Buce01: The Slavemaster

[Bucephalus]

Certainly a war would liven things up. We are just cruising to the finish now. My only concern is WW. I'd like to see this finish sooner than later and the happy slider would cut into our research quite a bit.

Can we wipe out his force with units on hand? If so, we can boot him, get him to declare and get some War Happiness out of it while we mount an invasion. If not, then I guess we'd have to abandon the cities. I suppose we could still boot him for the war declaration and then load up everything we have in one town hoping to hold out until reinforcements arrive.

I think a landing force shouldn't take too long as we have at least 4 transports on hand and a ton of arty and infantry. I suppose we have a bunch of coin too for upgrades.

I guess, if the war was a short, well-planned strike, we don't lose anything other than some cash. I'm in.

Tusker quoted thus:

I have enough defensive forces to guarantee that we won't lose a city,

Let's do a feasability study; we are losing three lux's anyway - we could look at taking them from Willie. I'll take a look in a while.

 

[Elephantium]

You know what(?) - I'm sick of Willy; he's just pulled the same stunt in my solo game.

Does anyone fancy livening up this game with a trip to Amsterdam?

Tusker: how soon could we put together a credible landing force?

We have 2- and 3- turn Bombers, Mech Inf, and even MAs in our core and much of our middle ring. Taking into account the need to build a few Destroyers and Transports, I think we can have a credible landing force by the end of my turnset.

Certainly a war would liven things up. We are just cruising to the finish now. My only concern is WW. I'd like to see this finish sooner than later and the happy slider would cut into our research quite a bit.

Agreed, this war is annoying because it will slow down our research!

Can we wipe out his force with units on hand?

Well, we have six arty, four or five cavs, a Guerilla, and 4 or so Infantry. Plus a Destroyer, he could bombard their stack, too, I suppose. Finally...two Cav armies. I have the cav armies out in the open and everyone else in the town they threaten; this way their cavs can only reach the one town this IT.

I think a landing force shouldn't take too long as we have at least 4 transports on hand and a ton of arty and infantry. I suppose we have a bunch of coin too for upgrades.

I guess, if the war was a short, well-planned strike, we don't lose anything other than some cash. I'm in.

I was thinking more along the lines of "wipe out Willie". I'd also like to turn this into a world war (Portugal, Egypt, Arabia, and us vs. Willie).

Let's do a feasability study; we are losing three lux's anyway - we could look at taking them from Willie. I'll take a look in a while.

That would be my goal from this war. It probably won't matter, but I'd rather not see a repeat of this scenario in another 20 turns when we have three more techs to research.

Overall, I think we have several options.

1. Kill Willie's invasion force, then focus on defense while we research our way to space. We have enough units and a well-developed rail network that he can't threaten us. This is the least time-consuming approach.

2. Turn the war around and invade Willie. Capture his luxes and continue our research. If we make peace relatively quickly, it shouldn't slow our spaceship construction down too much.

3. Turn this into a world war, invade Willie, and burn all his cities to the ground. This is the most time-consuming approach, but it's also the most viscerally pleasing, IMO.

Regardless of our specific approach, it will be a relatively easy war. Willie has cavs and Infantry; we have Mech Inf and Modern Armor. We both have Flight, but we can research Stealth by the end of my turnset (Nuclear Power is about to come in).


Oh, one more thing: We need to re-evaluate production levels needed for the SS parts before we get started. My plan from a few pages back doesn't match our cities' production capacity now. Plus, I think we can get Manufacturing Plants in our core cities before we start SS parts.

 

[Elephantium]

Okay, here's the plan:

* Trade gpt for all of Willie's gold
* Issue a "Remove or declare!"
* Slaughter Willie's invasion force on four-city island.
* Switch city builds to military and assemble forces sufficient to wipe Willie off the map
* Research Stealth
* Ally the world against Willie

 

[Elephantium]

Pre-flight:

Military Strength:

42 Cavalry
70 Infantry
49 Artillery
05 Transport
05 Destroyer
04 Bomber
06 Army
12 Guerilla
01 Cruiser
01 MGL

City Builds:

01 Mobile SAM
01 Cruiser
13 Bomber
01 Destroyer
17 Cruise Missile
27 Artillery
06 Mech Infantry
01 Commercial Dock
01 Internet
01 SETI program
65 Wealth
03 Offshore Platform
13 Solar Plant
01 Hospital

Economy:

Government: Republic
Mobilization: Normalcy

Treasury: 11249 gold
Income: 4389 gpt
Net gain +141gpt
100% Science
Researching Synthetic Fibers in 4.

Goals:

Long-term: Be the first to launch a space ship.
Medium: Set up prebuilds for all the SS parts
Short: MM properly this time

First order of business, switch the Solar Plants to other builds. I end up switching to a couple of Mass Transit Systems, a few Offshore Platforms, and the rest are split between Mech Inf and Mobile SAMs

Should we prepare to evict the Arabs from our continent? I'd like to for the sake of owning our continent, but strategically, it seems suboptimal.


Pre-turn:

Good values:
80, 60, 55, 50, 48, 40, 37, 35,
34, 32, 30, 28, 27, 25, 23, 20.

Figures are post-corruption
Athens - 70 spt
Thermopylae - 60 spt
Rhodes - 95/90
Corinth - 48 spt w/cop
Knossos - 42/40 spt will go up in 4 turns due to growth, add two mines
Delphi - 50/48 spt higher after growth, add one mine
Pharsalos - 40 w/2 cops
Sparta - 38/37 with two cops - Offshore Platform will boost this.
Argos - 38/34 Offshore platform will boost
Troy - 16/14 with two cops - Offshore Platform will boost.
Ephesus - 58/54
Gortyn - 42/40 w/cop
Eretria - 43/40 w/cop and geek
Thessalonica - 53/50 w/cop
Ithaca - 19/16, growing
Mycenae - 28/24, Offshore Platform coming
Phocaea - 52/44, Police Station coming
Sicyon - 26/25 w/2 cops
New Argos - 17/12, Eval again
Marathon - 49/48 w/cops, Settlers and mines. Eval again
New Knossos - about 72/52 (pre-factory)
Artemisium - 45/40 w/cop
Ellipi - 54/48, growing (mountain)
Apollonia - 9/7 w/cop, needs duct to grow.
Megara - 25/22 w/cop, Offshore Platform will boost.
Herakleia - 6/4, growing, don't improve
Halicarnassus - 1, growing, don't improve
Miletos - 30/24, growing, Offshore Platform
New Corinth - 17/11, growing, Hospital + Factory + Offshore Platform will boost.
Syracuse - 8 w/cop, Offshore Platform will boost.
Mytilene - 6 w/2 cops, don't improve.
Tegea - 11/6, growing, marginal
Pergamon - 26/22 w/2 cops, growing, eval in 2 turns
New Delphi - 17/9 w/o courthouse. Worth improving!
Apolyton - 15/8, marginal w/Duct

Delos - duct and harbor

Do MASSIVE MMing.
Change Marathon to Settler

IT:

We see a massive parade of AI units.
Marathon: Settlers

Turn 1 (1605 AD):

New Pergamon 2 founded. Making 'duct - my goal is to grow this city to size 11 and use some currently-unused irrigated grassland.

IT:

Inca and Arabia sign peace.
Corinth: Mech Inf->Mech Inf
Knossos: Mech Inf->Mech Inf
Artemisium: Mech Inf->Mech Inf
Thessalonica: Mech Inf->Mobile SAM
Rhodes: Mass Transit->Mech Inf
Marathon: Settlers
Eretria: Mobile SAM->Mech Inf
UN elections come up. We opt not to hold them.

Turn 2 (1610 AD):

Set Ephesus to Mobile SAM - I'd like to have a few of them around for air defense in case someone attacks.
New Miletos 2 founded. Making Cruise Missile.

IT:

Netherlands and Inca sign peace.
Marathon: Settler->Wealth
Gortyn: Mobile SAM->Wealth
Delphi 2: Settlers
Rhodes 2: Settlers

Turn 3 (1615 AD):

New Artemisium 2 founded. Making Wealth.
New Megara 2 founded. Making Wealth.

IT:

Synthetic Fibers->Nuclear Power
Ephesus: Mobile SAM->Mobile SAM
Thessalonica: Mobile SAM->Mobile SAM
Rhodes: Mech Inf->Modern Armor

Turn 4 (1620 AD):

New Phocaea 2 founded. Making Wealth.

IT:

Corinth: Mech Inf->MA
Pharsalos: Mass Transit->MA
Knossos: Mech Inf->Wealth
Artemisium: Mech Inf->Wealth
Phocaea: Police Station->Wealth
Eretria: Mech Inf->MA

Turn 5 (1625 AD):

The Dutch learned Mass Production last turn, so I look around to see if we can sell it to anyone else...but everyone is pretty much broke.

IT:

Sparta: Offshore Platform->Wealth
New Miletos: Settler->Wealth
Ephesus: Mobile SAM->Mobile SAM
Thessalonica: Mobile SAM->Mobile SAM
Rhodes: MA->MA
Tegea: Settler->Settler
Delphi 2: Settler->Settler
Mycenae 2: Settlers
Ashur discovers a new source of Oil.

Turn 6 (1630 AD):

New Sicyon 2 founded, making Wealth.
New Gortyn 2 founded, making Wealth.
New Mytilene 2 founded, making Wealth.
New Tegea 2 founded. Making Wealth.

IT:

Upon my soul! The Dutch are looking to sneak attack us to get at Isipezi and its oil. They land a stack of cavs and infantry there.
Argos: Offshore Platform->MA
Thermo 2: Settlers

Turn 7 (1635 AD):

New Syracuse 2 founded, making Wealth.
Pause for team discussion re: trades with Willie the Backstabber.

Trade Willie 184 gpt for 2577 gp and his WM.
Remove or declare!
He declares.
Sign MAs vs the Dutch with
Arabia, giving Oil and three luxes
Egypt, giving Iron, Horses, Salt, and Rubber, plus four luxes. We also get Gems from them.
Portugal, giving Horses and Salt.
Iroquois, for Salt, Metallurgy, and four luxes.
Ottomans for Atomic Theory (we don't have a trade route for luxes or resources).

I leave out the Incans because they're too far behind.
I then sell AT and Combustion to Egypt for 120 gold (nearly a gift, but better from us than in exchange for peace with Willie).
MT and Physics to Iroquois for 33 gold...and gift them up to Flight and RP.
and I gift all the other AIs up to RP and Flight as well, it'll make them more effective vs. Willie.

Then bombard the Dutch invasion stack with six arty and attack with a cav army,
Army > 4 cavs
eCav > Guerilla
army > infantry

I also bomb Cori... and destroy the rax and harbor there. It's not much, but it's something.
* Athens to Zimbabwe needs taxmen reassigned next turn.

We need more coastal cities being productive on naval resources, so:
Rush Offshore Platforms in Megara, Ithaca, Miletos, Mycenae, and Troy.
Switch all our core cities to military builds: MA, mobile SAM, Bombers. Next turn I'll start more Destroyers and Transports in our core coastal towns.
Athens and Thermo are still building Wonders.
I upgrade a dozen Infantry to Mech Inf. We still have about 50 more, but I don't know that it's necessary to upgrade them all. We might use some of the excess Infantry to help rush Transports and Destroyers.

IT:

Nuclear Power->Stealth
New Delphi: Courthouse->Factory
Corinth: MA->MA
Pharsalos: MA->MA
Mycenae: Offshore Platform->Transport
Miletos: Offshore Platform->Transport
Megara: Offshore Platform->Destroyer
Ithaca: Offshore Platform->Destroyer
Ephesus: Mobile SAM->Bomber
Thessalonica: Mobile SAM->Bomber
Rhodes: MA->MA
Troy: Offshore Platform->Transport
Apolyon: Duct->Factory

Turn 8 (1640 AD):

Bomb a naval stack of Willie's and attack with two Destroyers and a Cruiser. We sink two Destroyers and the Transport and redline the last Destroyer.
Do some MMing.

IT:

Pergamon: Barracks->Bomber
Marathon: Bombers
Eretria: MA->Bomber

Turn 9 (1645 AD):

Continue the war preparations.

IT:

Athens: Internet->Nuclear Plant (switch this to a Stealth Bomber once Stealth comes in).
Sparta: Destroyer->Destroyer
Ellipi: MA->Bomber
Delphi: MA->Bomber
Knossos: MA->Bomber
Artemisium: Mobile SAM->Mobile SAM
Argos: Transport->Transport
New Knossos: Factory->Bomber
Phocaea: Mobile SAM->Bomber
Ephesus: Bomber->Bomber
Thessalonica: Bomber->Bomber
Rhodes: MA->MA

Turn 10 (1650 AD):

We lost our supply of Furs over the IT; we should renegotiate for them.

Also, some of our science farms are focused on growth, rather than beakers; I configured riverside cities to grow to size 11 in most cases. That's mostly done, but there are still some cities that will be growing during the next turnset.

The save: http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/95212/Slavemaster_1650_AD_Tusker.SAV

 

[Bucephalus]

OK, thanks, Tusker.

I'll put an invasion plan together.

 

[Elephantium]

I was figuring we could launch a fleet from one of the cities just south of the Iroquois island and head straight E, landing on the NW corner of Dutch territory. Send big stack of Mech Inf, a big stack of arty, a half-dozen Mobile SAMs, any armies we'd like (we have two full of Modern Armor now), plus a few Slaves to build Airfields, and we'll have ourselves a beachhead!

 

[Bucephalus]

I was figuring we could launch a fleet from one of the cities just south of the Iroquois island and head straight E, landing on the NW corner of Dutch territory. Send big stack of Mech Inf, a big stack of arty, a half-dozen Mobile SAMs, any armies we'd like (we have two full of Modern Armor now), plus a few Slaves to build Airfields, and we'll have ourselves a beachhead!

I don't think a beachhead is necessary, nor do I like the idea of having the fleet at sea that long.

What I'm thinking is to send empty transports to the former Zulu island, and airlift the bulk of the forces to it; it's then a two-turn hop to Arabian territory, which - with a ROP - will give us a free run at the Dutch border.

Obviously, Armies, Arty, and any Settlers will need to run the gauntlet, but I doubt if we'll see much in the way of Dutch naval units that close to Arabia.

 

[Elephantium]

Thinking about it, that's a much better plan. Good thinking, mate!

The Transports are currently near the former Zulu capital; they could pick up a stray Slave before heading to the former Zulu 3-tile island to speed airlifting. Also, we'll probably want to switch coastal cities in the core away from Transport builds.

 

[Bucephalus]

OK, but I'm in no hurry, so I'll wait for Phaedo and CivA to weigh-in before playing it.

 

[Elephantium]

Phaedo? CivA? Any thoughts?

 

[Bucephalus]

Phaedo? CivA? Any thoughts?

I've spoken today with Phaedo, and I think it's his wish that we should get the game over as quickly as possible; I understand his point of view, cos it stopped being a challenge a long time ago.

So now I don't know what to do. Sticking it to Willie will just have the effect of dragging it out, though will make for more interesting sets.

I guess it depends on what CivA has to say.

 

[Phaedo]

Don't get me wrong, I don't see anything wrong with war to spice things up. We have just been on cruise control for a while and the only real challenge left is doing the Math to figure out the same turn research/launch.

 

[Elephantium]

Speaking of doing the math, should we plan on having Manufacturing Plants in the relevant cities before we build the SS parts? If so, I'd like to wait on doing the math until we actually have Robotics and Space Flight researched.

 

[Bucephalus]

Speaking of doing the math, should we plan on having Manufacturing Plants in the relevant cities before we build the SS parts? If so, I'd like to wait on doing the math until we actually have Robotics and Space Flight researched.

Robotics will like as not be the last tech that we research, so let's not complicate the matter.

CivA is still absent, so I'll play it based on previous discussions.

 

[Elephantium]

Robotics will like as not be the last tech that we research, so let's not complicate the matter.

Well, that depends. IIRC, we have Nuclear Power now, so if we research The Laser, then Robotics, then Space Flight, Satellites, and Superconductors, we'll easily be able to have Manufacturing Plants in our core cities before we start the space countdown.

As of right now, I'd say it's a matter of preference.

 

[Steel_Khalil]

Looks like your almost finished in this game... if you ever gonna start again, i hope you guys allow me to join ^_^

 

[Bucephalus]

Looks like your almost finished in this game... if you ever gonna start again, i hope you guys allow me to join ^_^

Hi, Steel_Khalil.

I'm not sure what it is that you're asking. Are you asking to join this game, or the next one that we start?

In either case, we need to know what level it is that you play at.

 

[Steel_Khalil]

uhm.. the next one your at
and i play regent >.< ...

 

[Elephantium]

Steel_Khalil, your best bet is probably to join the next Training Day Game at Monarch or Emperor difficulty that someone starts...I see you've joined the 5CC Regent game already

 

[Steel_Khalil]

Oh ok thanks