BETA TEST: History Rewritten 1.24 (K-Mod Merge)

[Xyth]

I've been tinkering with (i.e. scavenging) your civilopedia and noticed that the building section had quite the annoying behavior: when you select a new building, the entire list is redrawn and the scroll bar reset, which is annoying when you are selecting a building down the list as it bumps that building to the lower end of the visible part of the list.

I'm not entirely sure but I think the code doesn't quite recognize the category as being the same (which should avoid a redraw) because of the split categories for buildings. However, if you change the handleInput() method in CvPediaMain to

	def handleInput(self, inputClass):
		if inputClass.getPythonFile() == PEDIA_LEADERS:
			return self.pediaLeader.handleInput(inputClass)

		if inputClass.getButtonType() == WidgetTypes.WIDGET_PEDIA_JUMP_TO_HR_BUILDING:
			self.pediaJump(PEDIA_BUILDINGS, inputClass.getData1(), True, [B]False[/B])
		elif inputClass.getButtonType() == WidgetTypes.WIDGET_PEDIA_JUMP_TO_RESOURCE:
			self.pediaJump(PEDIA_RESOURCES, inputClass.getData1(), True, True)

		return 0

It works fine (True to False, in bold). I suppose the bIsLink isn't required in this case. I've tried it from a couple configurations and other ways of linking to buildings (text link, button links) still work without problems.

This was on my todo list to fix. Cheers!

 

[rsab]

Hi Xyth,

I've been long time out of this mod.
Now I've started a new game, and I'm still having an AI that spawns Workboats like crazy.

Waiting for the upcoming releases of this mod, thanks!

 

[JustAnotherNerd]

Hey, I was playing recently 1.23 version and in comparision to it AI in 1.24 is indeed smarter. Smart enough to suddenly attack your least defended city and just raze it! I was really pretty surprised. I even started 4 games, finished only two though - Russia and England.
But in my last game I was playing Pheonicia and on entering global era (research Marketing) I'm getting CTD with some windows error message, I don't know, not an expert here.
I also have not finished my Portugal game. CTD with an error aswell, maybe the same error, not sure, was a while ago already.

And I also noticed, that ( well at least it feels so) chance to find a resource is less than in 1.23. For all improvements. Say in 1.23 from 12 maybe plantations in south america I found like 8 resources, also as in orchards, farms, mines. I found spices already in my first orchard next turn after I bult it.
And now it's like 5 maybe resorces for entire game.
Honestly finding a resource was quite exciting and even important for selfsustainability and everything.

 

[AbsintheRed]

And I also noticed, that ( well at least it feels so) chance to find a resource is less than in 1.23. For all improvements. Say in 1.23 from 12 maybe plantations in south america I found like 8 resources, also as in orchards, farms, mines. I found spices already in my first orchard next turn after I bult it.
And now it's like 5 maybe resorces for entire game.
Honestly finding a resource was quite exciting and even important for selfsustainability and everything.

While I agree that founding resources is fun, 8 resources from 12 plantations is waaaaay too much.

 

[rsab]

Here a saved game were you can see the amounth of workboats that AI is spawning. You can see the Egyptians, e.g.

Later on the same game I keep exploring and also the Dutch and Aztecs have so many workboats. I'm playing on a Mac, and the mod version 1.24.

 

[lindsay40k]

Is the AI's spawning of workboats related to its limited understanding of same-continent naval strategy? The standard Earth 18 Civs map is notorious for the Inca never settling beyond their mountain-locked corridor, because the AI will not put a Settler in a Galley to reach a location on the same continent. Could the AI also have an 'if there is an unexplored tile that could be reached by a workboat, and there is not a workboat on exploration orders and capable of reaching the tile, build a workboat' behaviour that's clashing with an 'if it is impossible for a workboat to reveal any unexplored tiles, keep it in dock' behaviour?

 

[Xyth]

But in my last game I was playing Pheonicia and on entering global era (research Marketing) I'm getting CTD with some windows error message, I don't know, not an expert here.
I also have not finished my Portugal game. CTD with an error aswell, maybe the same error, not sure, was a while ago already.

Next time you get such a crash, please post the crash log here so I can see if it's something I need to fix.

And I also noticed, that ( well at least it feels so) chance to find a resource is less than in 1.23. For all improvements. Say in 1.23 from 12 maybe plantations in south america I found like 8 resources, also as in orchards, farms, mines. I found spices already in my first orchard next turn after I bult it.
And now it's like 5 maybe resorces for entire game.
Honestly finding a resource was quite exciting and even important for selfsustainability and everything.

While I agree that founding resources is fun, 8 resources from 12 plantations is waaaaay too much.

I haven't made any recent changes to the rate of discovery, and K-mod doesn't make any changes to the relevant code either. Probably down to luck, but I'll keep an eye on it.

Here a saved game were you can see the amounth of workboats that AI is spawning. You can see the Egyptians, e.g.

Later on the same game I keep exploring and also the Dutch and Aztecs have so many workboats. I'm playing on a Mac, and the mod version 1.24.

Cheers. If I can't figure out the root cause I'll just prevent the AI cities building more when they've already got some out and about.

Is the AI's spawning of workboats related to its limited understanding of same-continent naval strategy? The standard Earth 18 Civs map is notorious for the Inca never settling beyond their mountain-locked corridor, because the AI will not put a Settler in a Galley to reach a location on the same continent. Could the AI also have an 'if there is an unexplored tile that could be reached by a workboat, and there is not a workboat on exploration orders and capable of reaching the tile, build a workboat' behaviour that's clashing with an 'if it is impossible for a workboat to reveal any unexplored tiles, keep it in dock' behaviour?

No, the problem with excessive workboats is fairly recent. If that was the issue we'd have noticed it long before now.

 

[Xyth]

Sorry for the slow responses and lack of updates recently. Life has been unexpectedly busy, and I'm in a bit of a rut over how to best code the AI for share trading (buying is easy, but selling is a real challenge). May have to rethink or scale things back a bit.

 

[cel10]

This may not be anything that K-Mod changed (I'm not very familiar with it, and only just started playing this beta yesterday), but I've been growing irritated with how much AI players expect to be able to ask me for. The minute I research Writing I immediately get a flood of AI players asking me for free tech handouts, and then getting permanent diplo penalties when I refuse. (Later, when they have the sense to offer me money or other tech in return, I'm allowed to refuse without hurting their feelings ...??) They also love to ask for trade embargoes once every few turns (you have Open Borders with someone I hate, how dare you!!!11) and war assistance against civs I have no reason to fight -- so by mid-game, even if I'm generally trying to mind my own business, I have anywhere from -2 to -6 penalties with most civs simply for not being absurdly generous and/or warmongering. This seems ... excessive (especially given that they can ask regardless of diplo level, whereas I can only even hope to trade for tech etc at Pleased or above). Am I truly a bad person for not giving free tech to all my neighbors, or can anything be changed here?

I do play on easier difficulties because I enjoy winning, so it may be my own fault for actually being ahead of everyone else in the tech tree...

Otherwise, I'm very much enjoying the update and HR is excellent as always

 

[rsab]

Hi Xyth,

I've noticed that some Quests needs to be adjusted to the mod....

E.g. the Noble Knights Quest is related to the Organized Religion Civic, which is not available in this mod.

Thanks!

 

[cel10]

No, the problem with excessive workboats is fairly recent. If that was the issue we'd have noticed it long before now.

I noticed in a couple of recent games that the build suggestions for my cities would occasionally suggest workboats, when I had no unimproved water resources anywhere in my territory. The suggestion would go away upon entering/leaving the city but it was very interesting -- the build suggestions almost never have included workboats in the past, even when there were resources, sometimes even within the city limits, that could have used one. Perhaps this is related?

 

[Xyth]

This may not be anything that K-Mod changed (I'm not very familiar with it, and only just started playing this beta yesterday), but I've been growing irritated with how much AI players expect to be able to ask me for. The minute I research Writing I immediately get a flood of AI players asking me for free tech handouts, and then getting permanent diplo penalties when I refuse. (Later, when they have the sense to offer me money or other tech in return, I'm allowed to refuse without hurting their feelings ...??) They also love to ask for trade embargoes once every few turns (you have Open Borders with someone I hate, how dare you!!!11) and war assistance against civs I have no reason to fight -- so by mid-game, even if I'm generally trying to mind my own business, I have anywhere from -2 to -6 penalties with most civs simply for not being absurdly generous and/or warmongering. This seems ... excessive (especially given that they can ask regardless of diplo level, whereas I can only even hope to trade for tech etc at Pleased or above). Am I truly a bad person for not giving free tech to all my neighbors, or can anything be changed here?

I do play on easier difficulties because I enjoy winning, so it may be my own fault for actually being ahead of everyone else in the tech tree...

Leaders each have different settings about how often they'll contact you for and what for. So it depends a lot on who you get each game. I haven't reviewed these settings for ages though.

Hi Xyth,

I've noticed that some Quests needs to be adjusted to the mod....

E.g. the Noble Knights Quest is related to the Organized Religion Civic, which is not available in this mod.

Ah yeah, it requires Orthodoxy, which no longer exists. I'll switch it to Warrior Code. Let me know if you spot any others. In some cases the requirements have been updated but the text descriptions may not have been.

I noticed in a couple of recent games that the build suggestions for my cities would occasionally suggest workboats, when I had no unimproved water resources anywhere in my territory. The suggestion would go away upon entering/leaving the city but it was very interesting -- the build suggestions almost never have included workboats in the past, even when there were resources, sometimes even within the city limits, that could have used one. Perhaps this is related?

Related for sure. Something is causing the AI (including advisors) to think workboats are useful when they're not.

 

[rsab]

Just a couple of things more:

1) I'm not able to find in civilopedia any info about the Legendary culture requeriments. I mean, when does a city becomes Legendary? What's the required amounth of culture? I suspect it changes depending on the map size.

2) There's a tenet which I think it should be improved with major benefits. It's Salvation. The +1 faith from combat victory over heathen units it's too low. Considering it doesn't happen so often as having crop, luxury or material resources. Even this kind of combat only take place in specific moments (being in war against over heathen civs), in conjunctural situations, while changing tenets it's a decision which lasts for long time (since you need to get a Great Prophet).

3) Sometimes I feel I would use an option still more severe than the Fewer Religions option (e.g. half religions than civilizations).

I hope I expressed correctly.

thanks!

 

[cel10]

Every time I open the domestic advisor in this save, I get this error (I'm playing on Windows 10):

Spoiler :

 

[Xyth]

1) I'm not able to find in civilopedia any info about the Legendary culture requeriments. I mean, when does a city becomes Legendary? What's the required amounth of culture? I suspect it changes depending on the map size.

It scales with gamespeed: 25000 on Quick, 50000 on Normal, 75000 on Epic, 100000 on Saga, 125000 on Marathon, 150000 on Odyssey.

Bugged on Marathon at the moment though, accidentally set to 1250000.

2) There's a tenet which I think it should be improved with major benefits. It's Salvation. The +1 faith from combat victory over heathen units it's too low. Considering it doesn't happen so often as having crop, luxury or material resources. Even this kind of combat only take place in specific moments (being in war against over heathen civs), in conjunctural situations, while changing tenets it's a decision which lasts for long time (since you need to get a Great Prophet).

It's definitely situational, but can generate a lot of faith quite quickly when the situation is right. Not for every playstyle. I'll have a think about it.

3) Sometimes I feel I would use an option still more severe than the Fewer Religions option (e.g. half religions than civilizations).

For what reason?

Every time I open the domestic advisor in this save, I get this error (I'm playing on Windows 10):

Spoiler :

This error has been happening for a while, still trying to solve it. Something to do with free specialists.

 

[rsab]

For what reason?

Because sometimes too much religions create a mess in the game, specially in mid-late game if there have been spawned new civs from civil wars. Also it would prevent the AI to found new religions when it's not necessary/helpful to them.

Changing the topic:

Since the trade routes with foreign cities also imports culture, for me sometimes it's difficult to know if having more trade routes (building lighthouses, post offices...) it's worth or not. I mean, if the imported culture it's too high (affecting to the city dissent) maybe the commerce generated it's not enough benefit. May I think that if I'm a strong cultural civ it's worth to have trade routes (because I will export culture to other civs, and the culture imported won't affect so much to me) and if I'm weak in culture it's not worth?
For me it's being a difficult mechanic to control.

Thanks again Xyth!

 

[rsab]

It scales with gamespeed: 25000 on Quick, 50000 on Normal, 75000 on Epic, 100000 on Saga, 125000 on Marathon, 150000 on Odyssey.

It would be nice if it's described in the "Victory Conditions" or "Culture" entrance in the civilopedia.

 

[cel10]

It's definitely situational, but can generate a lot of faith quite quickly when the situation is right. Not for every playstyle. I'll have a think about it.

Maybe +1 faith from any combat victory (not just heathen units)?

 

[Xyth]

Because sometimes too much religions create a mess in the game, specially in mid-late game if there have been spawned new civs from civil wars.

A mess in what way though? Non-state religions causing unhappiness and dissent in cities is intentional and something you have to manage. In terms of diplomacy, the religious bloc effect of each civilization having its own religion has been lessened via the Tenet system.

Since the trade routes with foreign cities also imports culture, for me sometimes it's difficult to know if having more trade routes (building lighthouses, post offices...) it's worth or not. I mean, if the imported culture it's too high (affecting to the city dissent) maybe the commerce generated it's not enough benefit. May I think that if I'm a strong cultural civ it's worth to have trade routes (because I will export culture to other civs, and the culture imported won't affect so much to me) and if I'm weak in culture it's not worth?
For me it's being a difficult mechanic to control.

The benefits of adding new trade routes will almost always outweigh any negative effects from imported culture. More commerce means more ability to combat dissent via the sliders too.

It would be nice if it's described in the "Victory Conditions" or "Culture" entrance in the civilopedia.

I might just add it to the culture bar tooltip, that way I can list the values for each culture level, relevant to the current game.

Maybe +1 faith from any combat victory (not just heathen units)?

I think that might be too strong. Will think about it.

 

[rsab]

A mess in what way though? Non-state religions causing unhappiness and dissent in cities is intentional and something you have to manage. In terms of diplomacy, the religious bloc effect of each civilization having its own religion has been lessened via the Tenet system

Ok. The only thing to avoid in my opinion is the AI behaviour that pushes to found a religion everytime there is one available, even in these situations that could bring more negative effects than positive (e.g when the Civ already has adopted a religion that is present in almost all of the owned cities). But I imagine that teaching the AI to evaluate the context in these cases would be very difficult to apply.
The idea to add the '1/2 religions than civs' option it could be a rude way to compensate this. But not sure even myself.

The benefits of adding new trade routes will almost always outweigh any negative effects from imported culture. More commerce means more ability to combat dissent via the sliders too.

Right. Totally agree. I didn't though that way, now I see.

Thanks!