Climate Change is Racist!

The global warming will make the world more turbulent politically too. I don't think the third world is going to sit still when they become even more poor and miserable.

What kind of tools do they have to get heard though?

Yep. So when folks be like "trying to address climate change is just a way to cut poor people out of growth" I'm like, :dubious: your timescale is way off.

European countries tend to be better equipped to deal with climate change. I don't think it is a matter of racism on the part of climate change - as real as it surely is.
 
It would also be foolhardy to conclude anything by noting higher temperature changes in areas with less water. That unto itself has minimal predictive value...IE what do you expect to see as a result of it? Nothing, just an acknowledgement of the fact that water has a larger specific heat than most things on land.

I wouldn't say it has minimal predictive power. Take all the predictions of global warming (seasonal changes, agricultural production, etc.), adapt them to a specific area that experiences greater warming due to less water and there you go.
 
They're bringing pretty much of it in Iraq and Afghanistan still.

That's because the US was dumb enough to show up there in the first place.
 
They're bringing pretty much of it in Iraq and Afghanistan still.

:rolleyes: Please. The fighting is Iraq and Afghanistan are nothing more than isolated regional insurgencies that would stand absolutely zero chance against the West if the US and EU brought their full military might to bear against them.

When the US invaded Iraq in 2003, how long did it take to topple Saddam's government? Three or four weeks? And that was just the US, and the US was only using a very small fraction of its total military capability. It was the same in late 2001-2002 against the Taliban. Their regime was toppled by the NATO invasion in mere weeks as well.

The only reason ISIS and the Taliban are still hanging around now, is because the West cannot commit its full military might against them because of the political consequences. Those consequences would not be a factor in the civilizational struggle you are alluding to. In that case, the West could bring its full arsenal to bear.

Here's a little number comparison to give you an idea of just how much military potential exists in just the US alone: The US currently spends more than any other single nation on its military and the US military budget is larger than the next 14 largest military spenders. The US is also universally regarded as having the most powerful, well-equipped, and well-trained military and maintains a global presence with the ability to project military power anywhere on the planet.

Yet all that military might comes at just a small cost (relatively speaking) to the US as a whole. The current US military budget is roughly around 3.8% of the national GDP. Just 3.8% and the US is able to field the most powerful military force human civilization has ever known. Compare this to the last time the US was in a "total war" status, WWII. During WWII, US military spending comprised roughly 41% (that's right 41%, not 4.1%) of the national GDP.

So if the US is able to field the most powerful military in the history of mankind on just 3.8% of its GDP, just imagine what kind of force the US could field if we went into total war status again and ramped that spending back up to that 41% mark.
 

Oh, I have no doubt that US couldn't crush it's enemies. The question is more about how unpleasant those enemies will make the lives of the Americans in the meanwhile.

And also, US doesn't exist in vacuum. What about the cheap resources of Africa or the oil of Saudi-Arabia?
 
Oh, I have no doubt that US couldn't crush it's enemies. The question is more about how unpleasant those enemies will make the lives of the Americans in the meanwhile.

And also, US doesn't exist in vacuum. What about the cheap resources of Africa or the oil of Saudi-Arabia?

Well if we assume the "battle lines" would be drawn according to the image in the OP, Saudi Arabia would be firmly on the US's side in this conflict along with China, Russia, and most of Europe. Basically it would be like the high school varsity football team ganging up on a kindergarten class.

As for resources, in war like that, the US and its allies have more than enough of a strategic reserve to last them until they can snatch those resources away from the Africans.

All nationalist chest-pounding aside though, the main point I'm trying to make is that there is a reason the have-nots of the world haven't done anything to change their spot on the global pecking order; it's because there's nothing they can do about it. The powerful nations of the world have ensured that they will be the ones on top pretty much until the end of human civilization. The power disparity between the powerful nations and the not-so-powerful nations has grown so large that the only way the weaker nations stand any chance of changing their situation would be if all the powerful nations turned on each other and destroyed each other in some Fallout-esque apocalyptic war.
 
It's a bit like the gini co-efficient and the median wage. Internal reforms could go a long way to improving their economic growth. We do our bit by correctly targeting specific charity efforts and liberalizing trade where it's of mutual benefit. On average, they can converge. But their 1% might never catch up to the 1% of the USA, since inequality at the margins might always grow.
 
Free trade is rarely of mutual benefit to third world nations who can't keep up with the cheap consumer goods that first world nations produce.

You mean that they produce for the first world nations?
 
Free trade means that the private sector of one nation will compete against the private sector of another. For a 3rd world country whose private sector is generally worse than that of a first world this would be like a match between Muhammed Ali and some random passerby off the streets.
 
I wouldn't say it has minimal predictive power. Take all the predictions of global warming (seasonal changes, agricultural production, etc.), adapt them to a specific area that experiences greater warming due to less water and there you go.

It doesn't matter one bit to Australia what the "average temperature of the southern hemisphere" is or that it's less than NA in variance. What matters to Australia is whether the change impacts their water, food, energy, and regional temperature variance, not that because the Indian Ocean exists, their hemisphere is technically cooler.

Replace "Australia" with any country you feel like and it doesn't change. That one hemisphere has a different average temperature due to more water is not useful in predicting seasonal changes, agricultural production, or "etc." on the land masses. Australia could get hotter by more than any other place on Earth, and the ocean temperatures would still make the SH appear cooler and less variant.

They're bringing pretty much of it in Iraq and Afghanistan still.

Nonsense. We're not talking about political posturing wars in this hypothetical. We're talking about a theoretical where climate change introduces additional scarcity beyond what technology can keep up with. Afghanistan can try to invade the USA, Russia, India, EU (insofar as it would hold together in true crisis) or even Iran by itself all it wants, but it isn't going to take those places over and get more resources. Their guns are bigger.

And the difference would only grow in crisis times. Nations with unstable water supplies and limited technology are going to struggle to mobilize anything resembling an organized force. Maybe they can cause problems with massive exodus of refugees, but that's about it.

Oh, I have no doubt that US couldn't crush it's enemies. The question is more about how unpleasant those enemies will make the lives of the Americans in the meanwhile.

And also, US doesn't exist in vacuum. What about the cheap resources of Africa or the oil of Saudi-Arabia?

A world scarcity crisis goes way past just the US, but you're still going to see applied theory of how people act when they have (or don't have) scarce resources necessary to live. Realistically, US would feel some squeeze by migration but North America as a whole is in a better place wrt pop density and geography than Africa, Asia, or even Europe. There's fewer political entities of similar power, longer traveling distances to leave one area of governance, and less people per square area. Even so, it would be hell, but less hellish than elsewhere unless the strife fractured the USA (only a legitimate possibility if the military turns on the government or divides, but history has seen exactly that happen more than once elsewhere, and the US civil war nearly tore it apart).

All nationalist chest-pounding aside though, the main point I'm trying to make is that there is a reason the have-nots of the world haven't done anything to change their spot on the global pecking order; it's because there's nothing they can do about it.

That's not completely true. It's easy to say "Africa" as an entity, but the countries in Africa have different situations, and while none are as well off as USA/Europe/China/India (and given the geography, population, and natural resources aren't in the same boat) some are far in front of others in terms of government stability, median wealth, and military capability, and that's true even if you separate North Africa out from nations south of the Sahara. This disparity exists at least in part (and it could be a very large part) due to how the leadership of a given country has progressed there, and is a similar reason for the disparity between North and South Korea.

No, Mali can't march into Europe and conquer Italy (unless we're talking distant future), but that's besides the point.

Free trade is rarely of mutual benefit to third world nations who can't keep up with the cheap consumer goods that first world nations produce.

It might be useful for governments in Africa to look at some of the nations in Asia that vaulted forward in economic wealth and mirror some of the tactics.
 
This image shows which nations have the greatest chance of surviving relatively unscathed by global climate change:

(...)

Africa and South America (i.e. the brown/black people) will be the hardest hit by global climate change while North America and Europe (the white people) will remain minimally impacted by global climate change.

Doesn't global climate change realize that black lives matter?

Alba.png


Translation:

And the Anglos call out: the Scottish / Albanian people must be preserved. :D
 
:rolleyes: Please. The fighting is Iraq and Afghanistan are nothing more than isolated regional insurgencies that would stand absolutely zero chance against the West if the US and EU brought their full military might to bear against them.

When the US invaded Iraq in 2003, how long did it take to topple Saddam's government? Three or four weeks? And that was just the US, and the US was only using a very small fraction of its total military capability. It was the same in late 2001-2002 against the Taliban. Their regime was toppled by the NATO invasion in mere weeks as well.

The only reason ISIS and the Taliban are still hanging around now, is because the West cannot commit its full military might against them because of the political consequences. Those consequences would not be a factor in the civilizational struggle you are alluding to. In that case, the West could bring its full arsenal to bear.

Here's a little number comparison to give you an idea of just how much military potential exists in just the US alone: The US currently spends more than any other single nation on its military and the US military budget is larger than the next 14 largest military spenders. The US is also universally regarded as having the most powerful, well-equipped, and well-trained military and maintains a global presence with the ability to project military power anywhere on the planet.

Yet all that military might comes at just a small cost (relatively speaking) to the US as a whole. The current US military budget is roughly around 3.8% of the national GDP. Just 3.8% and the US is able to field the most powerful military force human civilization has ever known. Compare this to the last time the US was in a "total war" status, WWII. During WWII, US military spending comprised roughly 41% (that's right 41%, not 4.1%) of the national GDP.

So if the US is able to field the most powerful military in the history of mankind on just 3.8% of its GDP, just imagine what kind of force the US could field if we went into total war status again and ramped that spending back up to that 41% mark.

One of the great errors of thinking we made during the last half-century or so is the belief that all conflict can be simplified like that - that you can solve any problem by throwing enough men, with enough weapons and enough ammunition, in its direction. In reality, conventional military force is less a hammer and more a screwdriver: we might try applying it to problems that it doesn't suit, but what we end up with is often not even a half-baked solution: it's often a total mess. We only started making any progress in places like Iraq and Afghanistan when we realised that we couldn't simply start shooting people, subtract friendly casualties from enemy, and call it a victory if the total came out positive. Instead, you can only defeat an insurgency - which by definition makes the line between 'enemy combatant' and 'civilian' blurry if not non-existent - by convincing ordinary people that they want to be on your side. The only way to make it go away, short of doing this, is simply to kill everyone in the area and be left king of the desert. If you want to be left with a world worth the trouble of fighting over it, you have to realise that being good at fighting isn't enough.
 
One of the great errors of thinking we made during the last half-century or so is the belief that all conflict can be simplified like that - that you can solve any problem by throwing enough men, with enough weapons and enough ammunition, in its direction. In reality, conventional military force is less a hammer and more a screwdriver: we might try applying it to problems that it doesn't suit, but what we end up with is often not even a half-baked solution: it's often a total mess. We only started making any progress in places like Iraq and Afghanistan when we realised that we couldn't simply start shooting people, subtract friendly casualties from enemy, and call it a victory if the total came out positive. Instead, you can only defeat an insurgency - which by definition makes the line between 'enemy combatant' and 'civilian' blurry if not non-existent - by convincing ordinary people that they want to be on your side. The only way to make it go away, short of doing this, is simply to kill everyone in the area and be left king of the desert. If you want to be left with a world worth the trouble of fighting over it, you have to realise that being good at fighting isn't enough.

Of course. I agree completely with everything you are saying. That post though, was a response to this rising sentiment I'm noticing that groups like the Taliban and ISIS can compete militarily with the major powers of this world. Sure, they are pretty good at causing trouble and making noise in their own region, but that does not make them a military power. In fact, it is only the non-military factors (such as the lack of political and social will to commit to another large-scale counter-insurgency operation in the Middle East) that allow groups like that to have the degree of success they currently have. This is evidenced by the fact that every time an insurgency has been forced to engage a conventional military power in a conventional military battle, they get absolutely crushed.
 
I don't believe that insurgencies ever are forced to engage in conventional battles; I believe that they cannot achieve the ends of conventional force (such as taking and holding ground from the enemy) without becoming as such, but I also believe that those ends are not necessarily theirs. I believe that an insurgency is by definition fundamentally local: it can turn into something like ISIS which eventually becomes a conventional army (compare Washington's army, for example), but then you cease to have that all-important blurred line between (to use Clausewitz' terms) 'people' and 'army'. In other words, stopping ISIS from taking Baghdad is a totally different proposition from driving the Taliban out of Helmand. Unfortunately, we're now inter-connected enough that even a fundamentally local organisation (as, as I've said, all insurgencies by definition are) can cause trouble outside its home region. The IRA were a perfect example when I was in, and now we have al-Qaeda and the like organising attacks on foreign soil - not invasions, because they don't have the conventional force necessary for those, but then they're not interested in those.

Incidentally, I doubt whether a successful counter-insurgency is simply a matter of money to throw at the problem - I believe we've usually had the resources to do well, but failed to do so because the strategy has been lacking. I don't think there's an easy way to convert a given amount of dollars into a given amount of intelligent thought, certainly not without taking a serious look at our organisational culture. Personally, I think the military mentality in which authority feels undermined when it's questioned in public (how often does that happen in civilian life?), in which seniors are encouraged to 'get amongst' their juniors and involve themselves are personally as possible in every task, and where 'courage in your convictions' often becomes bull-headedness makes seriously original and sensible thinking quite difficult.

Of course, there are plenty of good reasons why we have that culture - when your section starts coming under fire, people die if you can't get them to do the right thing quickly, without thinking about it or questioning it. A reasonably plan executed on time and with conviction will probably succeed, but a great plan executed late and lethargically probably won't. Likewise, when you task a group of teenagers with the usual Army-recruit level of brainpower to get a job done, you often end up finding all sorts of novel ways in which it can be fouled up unless you keep a close eye on it. Similarly, if you can't act decisively and keep the initiative in testing situations, you're done for. This isn't an easy problem, by any measure, and I don't profess to be able to solve it.
 
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