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Civ4 Realism Mod (Extended Gameplay and tweaks)

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Modpacks' started by jaynus, Nov 4, 2005.

  1. woodelf

    woodelf Bard Retired Moderator

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    First off, no problems installing it or loading it to play. :D

    So far I've noticed that the processing of turns is taking considerably longer than the original game. Maybe 3-5 times longer? The initial turn took over 2 minutes and now they're running 15-20 seconds from the time you hit enter until you can do anything again. I don't remember it taking that long in 3920BC before. Maybe it's doing more calculations? I have no idea.

    I noticed that the tech is about double right of the bat. Is it double throughout the entire mod or does it triple or quadruple later on when the research tends to accelerate too much?

    Back to playing. Thanks for the improvements.
     
  2. jaynus

    jaynus Chieftain

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    Hahahaha Anyone notice the swordsman bonus is broken yet?

    Woodelf - Looking into the loading times now...As for the tech issues, that is the idea. I am sitting down and testing another full-length game, but my *intent* is for it to take 3x as longer ren era to modern era
     
  3. Goatmaster

    Goatmaster Chieftain

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    I played till 1800~ BC without any lag on a small island map with only 2 other civs. Haven't had time yet to play more.
     
  4. Simetrical

    Simetrical Chieftain

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    To be honest, I think the whole tech tree should eventually be rebuilt from the ground up. For now, of course, work with what we have, but eventually let's aim for a full replacement. I could maybe start work on that this weekend if you want (obviously just as a very detailed suggestion written in XML that you should hopefully be able to just plug in if you want it).
     
  5. persona

    persona Chieftain

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    First, I'd like to say that I really appreciate the MOD and I think the slowing down of tech and increase in the unit production makes the game much more enjoyable. My only problem is the time between turns, it started out being about 10 seconds between turns and now I'm in the middle ages and it's nearly a minute which makes it unplayable. I've played previously on HUGE maps with many cultures and haven't had more than 1/5 that time between turns before.
     
  6. Simetrical

    Simetrical Chieftain

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    Here's the start of a more detailed elaboration on my last post. Obviously, the stats I give are basically all off-the-cuff and shouldn't be taken as final by any means.

    All civilizations are assumed to start out somewhere shortly before the earliest known Bronze Age, call it 3500 BCE. An earlier start than that is fairly nonsensical, IMO, since the extension of state control beyond a single tribe didn't really seriously exist before approximately that period. So, this will be the start of my layout here. All civilizations can be assumed to know how to hunt, forage, construct tools and simple dwellings out of wood and stone, and use archery.

    Farming
    Prerequisites: None.
    Bonuses: Allows use of the Agricultural Society civic. Allows construction of Farms. (Agricultural Society increases the cost of all units and dramatically increases the cost of Settlers, but allows cities to expand beyond a limit imposed by the Nomadic Society civic, which certain factions may begin with as their default instead of Agricultural Society. Civilizations using Agricultural Society can build Cottages and Roads.)
    Cost: Moderate. Easy transferability.

    Animal Husbandry
    Prerequisites: None.
    Bonuses: Allows use of the Agricultural Society civic. Allows construction of Pastures. With The Wheel, allows recruitment of Chariots.
    Cost: Low. Easy transferability.

    Calendar
    Prerequisites: None.
    Bonuses: Grants 10% of research points required for Astronomy.
    Cost: Very low. Easy transferability.

    Astronomy
    Prerequisites: None.
    Bonuses: Centers World Map. Automatically grants Calendar tech. +1 to sea movement.
    Cost: Moderate. Moderate transferability.

    Abstract Arithmetic
    Prerequisites: None.
    Bonuses: ?
    Cost: Low. Easy transferability.

    Writing
    Prerequisites: None.
    Bonuses: Allows construction of Library. +100% transferability of technologies with other Writing civilizations. +20% to all research rates.
    Cost: High. Easy transferability.

    Alphabet
    Prerequisites: Writing.
    Bonuses: -10% Library cost. Further +25% transferability of technologies with other Writing civilizations. Further +5% to all research rates.
    Cost: Moderate. Easy transferability.

    Geometry
    Prerequisites: Writing, Abstract Arithmetic.
    Bonuses: Grants 20% of research points required for Astronomy.
    Cost: High. Moderate transferability.

    Architectural Engineering
    Prerequisites: Geometry.
    Bonuses: All Walls, Forts, and Castles give +10% protection points. Building costs are reduced by 5%. Allows recruitement of Ballistae (basically the equivalent of Catapults in unmodded Civ IV).
    Cost: High. Moderate transferability.

    Mining
    Prerequisites: None.
    Bonuses: Allows construction of Mines. With Bronze Working, allows Copper to be viewed. With Iron Working, allows Iron to be viewed. With Aluminum Construction, allows Aluminum to be viewed. With Fission, allows Uranium to be viewed.
    Cost: Low. Easy transferability.

    Bronze Working
    Prerequisites: None.
    Bonuses: With Mining, allows Copper to be viewed. In cities with access to Copper, +1 strength to all Melee units (not cumulative with Iron Working bonus).
    Cost: Moderate. Easy transferability.

    Iron Working
    Prerequisites: None.
    Bonuses: With Mining, allows Iron to be viewed. In cities with access to Iron, +1 strength to all Melee units (not cumulative with Bronze Working bonus). Grants 10% of research points required for Compass.
    Cost: Moderate. Easy transferability.

    Metal Casting
    Prerequisites: Bronze Working or Iron Working or Aluminum Construction.
    Bonuses: Allows construction of Forges, The Colossus, and Workshops. Grants 20% of research points required for Compass.
    Cost: Moderate. Easy transferability.

    Masonry
    Prerequisites: Agricultural Society civic.
    Bonuses: Allows construction of Walls, The Pyramids, Quarries, and Paved Roads (improved Road improvement, but takes longer to build).
    Cost: Low. Easy transferability.

    The Wheel
    Prerequisites: None.
    Bonuses: With Animal Husbandry, allows recruitment of Chariots. +1 movement for Workers and Settlers.
    Cost: Low. Easy transferability.

    Riding
    Prerequisites: Animal Husbandry.
    Bonuses: In cities with access to Horses or Camels, allows recruitment of Horse Archers or Camel Archers, as well as any other Cavalry units enabled by other technologies.
    Cost: Low. Easy transferability.

    Currency
    Prerequisites: None.
    Bonuses: +1 trade route per city. Allows construction of Wealth.
    Cost: Moderate. Easy transferability.
     
  7. jaynus

    jaynus Chieftain

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    Short post here (Im binging coding python, so im going to reply to everything tommarow...cant **** up my chi you know)

    Simetrical - Do you have aim? Im going to email you some stuff...aim would be easy to collaberate :)

    Lag issue - The best snag I can find about this so far is the massive increase in units that the AI has because of the extended turns. I can't confirm this though. Im going to go bump heads with the other slow-mod makers and see if anyone else is getting this, otherwise im going to need to narrow it down inside the mod.
     
  8. woodelf

    woodelf Bard Retired Moderator

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    I'm not sure how there could be a lag issue at 3900BC because of increased AI units. How could they have any built in 5 turns? Or do they start with a lot more? Maybe there was an increase in wild animals put in?
     
  9. DeadZoneMDx

    DeadZoneMDx Chieftain

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    I removed the python scripts, that happens to speed it back up again
     
  10. Youri

    Youri Chieftain

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    In reality siege weapons can fire from long distances, without getting in danger (except other siege weapons). In Civ 4 you have to use a siege weaopn as a suicide bomber. I'd like to see siege weapons become a bit more like they were in Civ 3.

    My suggestions to change:

    - Siege weapons can no longer defend theirselves, since they can not fire at point blank. Instead, attacking an undefended siege weapon should allow you to capture it.
    - Siege weapons can no longer attack like other units, their attacks should be limited to bombarding. During a bombard, it can shoot only once, and the siege weapon does not get damaged (it's at a safe range, remember?). It still causes collateral damage.

    This would make siege weapons more realistic, without making them overpowered.
     
  11. jaynus

    jaynus Chieftain

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    Version 0.5 posted, its a *small* update, mostly to fix the major lag issue. I had an error in the python code I was passing, it lagged every time it hit it (it hit it alot of times hehe). That is fixed.

    Tonight will be v0.6, a bigger update I promise.

    Youri - Im working on this. The engine is still a bit..hm...cranky about doing modifications like this. I've been investigating it along with all my other python changes, and it should come soon enough. I agree, its a rather annoying thing to have kamakazi catapults.

    DeadZoneMDx - You are correct sir. I just posted the fix so you should not have to do this anymore.
     
  12. woodelf

    woodelf Bard Retired Moderator

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    Great news jaynus. Now I'll be able to offer some feedback since I'll get beyond 3700BC!

    Any thoughts to incorporate some of the other little Mods floating around? Like the tree planting, snoopy's, or the medieval units tweaking mods?
     
  13. jaynus

    jaynus Chieftain

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    yessir I have :) I am waiting for them all to get a little further along to ask, it would be a ***** to upkeep them with constant updates going in.
     
  14. Gunner

    Gunner Emperor

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    This mod seems very creative. Your server, however, doesnt seem to be working for me. Is there any reason you couldn't just host it on civfanatics? I assume the file isnt very large.
     
  15. jaynus

    jaynus Chieftain

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    It should be working now, Im sorry :( I somehow got a typo into the post. But no, its too big to host on civfanatics...its almost 1mb
     
  16. Gunner

    Gunner Emperor

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    The upload size limit is 3MB. There's a little bar at the bottom right of the forum screen which has a button which says "Upload File." Try that.
     
  17. woodelf

    woodelf Bard Retired Moderator

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    Yeah, good thinking. I was going to bastardize the mods I mentioned with yours, but didn't for the same reason...it'd be a bear to keep updating. :D
     
  18. woodelf

    woodelf Bard Retired Moderator

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    It runs quick now. No more lag. :)

    I'm still torn on whether or not the research should be doubled at such an early age. If your scout dies you're almost resigned to hitting "enter" a lot until something happens and you get a tech where a worker can do something. Maybe it'll grow on me...

    Have you thought about tweaking the number of cities before you get penalized? On the standard map your budget goes -1g at the 3rd city and -3g for the 4th. With tech so costly should this be adjusted so you can keep up?

    Just throwing some ideas out there. Now back to playing since my last game put me on an island solo and I didn't think I'd get to playtest much without some AI pestering me. ;)
     
  19. Lachlan

    Lachlan Great Builder of Civs !

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    Jaynus what do you think of a simulation of splitting empires ?
     
  20. woodelf

    woodelf Bard Retired Moderator

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    2 more observations.

    Are 90 hammers too much for clearing a forest? It was a shock to me when I completed the Pyramids waaaay sooner than I thought.

    And I like the fact that research/culture/whatever can be broken down further than in tens. Having 95% research was a nice surprise.

    One last question: I noticed that the description of the techs are updated, but Sid's tips about the techs aren't. Is this hardcoded?
     

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