Climate change stupidity.

He has a history of defending slavery; he defends the CSA at every oppertunity, argues that it wasn't "that bad" for black slaves prior to them gaining freedom, created a thread in which he espoused the idea of those who're in debt should be forced to literally work for the debtor or something like that.

Seriously, it's pretty disturbing.

Regarding slavery, I absolutely disagree with it. I will remind you that the Greek word for slavery in the Bible is used to mean different things in English, and whether "Slave" is the correct translation or something closer to "Indentured Servant" is sometimes tough to figure out.

Regarding the Confederates, I defend their legal right to secede, and I consistently tell people the North really isn't all that much better, the the CSA itself had numerous wrongs that needed to be corrected, and probably would have been corrected even if they won the Civil War, much how the North itself had numerous wrongs that needed correction, and were corrected.

To be honest, the standard of living of the majority of the slaves, who were owned by people that had small farms and only one or two slaves, were, I think, a little better than the people who had to work 80+ hours a week to survive immediately after the Civil War.

That doesn't make either one OK.

As for those being in debt, there should certainly be some kind of consequence for not paying people what they are owed. The Old Testament system, while not really applicable today, provide a system where there is both justice (You don't just walk off scot-free and end up making interest rates higher for everyone else) and mercy (They only have to serve for seven years, and are given more capital to work with afterwards.)
And what if God wanted to the Bible to be a metaphor? Him writing it (technically letting someone else write down his words) doesn't mean we have to take it literally.

To come back on Methuselah's age: can we be sure that the author used 969 literally and not just as a proverb? In English, saying someone is 'as strong as a bear' doesn't actually mean that person is as strong as a bear. But someone reading an English text 2500 years later might very well take it literally.

There are more numbers used to signify particular things in the Bible (40 and 7 coming to mind), so why can't this number be one like the others too?

Unless God uses Hebrew as his native language, he probably didn't inspire the Bible's writers with Hebrew words. Surely, as you believe he is omnipotent, there is a simpler way for him to get the message through. But the Bible's writers, being human and fallible, might have made a 'translation' error when writing it down, using 969 in the figurative sense while it would later be interpreted literally or the other way round.

Can we be SURE? No, I guess not.

However, the entire book of Genesis is written as a literal text. It is a historical narrative, from beginning to end. Revelation, on the other hand, is Jewish apocalyptic literature full of metaphors. While there are definitely parts that should be taken literally, its undeniable that not ALL of it is supposed to be taken literally.

As for him inspiring the Bible with Hebrew words, I think he did, since the writers actually spoke Hebrew and would understand it. God can speak in any language he likes.

I would also like to comment on an alternative interpretation. Some people think the "Years" are months and thus they didn't really live the extraordinary lengths of time that the text claimed. However, the reality is that at least two people "Begat" a child at 65 "Years" of age. 65 "Months" is 5 1/2 years. I don't think a 5 1/2 year old man can have kids. The intent seems to be literal. I just don't see any good reason to take that text metaphorically.

This thread proves that the Bible simply cannot be taken 100% literally, however many times II Timothy is invoked, without a certain amount of interpretation applied as well. The inability for critical thought at a young age is one of the reasons why I believe that children should not be raised in a religion. I was and I favour instinctively the religious education I received, yet I have no problems with taking issue with what GW believes.

Actually, you COULD take it 100% literally, but that pretty obviously wouldn't be the intent. Both John of Patmos and the prophet Daniel see visions of strange looking, clearly non-existant "Beasts." Other than the occasional little kid who reads it, nobody really thinks that these beasts will literally walk the Earth. Its a metaphor for something.

There's nothing wrong with a mostly literal text using an occasional metaphor. Daniel, notably, is pretty clearly divided into two parts (I am not famililar with the last two chapters that Catholics have in their Bible but Protestants for some reason do not have in their Bible, so for any Catholics in the audience when I say "Daniel" I'm referring to chapters 1-12, since I don't know anything about 13-14). The first half seems to be clearly describing actual events, the stuff that HAPPENED to Daniel, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abendigo. There's no metaphor there. The second part seems to be pretty clearly describing metaphors, things that are seen in visions but actually mean something different. Nebuchadnezzer's dream is something that happens in the first half of the book, and while the dream itself did happen, and was prophetically told and interpreted by Daniel, the dream itself was metaphorical, the golden head representing Babylon, the silver Persia, the bronze Alexander's Macedonia, and the iron Rome, with the iron mixed with clay in the legs being the prophecy of Rome splitting into two.

In fact, not only is it a metaphor, Daniel even says so, although he doesn't name the nations involved. It seems clear from the text, now that we've SEEN 2,500 more years of history, that the above is what the metaphor is explaining.

Not all of Revelation has really happened yet (Nor all of Daniel as well) but the same appliees. Its apocalyptic literature, its not MEANT to be taken literally. Its about seeing visions.

Genesis, on the other hand, is a historical narrative. Its explained as a historical narrative. And New Testament writers assume at least most of it is historical narrative. Jesus names the prophets "From Abel to Zechariah" (Zechariah was actually the last one even though Malachi is for some reason the 39th book, he is chronologically before Zechariah). The writer of Hebrews says "By faith Abel..." and James says "Was not your father Abraham (Implying he really existed, and he really said and did the things that, who guessed it, Genesis says he did.) Its treated as a historical narrative, throughout the Bible. Now, is it possible that, in spite of that, the first three chapters were actually in some sense metaphorical? I'm not so prideful as to say anything is impossible, or that I can't be wrong, but all of the evidence in the Bible says to me the each of the 50 chapters are a historical narrative of the pre-Israelite period.
 
Regarding slavery, I absolutely disagree with it. I will remind you that the Greek word for slavery in the Bible is used to mean different things in English, and whether "Slave" is the correct translation or something closer to "Indentured Servant" is sometimes tough to figure out.

Well, jeez, maybe they'd have used the word "indentured servant" then.

That having been said, there was certainly a lot of slavery back then, all of it condoned by God.

Regarding the Confederates, I defend their legal right to secede, and I consistently tell people the North really isn't all that much better, the the CSA itself had numerous wrongs that needed to be corrected, and probably would have been corrected even if they won the Civil War, much how the North itself had numerous wrongs that needed correction, and were corrected.

How do you figure?

If it hadn't been for slavery, there'd have been no secession debate.

To be honest, the standard of living of the majority of the slaves, who were owned by people that had small farms and only one or two slaves, were, I think, a little better than the people who had to work 80+ hours a week to survive immediately after the Civil War.

Standard of living > freedom. Good libertarianism there, bub.

As for those being in debt, there should certainly be some kind of consequence for not paying people what they are owed. The Old Testament system, while not really applicable today, provide a system where there is both justice (You don't just walk off scot-free and end up making interest rates higher for everyone else) and mercy (They only have to serve for seven years, and are given more capital to work with afterwards.)

Sounds like a personal problem to me. Isn't usury a sin?
 
Snakes talk as often as 5 1/2 year olds get kids.

Actually, there are some people who think that before the Fall animals actually were able to speak. That's not Biblically clear, but its a valid hypothesis, and isn't unbiblical in any way.

Either way though, the serpent in question was clearly possessed by Satan.

On the other hand "So and so begat so and so" seems to refer to a normal, non-miraculous event. I would say back then living 900+ years was not miraculous, that the pre-Flood earth was very different than the post-flood earth and thus lives were much longer. The people that say "The years are months" obviously reject this premise. They say that its impossible for a person to non-miraculously live 900 years (In other words, putting modern standards on a pre-Flood earth.) But by those same standards, 5 1/2 year olds can't have kids. So they don't really solve anything by that hypothesis.
 
The scientific basis for these claims is
 
Crezth, did he really write all the things you just quoted?

Omg...he really must be 17. That was just....breathtaking in it's......it's just breathtaking.

I almost want to go back through the threads but everything he writes is tl;dr and uninteresting. But I want to find those little chestnuts and shred them up for fun. Almost. Eh, it's just way tl.
 
Actually, there are some people who think that before the Fall animals actually were able to speak. That's not Biblically clear, but its a valid hypothesis, and isn't unbiblical in any way.

Either way though, the serpent in question was clearly possessed by Satan.

On the other hand "So and so begat so and so" seems to refer to a normal, non-miraculous event. I would say back then living 900+ years was not miraculous, that the pre-Flood earth was very different than the post-flood earth and thus lives were much longer. The people that say "The years are months" obviously reject this premise. They say that its impossible for a person to non-miraculously live 900 years (In other words, putting modern standards on a pre-Flood earth.) But by those same standards, 5 1/2 year olds can't have kids. So they don't really solve anything by that hypothesis.

lul wut?
 
Or the serpent is a very holy beastie in Egypt and the people who wrote that story were keen to make it the bad guy.

Nah, your explanation is way more likely.
 
Ghost is primal case of Poe's Law. He goes against logic and would be a great comedian... if the comedy he provided was not in fact his real view.
 
I just don't know how someone can be so prolific and extensive in their posts and also only be 17...and not be a cylon.:scan:

Edit: Actually, yes I do. Homeschooled. Also explains the crazy talk.
 
Thank the Heavens that the "people get more conserative as they go older" thing is nonesence. Can one imagine what this Jack Chick figure be like if thy went more ultraconserative?!
 
Thank the Heavens that the "people get more conserative as they go older" thing is nonesence. Can one imagine what this Jack Chick figure be like if thy went more ultraconserative?!

I'm more scared of what he'd be like if he could type even faster.;)
 
On the other hand "So and so begat so and so" seems to refer to a normal, non-miraculous event. I would say back then living 900+ years was not miraculous, that the pre-Flood earth was very different than the post-flood earth and thus lives were much longer.

What was different about the pre-flood earth that enabled living for 900 years? What was different about the Hayflick limit?

The people that say "The years are months" obviously reject this premise. They say that its impossible for a person to non-miraculously live 900 years (In other words, putting modern standards on a pre-Flood earth.) But by those same standards, 5 1/2 year olds can't have kids. So they don't really solve anything by that hypothesis.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lina_Medina
 
I just don't know how someone can be so prolific and extensive in their posts and also only be 17...and not be a cylon.:scan:

Edit: Actually, yes I do. Homeschooled. Also explains the crazy talk.

:lol:

I was homeschooled at one point, but have been in public school all of last year. Most of the people there aren't as smart as you guys, and rarely can stand up to me in a debate.

Thank the Heavens that the "people get more conserative as they go older" thing is nonesence. Can one imagine what this Jack Chick figure be like if thy went more ultraconserative?!

I actually addressed Jack Chick in another thread when you made the comparison.

I'm more scared of what he'd be like if he could type even faster.;)

:lol:

What was different about the pre-flood earth that enabled living for 900 years? What was different about the Hayflick limit?



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lina_Medina

First paragraph: Different Earth conditions caused by a canopy of water surrounding it, creating a temperate environment, much less harm from ultraviolet rays, and similar, enabling life to last much longer. I'm not sure about the Hayflick limit though, perhaps it didn't exist, or if it did, it applied more slowly since aging simply happened less quickly.

As for the second part, doesn't matter. A 5 1/2 year old MALE cannot be a father. There aren't any women in that particular genealogy mentioned at all, and how old they were is not made clear.
 
First paragraph: Different Earth conditions caused by a canopy of water surrounding it, creating a temperate environment, much less harm from ultraviolet rays, and similar, enabling life to last much longer.

Haha woa.
 
As for those being in debt, there should certainly be some kind of consequence for not paying people what they are owed. The Old Testament system, while not really applicable today, provide a system where there is both justice (You don't just walk off scot-free and end up making interest rates higher for everyone else) and mercy (They only have to serve for seven years, and are given more capital to work with afterwards.)

Leaving aside the question of slavery, do you actually think that indentured servitude is a good solution for those who cannot pay their debts?

I think you'll find economists in agreement that lenient bankruptcy laws are key to ensuring commercial success within a society.

However, the entire book of Genesis is written as a literal text. It is a historical narrative, from beginning to end.

Wait, do you honestly believe that the Great Flood actually happened? I mean, I know it's you, and I know you're still young, but damn.

Spoiler You know what's coming... :

3cd8a33a.png



Omg...he really must be 17. That was just....breathtaking in it's......it's just breathtaking.

As I recall, Dommy is in grade 12. So he is probably 17 indeed.
 
First paragraph: Different Earth conditions caused by a canopy of water surrounding it, creating a temperate environment, much less harm from ultraviolet rays, and similar, enabling life to last much longer. I'm not sure about the Hayflick limit though, perhaps it didn't exist, or if it did, it applied more slowly since aging simply happened less quickly.

Explain the mechanisms for the above.

As for the second part, doesn't matter. A 5 1/2 year old MALE cannot be a father. There aren't any women in that particular genealogy mentioned at all, and how old they were is not made clear.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20333877

It's also worth noting that a good number of my male ancestors (the majority I suspect) were younger than five.
 
First paragraph: Different Earth conditions caused by a canopy of water surrounding it, creating a temperate environment, much less harm from ultraviolet rays, and similar, enabling life to last much longer.

:lol: Come again? That is not how biology works.

It's also worth noting that a g[o]od number of my male ancestors (the majority I suspect) were younger than five.

Do tell. That sounds very interesting.
 
:lol:


First paragraph: Different Earth conditions caused by a canopy of water surrounding it, creating a temperate environment, much less harm from ultraviolet rays, and similar, enabling life to last much longer.
.

it's a miracle...
the thread is back on track... "Climate change stupidity"
 
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