TheLizardKing
Let's talk Michelle.
Signed by Emperor Francis Habsburg of the Imperial German Union
Anton Drexler, German Chancellor
Klemens Galland, Imperial German Foreign Minister
Capto Iugulum: 1920 - 1939
- Thread starter EQandcivfanatic
- Start date
Signed by Emperor Francis Habsburg of the Imperial German Union
Anton Drexler, German Chancellor
Klemens Galland, Imperial German Foreign Minister
Grandkhan
Telvanni Master Wizard
TheLizardKing
Let's talk Michelle.
I am giving him a pretty sweet deal too. Cuz Germany is fair and stuff like that.
With Drexler, everyone wins.
With Drexler, everyone wins.
Grandkhan
Telvanni Master Wizard
I'm going to follow the way of Denmark and lose all my power. I'm kidding, what was I supposed to do, lost my capital, my navy and alot of my army
Hey, that was 100% you and Spry's fault.
I was all for fighting on.I dunno, I half expected you to hold out for a rescue or something. Holland didn't bow to the Germans in WW2 historically, even if the military itself did.
ZeletDude
The Lion
- Joined
- Aug 16, 2009
- Messages
- 5,490
Hey, that was 100% you and Spry's fault.
I dunno, I half expected you to hold out for a rescue or something. Holland didn't bow to the Germans in WW2 historically, even if the military itself did.
It was a low blow
I apologize.
Terrance888
Discord Reigns
And if the Vinlandic people believed that Kamchatka and Kurile is part of their homeland, while the asians believed it is colonialism, the metaphor is completed.
Yes. However, a reasonable man does not believe that a scant few decades of settled history and fewer people than a small town would make Kunashir and Iturup, sitting right on Hokkaido's doorstep, into a portion of Vinland as integral as Nya Sverige or Dammark. It is simply not a tenable argument.
Terrance888
Discord Reigns
I am simply saying that is what their people apparently believe strong enough to continue a hard-fought war for and that their beliefs should be taken into account. It may be that the settlers are not reasonable. I personally find the proletarist scapegoating not reasonable in my country, but it still happened. Venezuela may find Colombian Irredentism unreasonable. Italy and Germany likely finds the Franco-Burgundian Confederacy's hold on Italians and Germans unreasonable even as the Confederacy finds their border-crossing nationalism unreasonable. There are many unreasonable beliefs and ideas in our world. That does not mean they are not valid. The people within Aisuyochi and the people of Japan believe it so (possibly due to their archipelagic nature), and that side should be considered, which we have not found with the most recent peace offers. That said, we also recognized the Japan's part in the issue- it takes two to make a fight, it takes two to make a peace.
EDIT: I know my reputation, but I also know the truth of my words and I shall stand by them. Both sides can clearly do more concerning Aisuyochi.
EDIT: I know my reputation, but I also know the truth of my words and I shall stand by them. Both sides can clearly do more concerning Aisuyochi.
Well, if we are to dig into beliefs, there has been a strain of political thought that held that Vinland should possess all land north of the border with the mainland united states in North America. Indeed, many maps from the late 1800s display the territories known as Aisuyochi and Scottson defaulting to our control, being lumped in along with Norrland.
However, we are not warring on some sense that we have a right to own this territory. Rather, we are warring on the belief that absolutism and foreign possession of the new world are things which should be opposed. We fight secondarily because of the obvious threat posed by an expansionist Japan. Certainly they claim no quarrel with us, but Japan would claim the very same when speaking of the Netherlands in 1922. When will some accident in the Aleutians be pinned on us, as the Manila bombing was wrongly pinned on the Netherlanders?
However, we are not warring on some sense that we have a right to own this territory. Rather, we are warring on the belief that absolutism and foreign possession of the new world are things which should be opposed. We fight secondarily because of the obvious threat posed by an expansionist Japan. Certainly they claim no quarrel with us, but Japan would claim the very same when speaking of the Netherlands in 1922. When will some accident in the Aleutians be pinned on us, as the Manila bombing was wrongly pinned on the Netherlanders?
Terrance888
Discord Reigns
And as we have said, we have recognized those beliefs and hope that Japan recognizes your holding of said beliefs.
Although we agree that sudden and unilateral aggression by Japan is a threat which cannot be discounted entirely, it is a threat which can be mitigated by a demilitarization clause- again, not entirely satisfactory for all parties due to the fact that Japan considers it their right to defend themselves, and you consider that their absolutist and foreign oppression over their own settlers unjust when done on the New World (and simply unfortunate in the old world). However, it is something which is plausible to negotiate on.
Both of you feel that enforcing all your beliefs are worth fighting and dying for at least another year for- and both of you have a right to fight for said beliefs. We in Florida still believe that peace can be attained with inter and introspection, serious negotiation, reasonable compromise and a dedication to peace and prosperity.
Although we agree that sudden and unilateral aggression by Japan is a threat which cannot be discounted entirely, it is a threat which can be mitigated by a demilitarization clause- again, not entirely satisfactory for all parties due to the fact that Japan considers it their right to defend themselves, and you consider that their absolutist and foreign oppression over their own settlers unjust when done on the New World (and simply unfortunate in the old world). However, it is something which is plausible to negotiate on.
Both of you feel that enforcing all your beliefs are worth fighting and dying for at least another year for- and both of you have a right to fight for said beliefs. We in Florida still believe that peace can be attained with inter and introspection, serious negotiation, reasonable compromise and a dedication to peace and prosperity.
christos200
Never tell me the odds
Tibet believes that Aisuyochi should become an independent state. That will mean that both Japan will not have colonies in America and the Japanese in North America will be free.
TheLizardKing
Let's talk Michelle.
In a speech given to the German people, by Anton Drexler, with the hopes of assuaging public fear of the true German war aims.
"......it is with this intention that I very publicly announce the 14 Goals of the German military action taking place within the Confederation.
1. Open covenants of peace, openly arrived at, after which there shall be no private international understandings between the previous powers of "the Pact", or any nations within the sphere of the Pact and German interest of any kind.
2. Absolute freedom of navigation upon the seas, outside territorial waters, alike in peace and in war, except as the seas may be closed in whole or in part by public declaration of one nation, or a group of nations. These declarations shall be for the sake of preventing arms and other weaponry of being supplied to another belligerent state, and should not in any means effect the ability of one nation to amply supply it's people with food and basic supplies. This comes with the understanding that the concept of blockade, "prize rules", and other forms of submarine or surface warfare against commerce, with the goal of preventing the flare up of current conflict, is a basic principle of warfare, when not abused by the nation in question.
3. The removal, so far as possible, of all economic barriers and the establishment of equality of trade conditions among all the nations within the sphere of "the Pact", or German interest, consenting to the peace and associating themselves for its maintenance.
4. Adequate guarantees given and taken that national armaments will be maintained with the goal of protecting the safety, territorial sovereignty and interests of a nation, and not used for illegal offensive purposes, detrimental the peace of Western Europe.
5. The idea that colonies of the nations in question mean little more than areas of a specific nations governance; all associated powers within the confines of Western Europe or other recognized nations will be afforded the rights to trade and invest in these colonies equally; the goal of German annexation of islands in the Indian Ocean is for the sake of spreading German law, culture and governance; merchants and general trade from the nations of the Netherlands, the Confederation and Spain will of course be given the rights to trade there the same as German traders. The Imperial German Union also takes these lands on the understanding that they are not to be viewed as "colonies" in the old vein, but lands and peoples under the territorial administration of the German government. German rule shall last only as long as it takes for proper German civilization to be brought to these locations, and past that, as long as the people of these administrated territories want us to remain there. The Imperial German Union is hoping to leave these "colonial" holdings at some point within the next few decades.
6. The evacuation of all French territories at the end of the war, when fears of a public extremist reaction is assauged, for the sake of future peace and cooperation in Western Europe. This is recognized to take as long 5 years, though should it be necessitated, a time period shorter or longer, so long as the future governments of the Confederation are elected by fair and democratic means, the Imperial German Union will have a sincere national policy of welcoming them to the larger concert of nations; and of course hope to bridge the gap between our people's that the war causes and establish a Western European community that is both in the interests of the Confederation, but it's allies, and Germany, along with Germany's allies.
7. The Netherlands will be evacuated and restored at wars end, without any attempts to limit it's sovereignty, or basic rights as a nation. We did not go into the war with the Netherlands with the goal of taking any land, economic rights, or political sway, but with a heavy heart, and we hope the evacuation, and substantial compensation that both the government of the Netherlands receives, and the people of the Netherland's receive will restore confidence among nations of the world that the Imperial German Union's primary goal is healing the relationship between the Netherlands and herself. And it is with this action, that the Imperial German Union sets a goal and precedent; that we do not wish to proverbially drag our enemies through the coals, but restructure them and our agreements with them to a point that may be beneficial to both parties involved. It will be encouraged that the Netherlands rebuild it's navy, long the pride of the nation, to be the most modern and vast navy in the world, and with the help of German technology and investment that is possible.
8. The Spanish nation, long in decline, will be given a reprieve as German capital will be given to the Spanish government in the hopes that our past relationship of friendliness, and unity will be rekindled again.
9. A readjustment of the frontiers of Italy and the Imperial German Union should be effected along clearly recognizable lines of nationality, with the Imperial German Union receiving all land East of the Rhine river, and the German industrial area of the Ruhr, and Italy receiving the Piedmont, the original source of the Rhine War. The wrong done to the German people by the Confederate government, in the manner of the Rhine and Ruhr territories, shall be righted, in order that peace may once more be made in the interest of all parties in Western Europe.
10. The peoples of the Confederation, repressed by the Confederation's policy of subverting ethnic nationalism, will be given the freedom to express their autonomous development in the same manner that the Imperial German Union has and Italy has. They shall be given the security of life, and democracy, the same as the average German citizen. They shall be given the rights to forge independent states supported and safeguarded by the German economy and military, in the same vein that the Imperial German Union willingly and happily ceded it's lands to both the Czech and Swiss people. All peoples, both large and small in number will be given this opportunity to come about their own nation destiny, should they wish, otherwise, basic governance from Paris will remain, though the extent of which will entirely be decided by the will of the people within the Confederation.
11. The states created by this self-determination of the various peoples of the Confederations (the Normans, the Burgundians, as an example) will be given the ability to economically and militarily work with one another, for the sake of peace, industry and goodwill. All post-Confederate states forged by the willingness of the people within them, will be given access to the sea through one means or another, and while they will receive the support of German industry and the German military will have absolute political and economic independence, the same as any other nation. This idea of self-determination along lines of ethnic nationalism should hold true across the civilized world; be it, for example, the vast numbers of Japanese settlers in Aisuyochi, or the Negros transplanted to the American south. It is through the unification of various peoples to their mother nations, that ultimate world peace may come.
12. All ethnic groups oppressed by the Confederation are not necessarily stateless; Bretons, Dutch, Germans, Swiss, Italians, Occitanians and Spaniards shall be afforded the right to return to their mother country, and by extension their rightful place in the grand scheme of world politics. Languages, cultures and relgions make it so that these are not a people separate from those of their homelands by anything aside from the Confederation's refusal to acknowledge their existence, or at the very least marginalize their ability to effect Confederation politics and determine their future as a people.
13. A general association of European Nations must be formed under specific covenants for the purpose of affording mutual guarantees of political independence and territorial integrity to great and small states alike. This association will succeed where the League of Continental Nations failed; while the blame for the failures of the LCN shall not entirely fall on the shoulders of the Confederation, the bureaucracy and lack of a sense of urgency or importance that persisted when under the direction of the Confederation and it's allies will be forgone, and this new association will be created with the understanding that proactivity and mutual understandings of national goals will create a better Continental Europe, one free of both American and other influences.
14. In the sake of detente between the Imperial German Union and it's neighbor Russia, unlike the prior LCN, the Russian state will be more than encouraged to provide representation, and it's thoughts to the forum of the new association, should it chose. With that, the association is not only restricted to Western Europe, and all nations allied with the Imperial German Union, or another involved power may be encouraged to send representatives, so long as they send representatives with the goal of a brighter and more successful post-war Europe in mind.
Let me make this clear to both you, the German people, and all nations of the world that watch. Our intentions are not to create a German dominated Europe, our intention is to create a Europe dominated by the goodwill and and industry of the Imperial German Union. We have provided the nations of the Confederation, the Netherlands and Spain reasonable routes of peace prior to the declaration of war, which they refused. And after our grand capture of the capitol of the Netherlands, and our advancement to near the capitol of the Confederation, we have once again given both fair and reasonable opportunities for the sake of peace in Europe. The Netherlands has taken this opportunity to take advantage of German goodwill. The Confederation has refused, and Spain has been silent. Our offers remain to them, for this year, but once action again occurs, we will act in accordance to the points we highlighted above. We can only hope that Spain will remove itself from the sway of the Confederation and sign........... "
"......it is with this intention that I very publicly announce the 14 Goals of the German military action taking place within the Confederation.
1. Open covenants of peace, openly arrived at, after which there shall be no private international understandings between the previous powers of "the Pact", or any nations within the sphere of the Pact and German interest of any kind.
2. Absolute freedom of navigation upon the seas, outside territorial waters, alike in peace and in war, except as the seas may be closed in whole or in part by public declaration of one nation, or a group of nations. These declarations shall be for the sake of preventing arms and other weaponry of being supplied to another belligerent state, and should not in any means effect the ability of one nation to amply supply it's people with food and basic supplies. This comes with the understanding that the concept of blockade, "prize rules", and other forms of submarine or surface warfare against commerce, with the goal of preventing the flare up of current conflict, is a basic principle of warfare, when not abused by the nation in question.
3. The removal, so far as possible, of all economic barriers and the establishment of equality of trade conditions among all the nations within the sphere of "the Pact", or German interest, consenting to the peace and associating themselves for its maintenance.
4. Adequate guarantees given and taken that national armaments will be maintained with the goal of protecting the safety, territorial sovereignty and interests of a nation, and not used for illegal offensive purposes, detrimental the peace of Western Europe.
5. The idea that colonies of the nations in question mean little more than areas of a specific nations governance; all associated powers within the confines of Western Europe or other recognized nations will be afforded the rights to trade and invest in these colonies equally; the goal of German annexation of islands in the Indian Ocean is for the sake of spreading German law, culture and governance; merchants and general trade from the nations of the Netherlands, the Confederation and Spain will of course be given the rights to trade there the same as German traders. The Imperial German Union also takes these lands on the understanding that they are not to be viewed as "colonies" in the old vein, but lands and peoples under the territorial administration of the German government. German rule shall last only as long as it takes for proper German civilization to be brought to these locations, and past that, as long as the people of these administrated territories want us to remain there. The Imperial German Union is hoping to leave these "colonial" holdings at some point within the next few decades.
6. The evacuation of all French territories at the end of the war, when fears of a public extremist reaction is assauged, for the sake of future peace and cooperation in Western Europe. This is recognized to take as long 5 years, though should it be necessitated, a time period shorter or longer, so long as the future governments of the Confederation are elected by fair and democratic means, the Imperial German Union will have a sincere national policy of welcoming them to the larger concert of nations; and of course hope to bridge the gap between our people's that the war causes and establish a Western European community that is both in the interests of the Confederation, but it's allies, and Germany, along with Germany's allies.
7. The Netherlands will be evacuated and restored at wars end, without any attempts to limit it's sovereignty, or basic rights as a nation. We did not go into the war with the Netherlands with the goal of taking any land, economic rights, or political sway, but with a heavy heart, and we hope the evacuation, and substantial compensation that both the government of the Netherlands receives, and the people of the Netherland's receive will restore confidence among nations of the world that the Imperial German Union's primary goal is healing the relationship between the Netherlands and herself. And it is with this action, that the Imperial German Union sets a goal and precedent; that we do not wish to proverbially drag our enemies through the coals, but restructure them and our agreements with them to a point that may be beneficial to both parties involved. It will be encouraged that the Netherlands rebuild it's navy, long the pride of the nation, to be the most modern and vast navy in the world, and with the help of German technology and investment that is possible.
8. The Spanish nation, long in decline, will be given a reprieve as German capital will be given to the Spanish government in the hopes that our past relationship of friendliness, and unity will be rekindled again.
9. A readjustment of the frontiers of Italy and the Imperial German Union should be effected along clearly recognizable lines of nationality, with the Imperial German Union receiving all land East of the Rhine river, and the German industrial area of the Ruhr, and Italy receiving the Piedmont, the original source of the Rhine War. The wrong done to the German people by the Confederate government, in the manner of the Rhine and Ruhr territories, shall be righted, in order that peace may once more be made in the interest of all parties in Western Europe.
10. The peoples of the Confederation, repressed by the Confederation's policy of subverting ethnic nationalism, will be given the freedom to express their autonomous development in the same manner that the Imperial German Union has and Italy has. They shall be given the security of life, and democracy, the same as the average German citizen. They shall be given the rights to forge independent states supported and safeguarded by the German economy and military, in the same vein that the Imperial German Union willingly and happily ceded it's lands to both the Czech and Swiss people. All peoples, both large and small in number will be given this opportunity to come about their own nation destiny, should they wish, otherwise, basic governance from Paris will remain, though the extent of which will entirely be decided by the will of the people within the Confederation.
11. The states created by this self-determination of the various peoples of the Confederations (the Normans, the Burgundians, as an example) will be given the ability to economically and militarily work with one another, for the sake of peace, industry and goodwill. All post-Confederate states forged by the willingness of the people within them, will be given access to the sea through one means or another, and while they will receive the support of German industry and the German military will have absolute political and economic independence, the same as any other nation. This idea of self-determination along lines of ethnic nationalism should hold true across the civilized world; be it, for example, the vast numbers of Japanese settlers in Aisuyochi, or the Negros transplanted to the American south. It is through the unification of various peoples to their mother nations, that ultimate world peace may come.
12. All ethnic groups oppressed by the Confederation are not necessarily stateless; Bretons, Dutch, Germans, Swiss, Italians, Occitanians and Spaniards shall be afforded the right to return to their mother country, and by extension their rightful place in the grand scheme of world politics. Languages, cultures and relgions make it so that these are not a people separate from those of their homelands by anything aside from the Confederation's refusal to acknowledge their existence, or at the very least marginalize their ability to effect Confederation politics and determine their future as a people.
13. A general association of European Nations must be formed under specific covenants for the purpose of affording mutual guarantees of political independence and territorial integrity to great and small states alike. This association will succeed where the League of Continental Nations failed; while the blame for the failures of the LCN shall not entirely fall on the shoulders of the Confederation, the bureaucracy and lack of a sense of urgency or importance that persisted when under the direction of the Confederation and it's allies will be forgone, and this new association will be created with the understanding that proactivity and mutual understandings of national goals will create a better Continental Europe, one free of both American and other influences.
14. In the sake of detente between the Imperial German Union and it's neighbor Russia, unlike the prior LCN, the Russian state will be more than encouraged to provide representation, and it's thoughts to the forum of the new association, should it chose. With that, the association is not only restricted to Western Europe, and all nations allied with the Imperial German Union, or another involved power may be encouraged to send representatives, so long as they send representatives with the goal of a brighter and more successful post-war Europe in mind.
Let me make this clear to both you, the German people, and all nations of the world that watch. Our intentions are not to create a German dominated Europe, our intention is to create a Europe dominated by the goodwill and and industry of the Imperial German Union. We have provided the nations of the Confederation, the Netherlands and Spain reasonable routes of peace prior to the declaration of war, which they refused. And after our grand capture of the capitol of the Netherlands, and our advancement to near the capitol of the Confederation, we have once again given both fair and reasonable opportunities for the sake of peace in Europe. The Netherlands has taken this opportunity to take advantage of German goodwill. The Confederation has refused, and Spain has been silent. Our offers remain to them, for this year, but once action again occurs, we will act in accordance to the points we highlighted above. We can only hope that Spain will remove itself from the sway of the Confederation and sign........... "
Terrance888
Discord Reigns
OOC: First off, a magnificent write up and very well reasoned points there.
Second, I don't know where "hypernationalism" or "homeland nationalism" will take us, but it is a very interesting and quite (not unique, but similar word) concept. Do you feel that hypernationalism should primarily entail same/similar borders with an emphasis on population movement, or that it should primarily entail same/similar population bases with an emphasis on border shifts.
Also, I think you should recognize that according to EQ in the last NES, there is no such thing as Norman nationalism.
There is Norman pride/regionalism as i see it (like Yankee Ingenuity), especially due to their advanced industrialism and infrastructure in the pre-Confederation France and within young Confederation and heading the Orient Express, but I'm not sure how it will last within the Confederation Proper, especially as it is not referred to at all (or escaped by notice so far).
Second, I don't know where "hypernationalism" or "homeland nationalism" will take us, but it is a very interesting and quite (not unique, but similar word) concept. Do you feel that hypernationalism should primarily entail same/similar borders with an emphasis on population movement, or that it should primarily entail same/similar population bases with an emphasis on border shifts.
Also, I think you should recognize that according to EQ in the last NES, there is no such thing as Norman nationalism.
There is Norman pride/regionalism as i see it (like Yankee Ingenuity), especially due to their advanced industrialism and infrastructure in the pre-Confederation France and within young Confederation and heading the Orient Express, but I'm not sure how it will last within the Confederation Proper, especially as it is not referred to at all (or escaped by notice so far).
SouthernKing
crickety cricket
Peru wonders why Tibet cares when they cannot even reach the Pacific Ocean, let alone Aisuyochi.
OOC: I do like how this NES is avoiding having clearly-defined world wars like OTL; rather, we're having a bunch of sporatic conflicts that, while still major wars that involve multiple powers, are not quite "world" wars. Hopefully this lasts.
christos200
Never tell me the odds
Tibet wants peace to the world. We believe in Buddha and that people should not fight. So we just gave an idea. Nothing more. We just want peace in the world.
Buddha bless you, my child.
Vinland greets its most unexpected guest, the representative of the Thirteenth Dalai Lama of Tibet.
We too have pondered the possibility of an independent Aisuyochi. Unfortunately, your plan strikes us as hopelessly optimistic. For such a solution to work, Vinland would need assurances that the new government of Aisuyochi would be democratic, and that it would be fully independent from Japan. Given the Taisho Emperor's statements on this matter, we do not view this proposal as being within the realm of possibility.
The other major issues with an independent Aisuyochi are of population and food. The only real food sources are berries, fish and game, with the land being uniquely unsuitable for the growth of staple crops. The population of this potential country is only a scant few tens of thousands- you could fit the entire population of Aisuyochi into the city of Tokyo four thousand times over, with ease. There are simply not enough people, in our estimation, to maintain an effective and independent state in the area.
Do you really believe that Japan would deign to rescind its control over Aisuyochi, swearing off any intervention in its former colony and allowing a fully-independent, democratic republic to be established in the area?
We too have pondered the possibility of an independent Aisuyochi. Unfortunately, your plan strikes us as hopelessly optimistic. For such a solution to work, Vinland would need assurances that the new government of Aisuyochi would be democratic, and that it would be fully independent from Japan. Given the Taisho Emperor's statements on this matter, we do not view this proposal as being within the realm of possibility.
The other major issues with an independent Aisuyochi are of population and food. The only real food sources are berries, fish and game, with the land being uniquely unsuitable for the growth of staple crops. The population of this potential country is only a scant few tens of thousands- you could fit the entire population of Aisuyochi into the city of Tokyo four thousand times over, with ease. There are simply not enough people, in our estimation, to maintain an effective and independent state in the area.
Do you really believe that Japan would deign to rescind its control over Aisuyochi, swearing off any intervention in its former colony and allowing a fully-independent, democratic republic to be established in the area?
TheLizardKing
Let's talk Michelle.
Well, I should point out that my ideas behind Drexlerian Nationalism are largely based off of ethnicities, without the idea that one race is inherently better than another race (or people, if you prefer) just different, and more suited for particular things. Drexler is a firm believer of the idea that nation states are just representation of modern "tribes", and ideally each state, or tribe would be made up of those who are culturally similar. So border shifts don't necessarily have to fall along those of the OTL, but from what I understand, the many ethnic borders remain along similar lines as those from the OTL, with notable exceptions in parts of Germanized Venetia, and of course the entire area of the Rhine, going into the FBC. The idea behind promoting ethnic nationalism is something I've been sort of encouraging since I first took over as Austria in 1900. I encouraged German nationalism, notably by sticking out of the Great War, and ignoring Brandenburgs overtly hostile actions, helped spurr on the acceptance of Italian nationalism with the FBC, also while giving the Czechs and Swiss their independence. Drexler is a champion of "the people", or ethnic independence movements, because he believes that each race, like his German people, have a right to united and self-governance.
This of course goes along with the thinking that Drexler was born and raised in a world where Germany was not a unified state, and the lack of unification, in turn, made for a poorer less influential Brandenburg, Austria and Pomerania. When unification occurred, conflict between the German states ceased, the economy became the 3rd largest in the world, and the German people finally achieved what they couldn't separated. So it stands to reason that Drexler would hope the same for other races across Europe; perhaps they may not be as successful as the German people were, but the fact remains they should have the right to either be successful, or fail, independently. The Confederation, in his eyes, is an ungodly creation. The idea of a French "race" or "nation" is very much diluted by the fact that Occitania and Brittany view themselves as seperate entities entirely, and of course the fact that the French citizenry within the FBC also has to contend with Germans, Dutch, Swiss, and whatever ethnicities may make themselves prevelent, however small or unimportant they may be. While the war against the FBC is first and foremost for the final unification of the German race, the fact that the other races within the Confederation can be freed is even better. Norman nationalism, to whatever extent may be entirely non-existant in this timeline, but, I would think that Drexler would see no reason it couldn't exist; after all, it was probably just marginalized by the Confederate police state, which made a habit of ignoring the differences in ethnicities of it's subjects.
I've put a significant amount of thought as to what "Drexlerian Nationalism" entails entirely, and the racial-based self-determination is ultimately only a part of it. I must emphasis though, this is different than OTL's "Rarr, we're German and we're better than you", and should be better compared to "Rarr, we're German, and we're different than you, and better in some respects, so we're going to focus on those, and leave you to do your own things". In a nutshell. It goes much deeper than that, and I had at one point attempted to make a chart of the different prime "races" the German state would recognize, how they relate, off-shoots of one another, traits of each race, and things of that nature. And while these ideas are by no means the law or practice of the IGU, they are ideals that Drexler is hoping to govern by, should the "perfect storm" happen.
Don't get me started on Drexlerian Nationalism's ideals for the "uncivilized races"... that's an entirely different ball-park. Also, forgive me if this is a bit rushed, I'm on my girlfriend lap-top at her house, and am just about to rush off on some errands, so I was a bit pressed for time when I wrote this. I might come back, and realize I missed some glaring points, or poorly explained other points.
This of course goes along with the thinking that Drexler was born and raised in a world where Germany was not a unified state, and the lack of unification, in turn, made for a poorer less influential Brandenburg, Austria and Pomerania. When unification occurred, conflict between the German states ceased, the economy became the 3rd largest in the world, and the German people finally achieved what they couldn't separated. So it stands to reason that Drexler would hope the same for other races across Europe; perhaps they may not be as successful as the German people were, but the fact remains they should have the right to either be successful, or fail, independently. The Confederation, in his eyes, is an ungodly creation. The idea of a French "race" or "nation" is very much diluted by the fact that Occitania and Brittany view themselves as seperate entities entirely, and of course the fact that the French citizenry within the FBC also has to contend with Germans, Dutch, Swiss, and whatever ethnicities may make themselves prevelent, however small or unimportant they may be. While the war against the FBC is first and foremost for the final unification of the German race, the fact that the other races within the Confederation can be freed is even better. Norman nationalism, to whatever extent may be entirely non-existant in this timeline, but, I would think that Drexler would see no reason it couldn't exist; after all, it was probably just marginalized by the Confederate police state, which made a habit of ignoring the differences in ethnicities of it's subjects.
I've put a significant amount of thought as to what "Drexlerian Nationalism" entails entirely, and the racial-based self-determination is ultimately only a part of it. I must emphasis though, this is different than OTL's "Rarr, we're German and we're better than you", and should be better compared to "Rarr, we're German, and we're different than you, and better in some respects, so we're going to focus on those, and leave you to do your own things". In a nutshell. It goes much deeper than that, and I had at one point attempted to make a chart of the different prime "races" the German state would recognize, how they relate, off-shoots of one another, traits of each race, and things of that nature. And while these ideas are by no means the law or practice of the IGU, they are ideals that Drexler is hoping to govern by, should the "perfect storm" happen.
Don't get me started on Drexlerian Nationalism's ideals for the "uncivilized races"... that's an entirely different ball-park. Also, forgive me if this is a bit rushed, I'm on my girlfriend lap-top at her house, and am just about to rush off on some errands, so I was a bit pressed for time when I wrote this. I might come back, and realize I missed some glaring points, or poorly explained other points.
