Brave New World's 9 new Civs

[blackcatatonic]

Eww no @ the possibility of another shoehorned-in female leader.

I like the idea that it might instead refer to the UA, though.

As someone who knows pretty much nothing about NA civilisations or cultures, I can't pretend I'm jumping up and down with excitement at the possibility of another one being added to the game, but there are worthy candidates that fit the alphabet criteria, and it's definitely preferable to yet another Euro Civ being added.

 

[Death Dragon]

Would you mind providing screenshot complete with the visible sender email address?
Quote the entire thing for us to look at. If you say you deleted it, I will sigh in disappointment.

If he now shows you the email then what would be the point of deleting the thread?
If he was asked to delete the thread then obviously he's also asked to not show that email.
Anyway in the end this is just a game and in some days they'll officially release the information anyway, so there's really no reason to demand evidence for everything.

 

[blackcatatonic]

That would definitely be better option. After Theodora and Dido Im still rather skeptical that they dont go for Sacagawea.

I have said this before, but if they really wanted more female leaders, there would have been good choices for several in-game Civs. Egypt, Ethiopia, Denmark, Sweden etc.

The fact that they passed up several good opportunities for female leaders with BNW Civs revealed so far (Tribhuwana for Indonesia, Jadwiga for Poland, arguably Kahina for Morocco) does suggest that we have a female leader still to come. Then again, it's possible that the developers could have taken note of all the criticism that came about from the choice of a mythological queen (Dido) and a non-regnant (Theodora) in G&K, and decided to keep female leaders to a minimum this time.

Although if they are only adding one new female leader, Maria I still feels like an odd choice.

 

[Menzies]

But now.. new informations about 2 civs from polish user Dyktator http://forums.civ.org.pl/viewtopic.php?TopicID=19411&page=17#304263

hmm latest news from Firaxis --> Vietnam and Vatican City? :|

Clearly false as both have already been ruled out.

 

[Leugi]

hmm an Idea just came to me thanks to your post. While I know next to nothing about Shoshone history, I find it hard to believe that there isn't a more suitable leader than Sacagawea. But what if Sacagawea was not the leader, but essentially the UA (assuming this speculation is even half correct and the Shoshone are in BnW). Her help on the L&C expedition does allow for a civ with some abilities to go with the new exploration mechanic. "Sacagawea's Journey" as a UA?

This is something to hope for... And, should there have been a leaking reviewer, which explains the fast delete, he could have messed up the UA with the leader for leaking things in a hurry.

 

[HKY09]

If he now shows you the email then what would be the point of deleting the thread?
If he was asked to delete the thread then obviously he's also asked to not show that email.
Anyway in the end this is just a game and in some days they'll officially release the information anyway, so there's really no reason to demand evidence for everything.

But how do we know for sure?
He could be lying - has anyone actually seen the thread close?

 

[Gucumatz]

Clearly false as both have already been ruled out.

If this is the same user who posted about the Shoshone, I feel happier now - since then it appears it would just be an illogical rumor rather than fact

 

[Al-Iskander]

I think I might be OK with the Shoshone. The Wikipedia article on the Shoshone (for what it's worth) suggests that the Shoshone, Paiute, and Comanche peoples are very closely related. If we accept a "Shoshone" civilization as a "blob" covering all three groups, it could be quite large, territorially. For example:

Map comes from here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uto-Aztecan_languages

I'm no cartography expert, but that looks bigger than Venice and all of its colonies combined There are, of course, many other reasons to champion their inclusion, but this alone makes a "Shoshone Empire" a pretty neat concept.

Edit: Also, wikivenitian purple?

 

[Menzies]

If this is the same user who posted about the Shoshone, I feel happier now - since then it appears it would just be an illogical rumor rather than fact

I wouldn't read too much into the Shoshone rumour anyhow. What does worry me is that they pretty much hit the brief on the money for the kind of Civ you'd expect though, right down to being able to shoehorn in some more female leaders.

 

[ImperialChaos]

What I don't like about Sacagawea is the precedence it would set for picking leaders of civilizations. I mean she had nothing to do with the founding, political, or military of the Shoshone tribe. She just helped Americans know what they were expanding into. If she gets picked what is the actual limit for future leaders? Paul McCartney of the English Empire?

 

[TimeWeaver]

Menzies: Indeed, it's just a rumour for now, although plausible. It's rather the chain of circumstantial pieces that ring of Firaxis' logics that make me think it could well be the missing civ after Venice.

Al-Iskander: And that map is pretty convincing too.

 

[Gucumatz]

Oh great Paul McCartney. You lead the British Invasion of the United States bringing generations of Americans down to their knees and shaping their world. Will you once again make the English relevant, will you make a band that lasts the test of time?

 

[Death Dragon]

But how do we know for sure?
He could be lying - has anyone actually seen the thread close?

Who cares if he's lying.
Can't you wait for a few days to see if it's true or not?
Civfanatics is all about speculation anyway.

 

[Homusubi]

Who would Japan have... Shigeru Miyamoto?

 

[Talcove]

What I don't like about Sacagawea is the precedence it would set for picking leaders of civilizations. I mean she had nothing to do with the founding, political, or military of the Shoshone tribe. She just helped Americans know what they were expanding into. If she gets picked what is the actual limit for future leaders? Paul McCartney of the English Empire?

Or better yet, Michael Jackson/Johnny Cash/Elvis Presley of the United States.
Johann Sebastian Bach of the German Empire.
Justin Beiber of Canada... Yeah, and you that Canada alone would be bad.

 

[Loaf Warden]

As someone who knows pretty much nothing about NA civilisations or cultures, I can't pretend I'm jumping up and down with excitement at the possibility of another one being added to the game,

The game needs more Native American civs. It always has. Though they've been pretty good about including Mesoamerica and the Inca (and America as the one post-colonial civ), they've tended to ignore the rest of the American landmass. So far they've only ever had one token Native American civ at a time apart from those. And while I understand the argument against including more (they tended not to build cities, so to what extent they could be called "civilizations" is debatable), it still feels like a glaring omission to have such a geographically enormous and culturally diverse area get glossed over so much when they're so eager to throw in every country Europe ever had, apparently now even including Venice. I don't know how believable this Shoshone thing is, and if the leader really is Sacagawea I'll get a concussion from banging my head on the wall, but I will be thrilled to have another Native American civ if they're in. I would have been thrilled with the Pueblo, and if it's the Sioux or the Shawnee instead, or heck, the Tlingit or the Tupi, I'll be just as thrilled.

Or to put it another way, even if it is the Shoshone, this expansion alone still has more Europeans than the entire game has Native Americans from outside the traditional Mesoamerican/Andean regions. This needs to be fixed.

 

[Hans Castorp]

Or better yet, Michael Jackson/Johnny Cash/Elvis Presley of the United States.
Johann Sebastian Bach of the German Empire.
Justin Beiber of Canada... Yeah, and you that Canada alone would be bad.

Don't be ridiculous - Canada is a shoe-in for an obvious female leader: Celine Dion.

 

[wigwam]

I don't think Sacagawea is any worse of a leader choice than the Shoshone are as a civ. It's not like Joan of Arc and Cleopatra in Civ 3, where they took spots away from more deserving leaders (including a more deserving female Egyptian leader). Why do you think everybody's talking about Sacagawea already, even though the rumor doesn't mention her?

Because she's the only Shoshone any of us could name off the top of our heads.

The game is counter-factual fantasy. If the Shoshone—who in reality were never a settled, urban people—are going to found a city in the year 4000 BC, invent Christianity, and eventually build a huge army of tanks and invade Thailand, why shouldn't Sacagawea lead them? She had exactly as much experience leading a nation-state as any Shoshone did.

 

[Menzies]

Don't be ridiculous - Canada is a shoe-in for an obvious female leader: Celine Dion.

I'd probably still stick with Bieber.

 

[Talcove]

Don't be ridiculous - Canada is a shoe-in for an obvious female leader: Celine Dion.

Are you forgetting Kim Campbell? A four month term is all you need to lead Canada in a Civ game!