 shields, for now. Start warrior, what with the barbarian threat.
MM and moving units. Decide to move the Curragh CW.

IBT
Indian Warrior comes into sight. Hopefully just exploring.
Babylon completes Warrior --> Settler


1675 (3)
Found Akkad (NewTown2). Just in time to work the wheat for one turn. Another good thing is, Ellipi is still making 2 shieds. Start prebuild for Library or Aqueduct.
MM and moving units.

IBT
French warrior comes into sight
Nineveh completes worker --> Settler (I'm gonna chop a forest.)


1650 (4)
Set Science to 90%.
Akkad gets the cow for one turn.
MM and moving units.
The Incans have Writing! They are exactly on par with us, i.e. they lack HB, Myst, Math, and IW. Ughhh.

IBT
Nada


1625 (5)
MM and moving units.

IBT
Nada


1600 (6)
MM and moving units:

IBT
Two French Warriors poking around.
Babylon completes Settler --> warrior
Ellipi completes Warrior --> Worker


1575 (7)
Hire Scientist in Nineveh, which has no consequences for growth. (Tax: 0%; Science: 90%.) Code of Laws due this turn.
MM and moving units.

IBT
We discover Code of Laws. Phil takes 7 turns at current settings.
Ashur completes Curragh --> Courthouse as prebuild for Library or Harbor


1550 (8)
MM and moving units.

IBT
Forest chop comes in. (Grassland)
Babylon completes Warrior --> Settler
Nineveh completes Settler --> Worker


1525 (9)
Discover Floodplain Wheat in the south.
Science to 100%.
MM and moving units.

IBT
Several units come into view. A Barb Galley, an Indian Warrior/Settler pair, and the Incan Scout.

1500 (10)
Adjust tax rate.
All the rest is still to the next player.

The next player will have to do all the micromanagement for this turn. I haven't moved any units either. We have two Settlers, one of which could settle in place, the other is headed down (or up?) the river, where there are floodplains, forests and stuff.

Screenshot:

Spoiler :

http://forums.civfanatics.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=340467&stc=1&d=1357836869


ETA:
I did no trading as we are headed for the Republic anyway. (And about that first curragh, I sent it CW -- you guys were just too late.)

 

[brasilbear]

I got it. planning post coming soon, post my turns tonight

 

[templar_x]

that town 1N of the fp wheat could work up to 6 (!) mountains, if i count correctly. and then there is that volcano...
t_x

 

[brasilbear]

that town 1N of the fp wheat could work up to 6 (!) mountains, if i count correctly. and then there is that volcano...
t_x

if you can't play on the edge a little.......if worst comes to worst, resettle.

 

[templar_x]

well, i did not mean that *I* would not settle there.

as for the FP, most probably i would not be daring enough for that in a public game. but i have done it before.

t_x

 

[CKS]

I put my 20k city next to a volcano once. It did erupt, but not on my city, luckily.

 

[brasilbear]

Sorry, real life came up and I can't play until Sunday at the earlist. Templar_X? CKS? you guys want to take a quick 10? Show us how its done?

 

[templar_x]

sorry, no, i have not got the time or else i might have considered it. but you do not need me here anyway, as at least Lanzelot and Lord Emsworth are highest level players anyway. Kulko and Elephantium too may not be far behind, or maybe evenly good players, but i simply do not know for sure about their comfort level. anyway, you have got a *very* strong team here playing with you.

but since you are playing this as an open succession game, causes that the normal rule does not apply, that a player can play well above his normal comfort level in a succession game. you communicate little about future plans, game basics that apply here, and so on. therefore even heavy mistakes with a major impact on the further development of the empire do occur, like the wandering of the settler and placement of the deer town.

on monarch your spaceship will start. but seriously, i do not believe that the goal "to start fastest possible" can someway get maintained with that set-up.

t_x

 

[Lanzelot]

Yes, we are not discussing things sufficiently for conducting a real "top quality" game. But that's ok, if we play mainly "for fun". And if we get better at our planning, we may still achieve a halfway decent start date. (BtW: what is the #1 launch date for Monarch, standard map? Just so that we have something for "orientation"... )

Ok, got it. I haven't played since the first turns set, so I guess it's my turn again anyway. Action plan follows later.

 

[Lanzelot]

What mod gives you the shield runover on the city tag thing? Looks like this warrior 3 (+3)

It's CivAssist II.

Ok, here my thoughts so far:

• Tech situation: Everyone except France has Writing now. As we are #1 in commerce, we won't lose the race to Phil now anymore, but there is still the risk of someone poping it from a hut, especially Portugal. So I'd like to minimize that risk as much as possible. We currently have 5 turns left on Phil, and I would like to reduce that to 4 with a moderate use of scientists. OK? My reasoning is: with 1-2 scientists we lose a little food and perhaps a total of 1-2 pop points, but if we lose the sling, it means 20 more turns in Despotism, and I don't need to emphasize how much loss of food, population, income and shields that would mean... It would mean "Game Over" for our aspiration of "fast space ship".
  
  We can sell CoL for quite a few techs. I think we can do it without harm: even if someone is currently researching CoL and would switch to Phil after buying CoL from us, he still won't be able to catch us. And for the huts it has no impact either: a hut always gives the currently cheapest tech and that is always Phil, no matter whether someone already knows CoL or not. So I would go ahead and sell CoL around now.
  
  However, I won't give Writing to France for the next 4 turns. One AI less who could pop Phil from a hut.
  Edit: ah, wait a moment. I can sell Writing to France, because they don't know HB yet and HB is cheaper than Phil. Stupid me.
  Ok, so I will sell everything to everybody, except for HB, which will be known only to Portugal and us. That means the only nation that can pop Phil is Portugal.
  
• Builds: I see two courthouses. I assume, they are prebuilds for libraries? I think this is a bit early at this point of time, because libs only take 40s and the towns are still a bit small to really benefit from a lib?. In Akkad I would switch to another granary, and in Ashur perhaps another curragh (two curraghs stacked won't get attacked from barb galleys, I think?! The northern one could retreat and wait for 3 turns, before continuing as a duo) and then the library. It will still be on time.
• Forbidden Pallace: How about 1S-2SW of Ninive? Here it can use the flood plain and a grassland for quick qrowth and three hills for production. First build would be a temple. I normally don't build temples, as they are a waste of shields, but in this particular case it's ok: we are paying only 30s, and it's the quickest way to get the flood plain and hills into range (don't want to walk more settlers the long way down there, when there are still first-ring spots unsettled), and also we will be able to run that city at a bigger population during the time where it builds the FP. Next builds would then be a courthouse and a market (part-rushed) and then it can generate a sufficiently high shield output to build the FP in a reasonable time.

 

[templar_x]

Forbidden Pallace: How about 1S-2SW of Ninive?

i once saw someone on this forum say: great minds think alike - and fools seldom differ.

that was my suggestion i think 2 pages back

t_x