Yes, you can run Windows programs on Macs using WINE or VirtualBox or Parallels or VMWare Fusion. That is either difficult to do, or expensive. And it doesn't make them into Mac programs.
- Thread starter Quintillus
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Blue Monkey
Archon Without Portfolio
When I see there are new posts in this thread I'm hoping for a new release. Or at least discussion about people's work with the current version. Not OT.
An extended discussion of utilities for other purposes and or an extended discussion of ways to run programs under a different OS are off the topic of this thread. There's a a C3 Mac subforum where the latter issue is discussed. The various utilities have threads of their own.
An extended discussion of utilities for other purposes and or an extended discussion of ways to run programs under a different OS are off the topic of this thread. There's a a C3 Mac subforum where the latter issue is discussed. The various utilities have threads of their own.
I'm sorry, Blue Monkey, but if someone who unlike you is considered fit to be a moderator is participating in the discussion then we can guess that a post you're not interested in might be worthy of non-deletion.
Moderator Action: Infracted for flaming. Comments like that are uncalled for.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889
_________________________
*I mean WINE of course, I haven't been drinking, no sir. Ignore the bottle, please.
Moderator Action: Infracted for flaming. Comments like that are uncalled for.
Please read the forum rules: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=422889
Alan, other than the wine* I think you can still use some hex editors but I've never done so.
_________________________
*I mean WINE of course, I haven't been drinking, no sir. Ignore the bottle, please.
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Hi HockeyMask,
Welcome to CFC!
Like Lee mentioned, you can't edit the save files with this editor. You could adjust initial money for the scenario, but this editor won't be able to help you with any games already in progress (the SAV support is limited to re-gaining your scenario (.biq) from a .SAV in case you accidentally deleted it or otherwise don't have it anymore).
The Wine and hex editor options are the only possibilities that would work for (2) on a Mac, but I would not consider either to be easy, and the former might not work with the save game utility in question (I'm personally not familiar with any of them, but there apparently are some).
For (1), currently, you can only edit players if the BIQ you started with already had custom player data. So, Lee's file probably did, and your likely did not. That's a good idea for something for me to look into adding in one of the next few releases, especially now that custom maps can be added. Which, I do at some point need to look at a version 0.82 (I've added a little bit since 0.81 but it's been awhile). Unless it would be way too confusing to have two third-party editors with the same version.
- Quintillus
P.S. I'm also interested in hearing about work with the current version, if anyone has done anything interesting
.
[...] Unless it would be way too confusing to have two third-party editors with the same version.
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z
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Version 0.82 is now available!
This version has a couple of bug fixes, bug the raison d'être is improved landmark terrain support. Changes are:
In regards to landmark terrain, this indeed means that any terrain can be landmark. Testing has been done to ensure that all landmark terrains can receive custom food/shield/gold values from their standard terrains. Note that Marsh and Volcanoes do not receive custom landmark terrain graphics, and will always use the standard graphics. Note also that the landmark terrain marker, usually present in-game if food and shields are set to be displayed, does not appear to display for landmark terrains that weren't possible by default. The terrain, however, is still Landmark.
Also note that the editor cannot display custom landmark graphics other than base terrain, hills, and mountains yet. This does not affect the game itself. This has been de-prioritized in favor of making the current functionality available.
One other outstanding issue in terrain placement was noticed (and is not new). The essence of it is that sometimes, when editing terrain along coasts, the graphics between two tiles do not line up. This is because in these cases, there are be two or more PCXs that contain all the terrains that a tile borders, but the two options may look different visually, and the method of choosing which PCX to go with is not certain. It is as yet unknown whether there is a reasonable algorithm for this, or if it is an example of Exotic Firaxis Programming. The former is hoped for, but since it may be the latter, this release was not held up for it (and this has been present in previous versions as well). You may wish to decrease the auto-save interval in Settings while modifying coastal areas, or use the Firaxis editor for those areas when unusual landmark terrain is not required.
Some behind-the-scenes work on PCX files, to standardize Civ3 PCXs, which have invisible colors, with regular ones, was also done. In addition, some work was done on future features that are not yet ready for prime time.
This version has a couple of bug fixes, bug the raison d'être is improved landmark terrain support. Changes are:
- Can now add landmark terrain (of any terrain type) when there is a custom map
- City graphics of unusual size (such as the Empire State Building in the Manhattan map) now display properly
- Victory point locatioh graphics of unusual size (such as the Statue of Liberty in the Manhattan map) now display properly
- The right side panel on the map tab now reliably stays within a couple pixels of its intended size. This makes more of the map visible on large (above 1024x768) monitors
- The right side panel on the map tab now updates as soon as you do any change to the terrain. Previously, it would not update right away when you changed the terrain type.
- Volcanoes are now displayed in the editor. Previously, they would work in the game itself when added from the editor, but would not show up in the editor.
- Fix to make river placement work properly - in some cases you could not place rivers before
- Fix for graphics display not always working when hills/mountains were placed. This was caused by the base terrain being improperly set to hills/mountains, instead of grassland.
In regards to landmark terrain, this indeed means that any terrain can be landmark. Testing has been done to ensure that all landmark terrains can receive custom food/shield/gold values from their standard terrains. Note that Marsh and Volcanoes do not receive custom landmark terrain graphics, and will always use the standard graphics. Note also that the landmark terrain marker, usually present in-game if food and shields are set to be displayed, does not appear to display for landmark terrains that weren't possible by default. The terrain, however, is still Landmark.
Also note that the editor cannot display custom landmark graphics other than base terrain, hills, and mountains yet. This does not affect the game itself. This has been de-prioritized in favor of making the current functionality available.
One other outstanding issue in terrain placement was noticed (and is not new). The essence of it is that sometimes, when editing terrain along coasts, the graphics between two tiles do not line up. This is because in these cases, there are be two or more PCXs that contain all the terrains that a tile borders, but the two options may look different visually, and the method of choosing which PCX to go with is not certain. It is as yet unknown whether there is a reasonable algorithm for this, or if it is an example of Exotic Firaxis Programming. The former is hoped for, but since it may be the latter, this release was not held up for it (and this has been present in previous versions as well). You may wish to decrease the auto-save interval in Settings while modifying coastal areas, or use the Firaxis editor for those areas when unusual landmark terrain is not required.
Some behind-the-scenes work on PCX files, to standardize Civ3 PCXs, which have invisible colors, with regular ones, was also done. In addition, some work was done on future features that are not yet ready for prime time.
Blue Monkey
Archon Without Portfolio
Your continued work on this is deeply appreciated.
Hopefully there is a word missing???
It's well known that when using bmp2bic the generated map has blocky coasts until a single tile is repainted in the standard editor. Wonder if what you describe could be somehow related?
Blue Monkey
Archon Without Portfolio
Dl'd. Opened a couple of different custom biqs to take a look. Encountered the following problems:
Entirely possible something needed for proper installation got overlooked - it's been a while since I used the older version. & I didn't reread the older posts on installation / maps.
Note that there is no button to close a biq without making changes. So opening a second biq means it automatically refers to the first in the "compare to:" box. The only alternative seems to be quitting the editor & relaunching.
Quit & reopened editor to get a second look. Used MEM Crusader States biq (custom rules, map & lm terrain). Map graphics & interface showed fine. Tried to reopen Malucca Pirates biq - couldn't select map tab after opening biq.
All the biqs tried have their own custom maps, scenario folders and custom terrain graphics.
Spoiler :
Entirely possible something needed for proper installation got overlooked - it's been a while since I used the older version. & I didn't reread the older posts on installation / maps.
- Running OSX 10.6.8
- Game is installed in a non-standard location
- This editor is installed in a different directory path on same drive as game
Note that there is no button to close a biq without making changes. So opening a second biq means it automatically refers to the first in the "compare to:" box. The only alternative seems to be quitting the editor & relaunching.
Quit & reopened editor to get a second look. Used MEM Crusader States biq (custom rules, map & lm terrain). Map graphics & interface showed fine. Tried to reopen Malucca Pirates biq - couldn't select map tab after opening biq.
All the biqs tried have their own custom maps, scenario folders and custom terrain graphics.
Balthasar
Wise Man
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Don't be so sure; I've used an LMMarsh graphic successfully before.
I think it's exotic Fireaxis programming. When I made the LM Coasts for (near the top of) the Lost Worlds map, I had to play with it quite a bit to get it all to line up properly.
I look forward to seeing your results.
This is a great advance! I'll have to play with it a bit to see just what it can do, but so far, it's a dream come true...
Blue Monkey
Archon Without Portfolio
What was the pcx file called?
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Oops, yes, that is supposed to be that is does not affect the game. Not sure how that word disappeared.
Hmm... I shall have to test that theory about repainting a tile in the standard editor. Ideally I'd like to have it working in-editor, but that would be an OK work-around, especially if it is exotic Firaxis programming.
Dl'd. Opened a couple of different custom biqs to take a look. Encountered the following problems:
Spoiler :
Entirely possible something needed for proper installation got overlooked - it's been a while since I used the older version. & I didn't reread the older posts on installation / maps.
- Running OSX 10.6.8
- Game is installed in a non-standard location
- This editor is installed in a different directory path on same drive as game
Note that there is no button to close a biq without making changes. So opening a second biq means it automatically refers to the first in the "compare to:" box. The only alternative seems to be quitting the editor & relaunching.
Quit & reopened editor to get a second look. Used MEM Crusader States biq (custom rules, map & lm terrain). Map graphics & interface showed fine. Tried to reopen Malucca Pirates biq - couldn't select map tab after opening biq.
All the biqs tried have their own custom maps, scenario folders and custom terrain graphics.
My guess is it's a graphics issue specific to those scenarios; I'll test them. MEM is one of my common test cases; TAM isn't and I hadn't heard about the R&F of the Mughals or Mulacca Pirates. In the latter case, it sounds like it probably failed to load a certain graphic, but I'll investigate.
The setup sounds OK (as long as the editor correctly knows where Civ3 is installed), but if the scenarios works for me I'll see what happens on Linux (I don't own a Mac and am no longer in college, so Mac testing is difficult since Apple doesn't allow OSX on non-Apple hardware).
The list disappearing on scroll is weird. I'll have to play around with it on different systems and see what happens. I'm using a standard Java component for that, so I would've expected it to work out of the box.
I should also note that I don't recommend opening more than one BIQ without restarting unless using the BIQ compare functionality. Sometimes it is OK (as long as you are finished editing the first one/have saved it), but I have not gone through and verified that it won't cause problems in all cases, since functional improvements seems more important and the startup time isn't that bad.
Update: TAM Fertile Crescent is working OK on Windows for me (although from an internal non-boot drive). Rise and Fall of the Mughals is queued for download (I'm downloading v2 as that's what appears to be available). I haven't found the Mulacca Pirates yet. Do you have a link to it?
I was kind of wondering how you got those LM coasts next to regular coasts to display all nice. The editor currently can't emulate the Firaxis one for that case. I'd have to recommend using Firaxis's editor when doing something like that so you can tell when it is lined up properly.
Glad you and Blue Monkey are trying it out! It's at the stage now where I'm looking for things that people need it to do that I can implement in a reasonable timeframe, and landmark terrains appear to fit in that mix.
Blue Monkey
Archon Without Portfolio
The resizable window makes the editor functionally useful. Without zoom I wouldn't want to make a map from scratch but mostly I go the bmp2bic route anyway. I can test it for you by adding lm terrains - which is how I would be most likely to use it for practical purposes.
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Malucca Pirates is just a biq I made for myself that's a variant of the Mughals scenario. The only difference is that the Pirates are now a playable civ & a couple of their units don't become obsolete as they did in the standard scenario.
Tried again this evening - being careful to close & reopen the editor between opening different biqs. Also followed advice in the earlier post about trying to select/deselect "map enabled" in settings as a way to get map graphics to appear.
Opening Malucca Pirates - same as before. Opened the standard Mughals biq in case there was a problem with the biq I customized. Same result. No graphics. The map tab stayed greyed out for both biqs. Even after trying several combinations of closing/restarting with different map enabled settings.
TAM will probably be a good testbed for you because it has several biqs with custom maps & varying rules as well as a random map biq. I play it enough that I use it to test playability of map geography - importing its rules to the new map - when I'm designing. Again this evening I tried opening the Fertile Crescent & the Mediterranean Large biqs. No love. The map tab opens but it's blank. OTOH two maps where I imported its rules (Madeira's Atlantis & Rick's Battleground) both opened & properly displayed the maps. Same rules, graphics, search paths, etc. as the original biq(s). When I closed, reopened & tried opening the Fertile Crescent again the same problem with blank map occurred. That's a head-scratcher.
--------
Malucca Pirates is just a biq I made for myself that's a variant of the Mughals scenario. The only difference is that the Pirates are now a playable civ & a couple of their units don't become obsolete as they did in the standard scenario.
Tried again this evening - being careful to close & reopen the editor between opening different biqs. Also followed advice in the earlier post about trying to select/deselect "map enabled" in settings as a way to get map graphics to appear.
Opening Malucca Pirates - same as before. Opened the standard Mughals biq in case there was a problem with the biq I customized. Same result. No graphics. The map tab stayed greyed out for both biqs. Even after trying several combinations of closing/restarting with different map enabled settings.
TAM will probably be a good testbed for you because it has several biqs with custom maps & varying rules as well as a random map biq. I play it enough that I use it to test playability of map geography - importing its rules to the new map - when I'm designing. Again this evening I tried opening the Fertile Crescent & the Mediterranean Large biqs. No love. The map tab opens but it's blank. OTOH two maps where I imported its rules (Madeira's Atlantis & Rick's Battleground) both opened & properly displayed the maps. Same rules, graphics, search paths, etc. as the original biq(s). When I closed, reopened & tried opening the Fertile Crescent again the same problem with blank map occurred. That's a head-scratcher.
Blue Monkey
Archon Without Portfolio
Not just about this issue, but going forward, if there are tests you want made with an OSX set-up I'd be happy to run through anything you can post specific instructions for. doesn't need to be specifically tied to my own projects. Loading specific scenarios, trying certain combinations of terrains & rules, whatever. I usually have one or two testbed biqs active anyway.
There several scenarios such as the Dark Continent & Hollow Earth where I'm still wondering how to achieve certain results with limited terrain sets. Since I don't know what's possible, helping you may reveal a technique that I wouldn't have come to on my own. Being able to use LM Coast for Martian Canals is one example of what I mean. Obviates the need for kludgy solutions.
So feel free to aim some of your testing requirements my way.
There several scenarios such as the Dark Continent & Hollow Earth where I'm still wondering how to achieve certain results with limited terrain sets. Since I don't know what's possible, helping you may reveal a technique that I wouldn't have come to on my own. Being able to use LM Coast for Martian Canals is one example of what I mean. Obviates the need for kludgy solutions.
So feel free to aim some of your testing requirements my way.
Just a quick, "Thank You" for all your work on this Quintillus.
,
Oz
,Oz
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Hmm, that is a head-scratcher. TAM and the Mughals are working on Windows for me, so I'll have to try Linux or Solaris and see if I can get it to trip up there. At first I thought it might be a PCX capitalization issue (Windows is case-insensitive for files, but Unix/OSX care, and that has caused issues in the past), but the map tab shouldn't be openable at all if that happens. Is there anything in the log.txt with regards to an error (should be findable by searching for ERROR in caps)?
(Not sure exaclty when I'll get to this. Might be tonight, but there are other things that need done tonight too, and life gets busier starting Monday)
That would be helpful. Depending on whether I can figure out what's happening on my own setup, I might have some intermediary builds to test to see if this is fixed. Theoretically everything should work across all systems, but that unfortunately isn't always the case.
Off the top of my head, one thought is the horizontal scrolling (under Settings). On my Windows machines, and under my Linux VM, turning this on makes Shift+Scroll Wheel scroll horizontally, like in Firaxis's editor. However, on Unix VMs, it scrolls diagonally instead. I haven't been able to test it on Apple hardware. My suspicion is it goes diagonally.
Just a quick, "Thank You" for all your work on this Quintillus.
Oz
Thanks for dropping in!
Blue Monkey
Archon Without Portfolio
Never done this before so I may be quoting extraneous text. Quotes are CnP'd from the log.txt so there shouldn't be any typos.
Errors found in log.txt :
Here's a full run from the TAM Fertile Crescent biq with the only error I see bolded.
The "GraphicsImport - Out of memory" error also occurred with an unposted biq I'm working on. That biq has no custom terrain or rules as of yet. I had tried to open it prior to understanding not to open more than one biq during a session. So I'm not sure that case is relevant - probably just user error.
Let me know if I can run things in a specific way to generate a log for you. Or do anything else to ggive more info for debugging.
Errors found in log.txt :
& other similar errors with Malucca Pirates / Mughals. TerrainBuildings.pcx exists in the relevant folder, standard size & properly indexed.
Here's a full run from the TAM Fertile Crescent biq with the only error I see bolded.
Spoiler :
The "GraphicsImport - Out of memory" error also occurred with an unposted biq I'm working on. That biq has no custom terrain or rules as of yet. I had tried to open it prior to understanding not to open more than one biq during a session. So I'm not sure that case is relevant - probably just user error.
Let me know if I can run things in a specific way to generate a log for you. Or do anything else to ggive more info for debugging.
Blue Monkey
Archon Without Portfolio
Don't have mouse with scroll-wheel available. I use a two button trackball with a scroll ring. With the horizontal setting on it scrolls diagonally in an irregular zig-zag that - on first impression - seems to depend on speed.
Considering that the scenario projects progress on a time scale of months/years I don't think you need to worry about days / weeks.
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So far things look OK on my Ancient Linux VM. But, Blue Monkey, your quotes from the error log are definitely helpful in pointing me in the right direction on this.
The GraphicsImport indicates that something in the graphics file is tripping up the editor, and it appears to be something in the width. It's strange that it would work for me in that case however, especially when you also have a properly-sized PCX file. I'll take a look at my PCX for that scenario, and see if I see anything that looks non-standard.
The out of memory one is more familiar. Are you starting the editor with the Conquests Editor.jar program, or the launcher.jar program? When using the map, it's highly advisable to use launcher.jar, as otherwise the program might not have enough memory. This is because, by default, Java programs get 128 MB of memory, and while that's plenty for most functionality, it often isn't enough with all the graphics for the map.
I see I hadn't noted this in the first post, so I've now added it after the download link there. I thought I had some warnings in the editor that would pop-up when it ran out of memory and advise how to fix it, but I'll have to double-check that.
If you are using launcher.jar, then
. That should be giving it 999 MB of memory, and typically it uses about 256 MB with the map enabled.
That's about what I expected with the scrolling. That will take some investigation and playing around with to fix.
You're kind of right about the time scale, but especially when something turns up that isn't working, I like to try to figure out what's going on quickly.
Thanks for posting those logs; it's quite helpful and makes me glad I spent the time to add that logging functionality in the first place.
Never done this before so I may be quoting extraneous text. Quotes are CnP'd from the log.txt so there shouldn't be any typos.
Errors found in log.txt :
& other similar errors with Malucca Pirates / Mughals. TerrainBuildings.pcx exists in the relevant folder, standard size & properly indexed.
Here's a full run from the TAM Fertile Crescent biq with the only error I see bolded.
The "GraphicsImport - Out of memory" error also occurred with an unposted biq I'm working on. That biq has no custom terrain or rules as of yet. I had tried to open it prior to understanding not to open more than one biq during a session. So I'm not sure that case is relevant - probably just user error.
Let me know if I can run things in a specific way to generate a log for you. Or do anything else to ggive more info for debugging.
The GraphicsImport indicates that something in the graphics file is tripping up the editor, and it appears to be something in the width. It's strange that it would work for me in that case however, especially when you also have a properly-sized PCX file. I'll take a look at my PCX for that scenario, and see if I see anything that looks non-standard.
The out of memory one is more familiar. Are you starting the editor with the Conquests Editor.jar program, or the launcher.jar program? When using the map, it's highly advisable to use launcher.jar, as otherwise the program might not have enough memory. This is because, by default, Java programs get 128 MB of memory, and while that's plenty for most functionality, it often isn't enough with all the graphics for the map.
I see I hadn't noted this in the first post, so I've now added it after the download link there. I thought I had some warnings in the editor that would pop-up when it ran out of memory and advise how to fix it, but I'll have to double-check that.
If you are using launcher.jar, then
. That should be giving it 999 MB of memory, and typically it uses about 256 MB with the map enabled.That's about what I expected with the scrolling. That will take some investigation and playing around with to fix.
You're kind of right about the time scale, but especially when something turns up that isn't working, I like to try to figure out what's going on quickly.
Thanks for posting those logs; it's quite helpful and makes me glad I spent the time to add that logging functionality in the first place.
Blue Monkey
Archon Without Portfolio
The editor does have a pop up warning to restart via the loader. All my recent tests & the posted logs were opened via the loader jar. I've set that as the icon in my dock, so it's consistent.
Doesn't explain the difference between the TAM & the imported map biqs' behavior. They reference the same TAM art files.
It's getting too late to concentrate. Next session I'll swap out the Mughal terrain buildings file & see what happens. If nothing else it will be something to add to the list of files that need to be standard. Wonder why Firaxis' editor didn't reject it?
Opened file again & compared to pristine pcx on C3C install DVD. Original file is 512x256. File in Mughals is 384x256. Looks like the fourth column was trimmed off - otherwise the content is identical. Sorry I didn't catch that. Have to try swapping files out & see what happens.
Doesn't explain the difference between the TAM & the imported map biqs' behavior. They reference the same TAM art files.
It's getting too late to concentrate. Next session I'll swap out the Mughal terrain buildings file & see what happens. If nothing else it will be something to add to the list of files that need to be standard. Wonder why Firaxis' editor didn't reject it?
Bizarre: I can't d/l the new version from the Google page -- the IE tab it's on freezes (repeatedly.) Any ideas?
Thanks,
Oz
Thanks,
Oz
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