Cain's 9/9/9 plan

[MagisterCultuum]

My dad seems to be strongly favoring Herman Cain now.

He is actually a Certified Public Accountant, but he sold his firm and retired over the summer. I was about to say that this means that the loss of accounting jobs would not matter to him, but then I remembered that the monthly payments he is getting for his company is actually just a percentage of what the company that bought him out earns from his former customers. I think that means that 9/9/9 would be very bad for us in the rare event that it passes in less than 5 years.



My father said that Cain did very well during the debate, but now that I have watched it I don't agree. Forcefully repeating oneself is not what I consider good rational debate. (It does seem to be my dad's style too though.) I don't particularly like any of these candidates.

 

[JollyRoger]

Anyone in the bottom 90% that supports 9-9-9 deserves it.

 

[mrt144]

Anyone in the bottom 90% that supports 9-9-9 deserves it.

I love how people who like being screwed over then in the same breath say that everyone else should be equally happy.

 

[JollyRoger]

At least Rudy G gave us a noun and a verb before delivering us a 9-1-1. Cain seems to limited the toppings of his sentences to a noun or a verb.

 

[say1988]

Whatever the result, you guys better brace yourself for the reign of Cain!

He is just like Trump was. He can talk and look good from the background, but he will be killed now that he is on the main stage.

 

[timtofly]

I am sure that the sales tax is replacing existing taxes, I think. Cain did not know that New Hampshire does not have a sales tax, or he does not know his own plan.

Does any one know how many people will become unemployed if the government is downsized?

 

[Gigaz]

I totally support 9/9/9

9% on buying finance shares.
9% on energy and fuel from non-renewable sources.
9% on all sorts of meat.

 

[say1988]

I am sure that the sales tax is replacing existing taxes, I think.

Only payroll taxes are to be eliminated along with the income tax reductions. Which will shift the tax burden to the poor (he stated there would be no exceptions for sales tax, and if there are then it just stops slightly above the lowest income earners).

He would have no authority to remove State or Local sales taxes (which some people think is part of the plan) and if the difference between the state tax and 9% was all the Federal government got (another claim I have seen) then you would first see states/municipalities with lower sales taxes subsidizing those with and a rush for every jurisdiction to impose a 9% sales tax to claim all the revenue that would otherwise go to the Federal government.
Any Federal sales tax would absolutely have to be on top of all state and local sales taxes.

 

[timtofly]

Only payroll taxes are to be eliminated along with the income tax reductions. Which will shift the tax burden to the poor (he stated there would be no exceptions for sales tax, and if there are then it just stops slightly above the lowest income earners).

He would have no authority to remove State or Local sales taxes (which some people think is part of the plan) and if the difference between the state tax and 9% was all the Federal government got (another claim I have seen) then you would first see states/municipalities with lower sales taxes subsidizing those with and a rush for every jurisdiction to impose a 9% sales tax to claim all the revenue that would otherwise go to the Federal government.
Any Federal sales tax would absolutely have to be on top of all state and local sales taxes.

Thanks for clearing that up. From the news bite this morning, then, Cain may not even know his own plan and how it works.

 

[say1988]

I am not saying anything about his intentions there, but it wouldn't make sense (or be feasible) to do it any other way.

Removing state tax would require a constitutional ammendment, that might be supported by a five states that don't stand to lost significant revenues.

Supplementing the state tax to bring the overall rate up to 9% can be done two ways:

1) Add a federal tax of 9% - State tax or
2) Collect and refund the State's share of receipts (which requires the State to agree to it.
Yet it still faces the issue of local sales tax rates already exceeding 9%

In both cases, you immediately see states rushing to impose 9% tax rates. This can only be stopped if the Feds say we only respect your portion up to the percentage on x date. Even with this, how do you think New Hampshire (paying the full 9%) will feel about California only paying 1.75% Federal sales tax, along with every other state with low rates. It will definitely get killed in any Senate.
Local rates must also be considered as well, but it just gets bleaker.

And the idea that sales tax is difficult to avoid is a joke. You can get a lot of stuff done under the table pretty easily.

 

[Antilogic]

I'm sure Ron Paul must have....

Possible, if you include his off-hand statements about eliminating the State Department and other government agencies.

He may think he's going to get a big cut in spending. If he thinks that, he's in dreamland. As I said above, can't be done without crippling damage.

Part of the reason why I have problems with the simple statements "all spending is bad!" and "cut it all!" I think most people vastly overestimate the amount of waste in the federal budget. There is some, but nowhere near enough to balance the budget via efficiency improvements alone.

So to buy a suit to wear to a job interview...

Who sells generic suits. It's like you've never bought anything outside of pizza before.

Brand discrimination cases would probably be the subject of several court hearings. If this were passed, I would start dreaming up "generic" luxury items to sell to the middle class and reap the profits.

But, it will be exciting if he does. Even more exciting if he changes his name to "Abel" right before.

I'm certain every Ron Paul supporter thinks the possibility of a Ron Paul presidency is equally exciting, if not more so.

If U3 unemployment remains above 8%, or if it's trending sideways from July through October 2012, it's difficult to see how Obama could keep the Presidency.

Empirically, voters pay a whole lot of attention (implicity) to the rate of change of the unemployment rate. If the rate is trending down, it's good for the incumbent; if it's trending up, that's the signal to start packing your bags. If it's trending sideways, that's not a whole lot better than trending up.

It's not as difficult as you might think. His approval rating, while low, is still beating Carter and Bush '41 by 10 points going into re-election. If you look at the electoral votes and state-to-state polls, he might be able to squeak out a marginal win if he holds onto Florida (possible, given the larger retired community and general Republican hostility to "entitlement" programs), and at least one Midwestern/Rust Belt state in addition to Illinois like Pennsylvania (although this was played up as a close battle in the news, Obama won a solid victory by over 10% in 2008, even a marginal 1% will swing 40 electoral votes).

I'd put his re-election at 50/50 right now. Maybe.

My dad seems to be strongly favoring Herman Cain now.

...

My father said that Cain did very well during the debate, but now that I have watched it I don't agree. Forcefully repeating oneself is not what I consider good rational debate. (It does seem to be my dad's style too though.) I don't particularly like any of these candidates.

Our fathers seem to be alike. Not sure who my dad favors now, but this sounds so unbelievably similar to his debating tactics.

I am sure that the sales tax is replacing existing taxes, I think. Cain did not know that New Hampshire does not have a sales tax, or he does not know his own plan.

Does any one know how many people will become unemployed if the government is downsized?

Well, we are seeing some downsizing right now. Federal and state government employment is down in the ten thousands (ignore the bump due to the census) between 2009 and now.

He is just like Trump was. He can talk and look good from the background, but he will be killed now that he is on the main stage.

Several candidates were like that, Perry I would think falls into this category.

 

[Dachs]

9% on all sorts of meat.

Hell, I'd be a revolutionary if that happened.

 

[Ajidica]

Hell, I'd be a revolutionary if that happened.

Has Dachs just offered a political opinion?!?!

 

[say1988]

if he holds onto Florida (possible, given the larger retired community and general Republican hostility to "entitlement" programs)

If Scott keeps up the good work this will become more and more likely. The governors who got elected on economic platforms and spend their terms focussing on unpopular social policies could create a bit of a mess for Republicans in those states.

 

[say1988]

Has Dachs just offered a political opinion?!?!

I support Dachs and his meat tastes good platform

 

[timtofly]

I support Dachs and his meat tastes good platform

Wouldn't that be: Dachs and LEAVE my meat alone platform?

 

[Dachs]

Wouldn't that be: Dachs and LEAVE my meat alone platform?

I think they're complementary statements; the first is the precondition of the second.

 

[Gigaz]

I think you all shoud consider a meet and greet with the Occupy Wall Street guys. Or should I rather say "meat and greed"? Seriously, meat is poison for our environment.

 

[Antilogic]

I think you all shoud consider a meet and greet with the Occupy Wall Street guys. Or should I rather say "meat and greed"? Seriously, meat is poison for our environment.

Sorry, it's too delicious. I'm signing up for the Dachs Pro-Meat Party.

 

[timtofly]

Actually my favorite is duck and chicken, so not sure where I would stand.

I am from the South, would that be: Live'r my meat alone?