BNH02- Thats one small step....

Pre-flight…
3550 BC

IBT: 3 German archers and a spear are headed in New York’s general direction.

Turn 1: 3500 BC
Nothing

IBT: German forces move closer

Turn 2: 3450 BC
Nothing

IBT: German’s declare war and burn New York.

Turn 3: 3400 BC
Nothing

IBT: Washington, warrior to spear
Turn 4: 3350 BC
Nothing

IBT: Nothing
Turn 5: 3300 AD
Just busting fog

IBT: Nothing
Turn 6: 3250 AD
Nothing

IBT: Chinese warrior grabs a goody hut I was looking at. We’re up Pottery on the Chinese
Turn 7: 3200 AD
Nothing

IBT:
Turn 8: 3150 AD

IBT: Three German archers are coming for Washington.
Washington spear to spear
Turn9 3100 AD
They won’t talk to us

IBT: Nothing
Turn 10, 3050 AD
Built a road and busted some fog.
 
Oh JB, you are living in interesting time indeed.

New York was an empty city that encroaches on the native 21 tile of an enemy capital. In fact, it was not just anyone's capital, it was Otto von Bismarck's capital :eek: . The city had a big " :spank: me please " sign painted on its naked bottom, and Otto was only too happy to oblige...

Well, good bye New York. We :love: ya, but we hardly know ya :shakehead:

I've downloaded the save. It looks like whom ever takes the game next should whip the wall in Washington ASAP. We will have a spear and a warrior in the city, against 3 German archers. I'd say the odds are 50/50 :help: .
 
There should be time to whip the wall as it looks like the archers are going to approach from the opposite side of the river and then from the hill. Try and get their attention and see if we can pay 'em off.

There was never any chance to save New York. I tried offering Bismarck a 1gpt gift but he refused. He was single mindedly interested in burning the city. And with a pop of 1 there wasn't any chance to rush a unit.
 
Umm, why didnt you just disband NY, then we wouldnt be in this situation.
 
..................................

BigNHuge said:
Turn [9] 3600BC- We move scouts and pop a hut. We get New York deep into German land. If we can get a unit there and some early culture we may just hold it!

What's missing from this description is that you got a settler and decided to found an unprotected city in the middle of an agressive Civ playing at DG.

BigNHuge said:
Analysis- I did 10 turns instead of 15. To discuss things. We have 2 cities and have some options. So lets discuss. That second city is both a blessing and a curse.

Should have played just 3 more turns then you could have abandoned the city you founded.
 
Originally Posted by BigNHuge
Turn [9] 3600BC- We move scouts and pop a hut. We get New York deep into German land. If we can get a unit there and some early culture we may just hold it!



What's missing from this description is that you got a settler and decided to found an unprotected city in the middle of an agressive Civ playing at DG.

No i would NEVER found there. I actually POPPED a city. This is possible you know.

On the abandon issue i didnt want to offend you. Sorry
 
BigNHuge said:
No i would NEVER found there. I actually POPPED a city. This is possible you know.

On the abandon issue i didnt want to offend you. Sorry

Didn't know you could get a barb camp to just flip. I don't ever remember that happening.

Sorry to get pissy.

I agree that abandoning the city would have been a better option. Because I thought you planted it there for a reason I held out hope that the tender-hearted Germans would walk on past.

And yes, we're now in a bit of a mess. If the archers attack the game is over and I don't know that we have enough to pay them off.
 
Don't argue "What if" and certainly don't "you should have" and "you shouldn't have". We were given a city and immediately the Germans attacked it. So what ??? Play with what you've got now, there is no use looking back.
There was no way building a worker or settler could have been quick enough for the city to auto-abandon. Yes it could have been abandoned, but it wasn't. Big deal! It wasn't even completely certain the Germans were coming for us; they could have been just barb-hunting and abandoning a city if they were only barb-hunting would have been really silly and a sign of paranoia.

Let's look at it from a positive side; the Germans did a RoP-rape type; declaring with units in our territory. If we survive the Germans are out as competitiors for the tech-race. Just play on and forget it.
 
Rik, you are up! Show them whos boss
 
Rik Meleet said:
Don't argue "What if" and certainly don't "you should have" and "you shouldn't have". We were given a city and immediately the Germans attacked it. So what ??? Play with what you've got now, there is no use looking back.

I concur.

Hind-sight is always 20/20. While reading JB's turns, I thought that disbanding the city was the best thing to do, but, I also knew that if I were playing, there is no way that I could have thought of that tactic. I would have thought: oh, barb hunters. Good, come-on-through. How about some nice Napa Valley wine while you're here...

Hey, chuck one up for experience.

And Rik, good luck :goodjob:
 
IHT: I'm going to teach those Germans a lesson !
Otto; Repeat after me:

A is for Attack - that makes people mad,
B is for Blunder - for which you'll pay bad.
C is for City - the thing you have razed,
D is for Defense - motivated and crazed.
E is for Endeavour - We'll try really hard,
F is for forgiveness - which we don't have in our heart.
G is for German - confusing stupidity with might,
H is for Hatred - which you started to light.


Washington, 1 reg spear + 1 reg warrior against 3 reg archers. Combat analysor states that without a wall the spear has 54% chance of winning.
With a wall 70%. Assuming (with a wall) we loose 1 HP, the spear then still has a 50% chance of winning. Then the warrior has 40% chance of winning. This means if the spear dies in the first or 2nd attack, we will most likely die.
That means a wall will give us at max 30% + 21% = 41% chance the spear will die in the first or 2nd attack, if it doesn't loose any HP and promotes.
Realistic is to expect to loose 1 HP in the first attack, bringing the chance to 51%.

If instead I don't build walls, but instead rush a spear; the chance of loosing both spears in the first to attacks is 21%. That's what I'll do then. Rush a spear for the cost of 1 citizen.

IBT: Chinese want our scouting unit out -> Sorry, just fleei--- err routine training missions.
the 3 spears move accross the river next to Washington.
Washington finishes the spear, starts another.

[1] 3000 BC. Fortify spear. We meet Russia, they have nothing interesting. Germans refuse peace.
I just hope I have my calculations right ...

IBT: Battle for Washington
3/3 archer Vs 3/3 Spear -> Spear wins flawlessly
3/3 archer Vs 3/3 Spear -> archer wins, loosing 1 HP
Attacked stopped. Palace expands. Our cave gets stairs.

[2] 2950 BC. Scout, but don't do anything to Washington.

IBT: 2/3 archer leaves our lands, a spear moves onto our improved BG. Russia demands our troops out. OK

[3] 2900 BC. Scouting. Germany demands everything we have for peace. He hasn't been learning his lesson, it seems.

I is for injury - which you added to insult,
J is for Justice - your death the result.
K is for Killing - your head on a pole,
L is for Life - Just survival our goal.
M is for our Money - in which you won't dulge,
N is for Nuts - like in "Battle of the Bulge".
O is for Out - Get out; get out you,
P is for pillage - What you'll instead do.


IBT: What a talented visor am I; the Germans pillaged our mined BG.

[4] 2850 BC. Move worker to grassland tile to mine.
No trades possible, Germany still demands everything for our survival. "Nuts" is my reply. If you wait till 1944 the American future 101st Airborne Acting Commander, BG General McAuliffe, will tell you the same. Get used to it !!

IBT: the Germans regroup and now have 2 reg archers and 1 reg spear in striking distance. I'm not afraid.
Russia demands our scout out. OK

[5] 2800 BC. Our defenses are: 3/3 spear and 3/3 warrior, with a spear due next turn. If we can just hold out against the archers. I think we can.

IBT: ARRGHH !! First archer kills our spear, getting 1 scratch himself.
3/3 reg archer Vs 3/3 reg warrior. Strike 1 to the archer. Strike 2 to the archer. 3/3 archer Vs 1/3 warrior. But he wins 3 strikes in a row and the archer is out. The warrior promotes. Due to the dropped number of MP's the spear isn't finished and instead Washington riots. Just what we needed the most.

[6] 2750 BC. Germany still demands everything for peace. No. We're not going to pay for your war; even if we die. Checked the calculator: if the 2/3 archer attacks; we have a 53% chance of winning the battle.

IBT: Germans leave our lands to heal, Spear finishes. Phew... that was close

[7] 2710 BC. Fortify Spear and start another.
Peace is still too expensive.

[8] 2670 BC. Whip a spear. Move our scouts south again. The lone warrior near Russia is going back to Germany as a distraction force.
Germany still demands too much. He can't seen to learn.

Q is for Quickly - quickly leave our lands,
R is for revenge - or we'll kill you with our bare hands.
S is for Surrender - What we'll never do,
T is for tribute - And this we won't too.
U is for U.S. - The nation we still are,
V is for victory - not close, still very far.
W is for Washington - It's ours and not from you,
X is for Xtremes - What you've put us through.
Y is for Yankees - We will not be slaved,
Z is for Zulus - like who you've behaved.


IBT: Warrior joins the archer/spear army group and another warrior/spear move in as well. Washington builds spear, starts walls.

[9] 2630 BC. Worker finishes mine and starts roading.

IBT: archer+warrior+spear (all 3/3) move to Washington. I do not fear them; we have 2 reg spears and 1 vet warrior. In 3 turns we'll have walls. Germans send in reinforecements consisting of 2 reg spears and 1 vet warrior. Our warrior near Leipzig is drawing attention as a vet archer is chasing him.

[10] 2590 BC. Fortified on plains our warrior stands 18% chance of victory, fortified on a hill he has only 28% chance of survival. On a mountain only 40%. He flees south. And spots silks.

Next player can decide whether to pop-rush walls or not.

The Save 2590 BC

Our_land_2590BC.JPG
 
Gravy. SJ, Defend American Honor!
 
The brilliant, courageous, resourceful general Rik Meleet has stonewalled the German attacks (there were also rumors that he went "nuts", but we don't believe in such none-sense :) ). Otto has had his fill of the alphabet soup, and our fledging nation is safe, for now.


I've downloaded the save. A peace treaty would be really good, but it looks to be a long way away -- our entire economy still only gets an "impossible" from Otto. We will need to kill a few Germen units in order for that to go down. The most immediate danger, however, appears to be the 2 Germen spears arriving in the area. We can't afford to let them pillage us back into the stone ages. Looks like more spears are needed to cover up the important tiles.

However, we are already paying 3gpt in unit support and barely breaking even. The way to help that situation, other than losing units :mischief: , will be to build more cities. I will try to sneak a settler out of Washington if I can. In order to accomplish that, I will have to try to pull the AI puppet string with our units in the North. In some rules, that would be called an exploit, but I don't see much options here.

We are currently researching Ironworking at min (28 turns). We aren't likely to get it before the Germens do. Do we shut it off, gathering more cash, or continue it, hoping to eventually broker it into something of value?

Anyhow, I've got the game. I think my goal for the turn will be:

1) survive
2) try not to get pillaged
3) setup a force of 2 spears+settler to found a city on a hill somewhere.
4) peace, if possible.

Comments? I'll play later tonight.
 
id say, turn off IW and buy techs from other techs from civs. But thats just me.
 
Also, when we capture the capital of Germany, i say we rename it New York. Just for respect for the fallen. :beer: to the homies that fell.
 
SJ Frank said:
I've downloaded the save. A peace treaty would be really good, but it looks to be a long way away -- our entire economy still only gets an "impossible" from Otto.
If you click on peace treaty and ask what Germany wants for a peace-treaty he will come up with a demand (no haggling) of all our gold. I'm just too stubborn to accept that.

Just continue the game as an Always-War variant for now. There is nothing that cripples an AI as an early war. You can already see this; Germany has fewer cities than China and Russia.

My thoughts: Build defense (walls, barracks, spearmen and archers) and then try to sneak out a settler with defenders. To our south is still some unexplored lands.

And about pillaging; If the archers are gone; a simple spear placed on the tile is enough to prevent pillaging.
 
Hmmm. This might end up where were sitting on 4-5 cities for a long while. Were gonna have troublesome times ahead gentlemen. All I can say is, if we go down, By God were taking the Germans with us. :lol:

Seriously. SJ, the future is in your hands. If we fail, well, I guess Im making BNH03 WAY ahead of time. :ar15: Germany.
 
Rik Meleet said:
If you click on peace treaty and ask what Germany wants for a peace-treaty he will come up with a demand (no haggling) of all our gold. I'm just too stubborn to accept that.

Aha, I didn't know that.

Rik Meleet said:
And about pillaging; If the archers are gone; a simple spear placed on the tile is enough to prevent pillaging.

I wonder if a warrior can do the same job.

It's good to know that we can make peace. I will probably do that sometime during my turns. With 3 spears, 2 warriors and only 1 archer, our city is safer than our improvements. I'm tempted to swap the wall to granary now, then make peace with the Germans at the last possible second. We'll see how it goes.

It is our 1CC vs the German 2CC right now. I'd much rather have an 5CC vs 10 CC situation.
 
Back
Top Bottom