Civ VII Weekly Reveal Guessing Thread

[Leucarum]

I suspect we will see at least one Exploration Age English leader; Elizabeth I is inevitable, and we could see more. But for me the problem is that the Normans already feel very, very Medieval English (Early Modern English would be more exploration/colonization/culture focused IMO) to the exclusion of all the other interesting things that the Normans did. The end result is very bland. I was one of the people who was excited by the idea of the Normans as an interesting take, but the actual implementation of them was very bland.

They are the civ equivalent of the colour beige. I feel like the wider exploits of the normans would have made for a much more interesting civ, but they clearly wanted a civ that felt like England, which led to what we got... That said to be honest a civ with all the excitement of damp cardboard is actually on brand for England.

I don't feel strongly about the Isles having representation in Antiquity, I think both Rome and an eventual Norse civ will be fine enough there. I would love to see an exploration based England civ though, especially with a focus on piracy. It felt like Ed was alluding to this on the last stream when someone asked about about attacking treasure-fleets without going to war, though I don't have time to find the exact quote right now. Of course, there are other civs that could fit pirate gameplay, but my mind immediately jumps to England.

Sure, it might geographically overlap with the Normans some, but I feel like they'd play very different.

I would much prefer Gaul as an antiquity civ which could feed into Britons in some form. While I doubt we'd get one for every age, I think there's also potential for other civs from the isles beyond England; Ireland and Wales both have enough religious angles to fit exploration well, and Scotland as implemented in 6 would slot nicely into modern I suspect...

 

[Zaarin]

I would much prefer Gaul as an antiquity civ which could feed into Britons in some form.

Honestly the Britons are admirably covered by Rome as the Britons were thoroughly Romanized--and before the pre-Roman Britons are a better candidate for IP than full civ as they were by far the least sophisticated and urbanized of the Celtic populations. The best candidates for Antiquity Celtic civs, IMO, are Gaul and some form of Old Irish civ--but I'd much prefer to see Ireland in the Exploration Age. Anything the Celtiberians could bring to the table, in particular their masterful metalworking, could just as well be covered by Gaul. The other Continental Celts are too poorly known.

 

[Krajzen]

I would love to see not so much England for era II civ as Anglo-Saxons

Civ series have never had any representation of the early medieval English history, prior to the Norman conquest and French cultural influence. It has always been all about hundred years war longbowmen, Elizabeth, ships, redcoats, industry, Victoria and Churchill. It makes sense, of course, if we can have only one "English" civ and we want to focus on its golden ages and global impact. But since now British maritime industrial empire shall be explicitly limited to the modern era, leaving 500-1700 AD open...

Anglo-Saxons would be simply cool and exotic for me, I love their aestethics and language. Bonus points for us having once in the series opportunity to make Normans, Anglo-Saxons and Norse fight one another (and Irish and Franks are quote possible too, to make for even more entertaining early medieval world)

They also fit civ switching system very well, as they not only fit Celtic and Romance civs but also other Germanic civs before and after them, opening for example quite immersive pathway of Goths -> Anglo-Saxons -> Britain, but also alt history paths leading towards Germany or Scandinavia for example.

 

[Gori the Grey]

And Hrothgar as a leader.

 

[Leucarum]

Honestly the Britons are admirably covered by Rome as the Britons were thoroughly Romanized--and before the pre-Roman Britons are a better candidate for IP than full civ as they were by far the least sophisticated and urbanized of the Celtic populations. The best candidates for Antiquity Celtic civs, IMO, are Gaul and some form of Old Irish civ--but I'd much prefer to see Ireland in the Exploration Age. Anything the Celtiberians could bring to the table, in particular their masterful metalworking, could just as well be covered by Gaul. The other Continental Celts are too poorly known.

Gaul would be my preference also.

 

[Zaarin]

I would love to see not so much England for era II civ as Anglo-Saxons

I think Anglo-Saxons are a better fit for Antiquity. They fit thematically, and they fit pretty well chronologically too without even the sort of chronological fudging we see with Khmer and Mississippians.

 

[Evie]

Concur with Zaarin ; I really see the Angles, the Saxons, and the Anglo-Saxons as better fitting Antiquity in terms of how they fit the game. Plus the Saxons (or Franks) slot in really nicely as horse-Germans contrasting against the Norse's Boat-Germans and the Goths's Foot-Germans).

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

I never said you were in that camp, but there are already those gnashing teeth that we "only" have six European civs--I can't imagine they'd be thrilled with none.

It could be seven. I guess it depends on if Russia does get in and what they are considered. Culturally European but most of it is located in Asia, and could possibly come from Mongolia.

I have a list of civs I want to mod in but they're still blocked by the lack of a possible associated wonder and not the leader (looks at Sulu).

Did you mean to say the Zulu?

I would love to see not so much England for era II civ as Anglo-Saxons

Civ series have never had any representation of the early medieval English history, prior to the Norman conquest and French cultural influence. It has always been all about hundred years war longbowmen, Elizabeth, ships, redcoats, industry, Victoria and Churchill. It makes sense, of course, if we can have only one "English" civ and we want to focus on its golden ages and global impact. But since now British maritime industrial empire shall be explicitly limited to the modern era, leaving 500-1700 AD open...

Anglo-Saxons would be simply cool and exotic for me, I love their aestethics and language. Bonus points for us having once in the series opportunity to make Normans, Anglo-Saxons and Norse fight one another (and Irish and Franks are quote possible too, to make for even more entertaining early medieval world)

They also fit civ switching system very well, as they not only fit Celtic and Romance civs but also other Germanic civs before and after them, opening for example quite immersive pathway of Goths -> Anglo-Saxons -> Britain, but also alt history paths leading towards Germany or Scandinavia for example.

Anglo-Saxons to me would fit the Antiquity Age better, despite firmly existing in the Exploration Age timeline in real life. Plus, I also believe that the Norse will eventually be Antiquity too, leading into the Normans, so that would work perfectly.

 

[Evie]

Possibly the Sultanate of Sulu in the Philippines.

 

[Archanist]

Did you mean to say the Zulu?

Possibly the Sultanate of Sulu in the Philippines.

This, pretty much. Even if they arguably come from Majapahit I think they're unique and interesting enough to be their own civ

 

[Zaarin]

Anglo-Saxons to me would fit the Antiquity Age better, despite firmly existing in the Exploration Age timeline in real life.

They straddle. The Anglo-Saxons settled Britain in the 5th century and obviously existed before that in modern Denmark. Their heyday was certainly in the Exploration Age, but placing them in Antiquity is less of a stretch than Khmer or Mississippians.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

They straddle. The Anglo-Saxons settled Britain in the 5th century and obviously existed before that in modern Denmark. Their heyday was certainly in the Exploration Age, but placing them in Antiquity is less of a stretch than Khmer or Mississippians.

I meant they would fit better in-game alongside a hypothetical Norse civ in Antiquity, rather than being alongside the Normans in Exploration. In fact, I would think Anglo-Saxons would go into the Normans, if you want to recreate history.

 

[Krajzen]

Why would Norse civ go into antiquity to begin with, if not only they fit exploration era chronologically but also thematically? They are all about meeting other cultures, exploration, expansion, trade and colonies.

I also definitely don't want ancient Anglo-Saxons, because ancient Anglo-Saxons would be simply indistinguishable from any other "primitive" pagan Germanic tribe, lacking any of their interesting cultural characteristics. After all, we are supposed to get civs depicted in their era of glory, which definitely wouldn't be obscure migration period in their case, but rather period of Alfred the Great, heptarchy, manuscripts, monasteries, Saint Bede, fighting Vikings etc. Second era Anglo-Saxons would also fight Norman, Norse, maybe Irish and Franks, whereas first era would fight... Rome and Goths?

 

[Siptah]

Why would Norse civ go into antiquity to begin with, if not only they fit exploration era chronologically but also thematically? They are all about meeting other cultures, exploration, expansion, trade and colonies.

I also definitely don't want ancient Anglo-Saxons, because ancient Anglo-Saxons would be simply indistinguishable from any other "primitive" pagan Germanic tribe, lacking any of their interesting cultural characteristics. After all, we are supposed to get civs depicted in their era of glory, which definitely wouldn't be obscure migration period in their case, but rather period of Alfred the Great, heptarchy, manuscripts, monasteries, Saint Bede, fighting Vikings and laying foundations for England.

I think Vikings in antiquity make sense because they lead to other civs (Normans, Rus, Byzantines, Germans) as likely the best Northern European option. Then again, we don‘t know yet how FXS sees the Goths: as northerners (due to their origin) or as southerners (due to where they were most successful in establishing themselves)?

 

[Verified_Confection_Being]

I think Vikings in antiquity make sense because they lead to other civs (Normans, Rus, Byzantines, Germans) as likely the best Northern European option. Then again, we don‘t know yet how FXS sees the Goths: as northerners (due to their origin) or as southerners (due to where they were most successful in establishing themselves)?

Best implementation I could see of Norse in antiquity would be if they were like a more militaristic version of the Polynesians in Civ V to represent the early exploration of the new world they did.

Even then though, their whole stick screams exploration to me, from everything they did through the north sea to their riverborne raids in the east - they are the beating heart of exploration the way firaxis have envisioned the era to me.

That it means there isn't a neat lead in to them may be the consideration that tips them over to become an exception mechanic civ in antiquity for me.

 

[Siptah]

Best implementation I could see of Norse in antiquity would be if they were like a more militaristic version of the Polynesians in Civ V to represent the early exploration of the new world they did.

Even then though, their whole stick screams exploration to me, from everything they did through the north sea to their riverborne raids in the east - they are the beating heart of exploration the way firaxis have envisioned the era to me.

That it means there isn't a neat lead in to them may be the consideration that tips them over to become an exception mechanic civ in antiquity for me.

I guess the Norse will forever be about exploration and military, because that’s most people‘s primary association and the Viking cliché. However, I think they are known enough to receive a twist at some point and we could see an economic and/or cultural civ - which they undoubtedly were as well. I don‘t think it‘ll happen in civ VII though. As you say, they would probably be a unique antiquity civ or an exploration civ with a somewhat different goal (raid cities in the distant lands).

 

[Evie]

It's less that there isn't a lead to them in antiquity, and more that they really want to be the lead-in to a lot of Exploration Europe, much like Rome. I expect them to be an antiquity seafarer, just like the Phoenicians will (obviously) be.

 

[Krikkit1]

I’d see (in a maxed Europe)
Norse->Normans, Danes/Kalmar, maybe Kievan Rus, maybe Scots

Celtic Group(Gauls?)->Normans, Spain, HRE, maybe Irish

Germanic group (Goths?)->Normans, Spain, HRE, ItalianCS, maybe Dutch, maybe Poland

(and a few links from antiquity Scythians… or some other eurasian steppe group)->Poland, maybe Rus again

Norse would probably have raiding bonuses and traditions…maybe have the ability to cross ocean squares, but not in the Distant Lands (so they can only colonize some of the “intermediate islands”)

Kalmar would focus more on trade

 

[Evie]

Definitely Norse into Exploration Russia, whether that's Novgorod, Kiev or Muscovy. That is one of the most obvious transitions possible.

 

[Jeppetto]

But what would Exploration Russia turn into?