1. We have added a Gift Upgrades feature that allows you to gift an account upgrade to another member, just in time for the holiday season. You can see the gift option when going to the Account Upgrades screen, or on any user profile screen.
    Dismiss Notice

Change the US Constitution

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by downtown, Jun 2, 2007.

?

I would support:

  1. Judicial Reform: Federal Judges serve up to 15 years, not for life

    32.6%
  2. No More Flag Burning: New Amendment banning the burning of the flag

    7.8%
  3. Federal term limits: congressmen can only serve X amount of terms

    31.8%
  4. Repealing the 2nd amendment: hey, it worked for Europe??

    18.6%
  5. Abolishing the income tax

    25.6%
  6. Making Presidential Election day a national holiday

    50.4%
  7. Creating a national set of standards for election procedures

    44.2%
  8. Creating a civil service test for ambassadors

    22.5%
  9. The Arnold Rule: Allowing non-americans to serve as president

    39.5%
  10. Leave everything the way it is. the framers got it right the first time

    7.0%
  11. I have a different idea

    25.6%
  12. Creating a "safe district" in Ohio, so Downtown can get to Congress

    13.2%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. Masquerouge

    Masquerouge Deity

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2002
    Messages:
    17,790
    Location:
    Mountain View, CA
    :lol: hey, I'm just sayin', you know... since you guys seem to be complaining about it... thought I could help :)
     
  2. ybbor

    ybbor Will not change his avata

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2003
    Messages:
    5,773
    Location:
    Chicago Suburbs
    well federal law requires employers to give thier employees time off to go vote.
     
  3. Masquerouge

    Masquerouge Deity

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2002
    Messages:
    17,790
    Location:
    Mountain View, CA

    But wouldn't it be simpler for the day to be off, like a Saturday or a Sunday?
     
  4. DaveShack

    DaveShack Inventor Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2003
    Messages:
    13,108
    Location:
    Arizona, USA (it's a dry heat)
    That's part of it. Another part is that there are some punishments which would be more appropriate for juveniles than kidprison, if the 8th didn't intervene.

    Then there's the only certain way to keep murderers from repeating their crime, which is neither cruel nor should it be unusual, but people argue against it on those grounds.
     
  5. DaveShack

    DaveShack Inventor Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2003
    Messages:
    13,108
    Location:
    Arizona, USA (it's a dry heat)
    An explanation can be found here. Basically, the Constitution sets a date for the Electoral College to convene, and requires the states to choose their electors no more than 34 days before that date. Separation of church and state limits the availability of Friday, Saturday, and Sunday by virtue of their being the Sabbath or equivalent of several religions.

    Moving forward to modern times, once we add in worship of Monday Night Football and humpday (Wednesday), and remember that election workers often have to work late the day after the election so Thursday is off the list (happy hour on Friday), the only day left is Tuesday. :lol:
     
  6. mdwh

    mdwh Deity

    Joined:
    May 14, 2005
    Messages:
    3,565
    How do you mean? If a Government gives large support to a single religion, that's okay as long as it doesn't say "state religion"?

    You mean "assume cops are honest and citizens are not" - which is a rather ridiculous and unfair assumption.

    (The problem here is your assumption that all suspects are criminals...)
     
  7. bhsup

    bhsup Deity

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2004
    Messages:
    30,387
    I cannot believe I've missed this thread so far. Not much time at the moment, but I want to at least address the day off for voting real quick.

    It should not be made hideously easy. Keep it where it is and make people actually think about juggling their day to vote. God forbid people are actually inconvenienced four or five times a year to participate in the running of their country.

    If someone cannot be inconvenienced to the point of standing in line for an hour or two to help determine the direction of our nation for the next few years, well then they just don't love their country enough.
     
  8. DaveShack

    DaveShack Inventor Retired Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2003
    Messages:
    13,108
    Location:
    Arizona, USA (it's a dry heat)
    Size is not what matters. In "state religion" ca. 1780 (and before) nations could, and did, make the practice of religions other than the state religion a crime. Think Inquisition.

    The citizens who are not criminals have nothing to fear from a search. A search won't find anything anyway. Take the electronic surveillence for terrorist activity. I don't care if the government scans everthing I send online, because I'm not doing anything illegal. If allowing them to
    scan my legal correspondence enables them to find evidence of illegal activity of others, more power to them.

    I'm talking about the "Law & Order" episode type problems, for example a warrant says search the 4th warehouse, when it was really the 3rd. Cops search the 3rd warehouse, find a boatload of stuff which actually is connected to the suspect. Judge throws out the stuff because of a typo on the warrant, suspect goes free. Bottom line is, it is his stuff and he's so obviously guilty no reasonable person could doubt it. What's really sad is when freed suspect goes on to kill someone. Another example, suspect talks before cop goes through Miranda, then confesses at the station -- but the confession is thrown out because the earlier statements are inadmissable, even though everyone over the age of 5 knows the Miranda statement.

    Edit: rambled a bit but then liked the ramblings... putting that another way
    In the case where there is evidence which proves the crime beyond reasonable doubt, they are guilty and therefore criminals. Let the jury hear the evidence and decide if it is credible or not, instead of throwing it out.
     
  9. Shadylookin

    Shadylookin master debater

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2002
    Messages:
    6,719
    Location:
    eternal damnation
    term limits for judges- we don't need any 90 year old geezers that are way behind the times

    election holiday- seriously who puts the most important moment for democracy in the middle of a work week during standard business hours? personally i think elections should last a span of a few days or maybe a week. that way everyone has a reasonable chance to get out and vote. but god forbid media agencies not know the outcome of an election 10 minutes after the polls on the west coast close.

    election standards- federal elections should have a federal standard. and since it's all on the same ballot the state elections should follow suit

    and i have another idea- end (partisan) gerrymandering. Incumbents win so often not because they're good, but because they don't even have to try.
     
  10. Drewcifer

    Drewcifer Agent of Karma

    Joined:
    May 1, 2002
    Messages:
    3,748
    Location:
    Minneapolis
    I would like to see the electoral college abolished and just have a straight national vote for the presidency.

    It would also be good to restrict the interstate commerce clause because right now it is interpreted to mean that congress can more or less regulate anything it wants, in it's current form it voids the tenth amendment.
     
  11. LucyDuke

    LucyDuke staring at the clock

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2007
    Messages:
    13,582
    Location:
    where mise
    I don't see how that is impacted by church and state. Nor is "church and state" in the Constitution. It might interfere with "the free exercise thereof", but hell, let's have a two-day election party and that ought to take care of everyone who's got worship to fuss with. Election weekend!

    :eek: That attitude is completely at odds with what this country is about.
     
  12. Godwynn

    Godwynn March to the Sea

    Joined:
    May 17, 2003
    Messages:
    20,498
    Another one I can get behind.
     
  13. mdwh

    mdwh Deity

    Joined:
    May 14, 2005
    Messages:
    3,565
    You are lucky that the Government does not criminalise anything you do - not all crimes are necessarily just. Of course yes, the answer there is to fix the laws - so get rid of all the stupid laws, _and_ guarantee me that a corrupt Government will never in future take advantage of such a surveillance system (either persecuting people, or using flimsy amount of evidence based on such surveillance to convict ppl of terrorism), then sure.

    There are other problems though, such as the way searches conducted. If there aren't any rules, then it's a lot easier for a policeman to break in and plant evidence, or just produce it and claim it was found on you

    Perhaps a better system is - radical idea, I know - is that the law enforcement follow the procedures, rather than mucking up and using that as an excuse to take away rights.

    Yes, there may be silly cases, such as a typo (do you have a link to that case?) and I don't necessarily support all such cases. But that's not an argument to throw every one of our rights out.

    What's really sad is when innocent people are locked up for years, because of a false confession.

    And the jury decides if someone is guilty beyond reasonable doubt - this is not decided beforehand.
     
  14. mdwh

    mdwh Deity

    Joined:
    May 14, 2005
    Messages:
    3,565
    And:

    Has it actually be ruled that it can't happen on a day which is a religion's sabbath?

    Because otherwise I can't help feeling your overestimating how much "separation of state and religion" is used (hence your belief it should be cut back).

    Clearly the logic is ludicrous, because all you need is for a few more religions to spring up declaring their sabbath on other days of the week, and then the vote can't happen on any day! And if they only favour the mainstream existing religions, _that_ would be a violation of separation of church and state.

    So if anything, I'd say the reverse - separation of church and state means that Friday/Saturday/Sunday should _not_ be treated as religious days by the Government.
     
  15. Ecofarm

    Ecofarm Deity

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2007
    Messages:
    15,370
    Location:
    Univ. Florida
  16. aneeshm

    aneeshm Deity

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2001
    Messages:
    6,666
    Location:
    Mountain View, California, USA
    No More Flag Burning: New Amendment banning the burning of the flag
    Abolishing the income tax
    Making Presidential Election day a national holiday
    Creating a national set of standards for election procedures
    Creating a civil service test for ambassadors
    The Arnold Rule: Allowing non-americans to serve as president


    I have one additional idea - that voting, specially for the Presidential Elections, be made compulsory.
     
  17. IglooDude

    IglooDude Enforcing Rule 34 Retired Moderator Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2003
    Messages:
    22,415
    Location:
    Igloo, New Hampshire
    Oh man, I'd completely forgotten about that - yes, some sort of party-neutral (not "bipartisan") method of determining new voting districts would be excellent.
     
  18. downtown

    downtown Crafternoon Delight

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2004
    Messages:
    19,541
    Location:
    Chicago
    One of the cool things about federalism is that we can try stuff like this with states before we make it Federal law. A couple of states do just that (Washington State is the first that come to mind, although I know there are others), either using a raw, mathmatical formula, or creating a bipartisian commission, (retired judges?)

    The public would love it, but no political interest would supoort it.
     
  19. Godwynn

    Godwynn March to the Sea

    Joined:
    May 17, 2003
    Messages:
    20,498
    Although that would greatly help me since I barely spend any money at all, it is regressive in nature since the poor spend a greater percentage of their income.
     
  20. JollyRoger

    JollyRoger Slippin' Jimmy Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2001
    Messages:
    42,969
    Location:
    Chicago Sunroofing

Share This Page