BornInCantaloup
Agent of Chaos
1010 A.D.
@ Mylene :
Spoiler :
@ Mylene :
Spoiler :
Deity please!
- Thread starter GKey
- Start date
It's almost a bit bizarre, the next big city in the north fell, Rifles are not that scary for pinch Cavs when the city isn't on a hill. Specially when she keeps moving some out to kill decoy birds.
My workers are roaming almost freely to scout ahead for her army, but she just took a second Monty city so it's obvious where it is
My main force is gathering in Bibracte right now to take the Holy Hindu City Vienne, i will most likely use the GG for a super medic to speed up the process to get everyone up and ready again. No chariots left, oh well a proper Cav General will have to do.
It was a sneaky thing to do, but i don't feel guilty with the Deity AI bonuses
@BiC Yip the big food capitol combined with marble and production for a super GP farm was the key here. I also didn't shy back from trading a lot with Surey after i got him to friendly to get Economics first, and i traded a bit with Boudi here and there.
My workers are roaming almost freely to scout ahead for her army, but she just took a second Monty city so it's obvious where it is
My main force is gathering in Bibracte right now to take the Holy Hindu City Vienne, i will most likely use the GG for a super medic to speed up the process to get everyone up and ready again. No chariots left, oh well a proper Cav General will have to do.
It was a sneaky thing to do, but i don't feel guilty with the Deity AI bonuses
@BiC Yip the big food capitol combined with marble and production for a super GP farm was the key here. I also didn't shy back from trading a lot with Surey after i got him to friendly to get Economics first, and i traded a bit with Boudi here and there.
shyuhe
Deity
Tough map because of the two superpowers Monte and Boudica. Leave them alone and they become monsters, take one of them out and the other will become a super-monster. Maybe if Hyuana didn't fold so easily this game
Am I the only one who didn't have a HC who folded early? Monty declared on Boudi in the mid BC's in my game and after that it was smooth sailing on the diplo front. HC did vassal in and out with Monty but Monty never grew beyond 14 cities and he was waaaaay backwards from staying in perma-war with me for the entire game. And I kept Boudi busy in war for pretty much the entire game as well, which kept her in check (she was the best techer on the map by far).
I played my game out to a diplomatic victory (of me vs. Monty with Boudi voting for me) but I didn't take many screenshots. I'll post what I have later anyways.
In my game Monty eliminated HC at about 750BC.
@AbsoluteZero
I wonder why would you give supermedic to War Elephant? Isn't it best to make supermedic from weakest mobile unit (War Chariot in our case)?
I've replayed my game and got same result: Boudica - vassal, but Monty - super monster.
Interestingly despite all my efforts and Mids I can't attack Celts earlier then in 300 BC, when Boudica is few turns from Feudalism/Machinery/Engineering.
I think I will roll another start, and if it will be interesting one, I will start a new thread for it.
@AbsoluteZero
I wonder why would you give supermedic to War Elephant? Isn't it best to make supermedic from weakest mobile unit (War Chariot in our case)?
I've replayed my game and got same result: Boudica - vassal, but Monty - super monster.
Interestingly despite all my efforts and Mids I can't attack Celts earlier then in 300 BC, when Boudica is few turns from Feudalism/Machinery/Engineering.
I think I will roll another start, and if it will be interesting one, I will start a new thread for it.
BornInCantaloup
Agent of Chaos
Same for me.
They had a very brief war, but then it was mainly Monty vs Boudi. Which is very comfortable since it keeps the western front safe.
Huayna capitulated shortly after 1000 A.D.
Regarding my game, 1250 AD :
Spoiler :
AbsoluteZero
Deity
You're probably right, actually a melee unit would be better because you can get woodsman 3 eventually.
In my game HC got bashed on both fronts, first by Boudica, then by Monte and he pretty much folded after that.
BornInCantaloup
Agent of Chaos
Ok. Maybe I haven't blown my game away yet, but maybe I have. I don't want to know and I won't try to slug through the end game 
(Because it would be sluggish, if successful.)
Short story :
East vs West. Rifles vs Rifles. Monty and I both have 2 vassals. No fun. Now Monty's 100's of Cavalries can roam free. And I don't have a proper stack of Rifles, yet... mostly Grenadiers.
That happened shortly after I DoWed Boudica... I guess it was to be expected. 1600's are closing in. Only good thing is we have a tech lead so we would be first to the next military techs.
Still, the game was (quite) fun and educative.
First time I ran a Deity save from 4000 B.C. further than... say 1000 B.C.
I'll try the next installment you provide, GKey. Hopefully I'll survive the barbarians again.
Thanks for sharing the game
(Because it would be sluggish, if successful.)Short story :
East vs West. Rifles vs Rifles. Monty and I both have 2 vassals. No fun. Now Monty's 100's of Cavalries can roam free. And I don't have a proper stack of Rifles, yet... mostly Grenadiers.
That happened shortly after I DoWed Boudica... I guess it was to be expected. 1600's are closing in. Only good thing is we have a tech lead so we would be first to the next military techs.
Spoiler :
Still, the game was (quite) fun and educative.
First time I ran a Deity save from 4000 B.C. further than... say 1000 B.C.
I'll try the next installment you provide, GKey. Hopefully I'll survive the barbarians again.
Thanks for sharing the game
Hiya, in case someone is still interested
I took all of Boudi's motherland cities except a small one with low culture.
The statistic is 17 Cavs lost, 24 Rifles killed - gives an idea about how spread out her defense was.
She is back to pleased right after we made peace
Monty and Sury like me too.
So i called this save The End, i rarely finish my games if they are (almost) won and approach modern times
I took all of Boudi's motherland cities except a small one with low culture.
The statistic is 17 Cavs lost, 24 Rifles killed - gives an idea about how spread out her defense was.
She is back to pleased right after we made peace
Monty and Sury like me too.
So i called this save The End, i rarely finish my games if they are (almost) won and approach modern times
BornInCantaloup
Agent of Chaos
It looks good indeed
Congrats !
Congrats !
ty
Great game of yours too, i was thinking you have a very good shot.
But i 100% agree that it isn't much fun to fight Deity AIs in the late game, in the end the human will always be smarter if he puts enough effort into it. It is just hard to get the motivation to do it, i always found that Civ doesn't have an interesting enough endgame while the start and middle age is very interesting
Great game of yours too, i was thinking you have a very good shot.
But i 100% agree that it isn't much fun to fight Deity AIs in the late game, in the end the human will always be smarter if he puts enough effort into it. It is just hard to get the motivation to do it, i always found that Civ doesn't have an interesting enough endgame while the start and middle age is very interesting
Seeing a lack of commerce, I moved north and east to get 5 good riverside tiles.
After exploring the map for 15 turns, I had my first important decision to make. Steal or no steal?
Stealing a worker on Deity is almost always a bad idea. Once a war begins, the only two ways of ending it are taking an enemy city or giving up a city/tech. In addition to the longer term doom, the scout archer they send out has a chance of visiting your capitol, who has roughly even odds with a lone warrior defending.
On the other hand, I don't see Sitting Bull's archer. Maybe it moved north, or maybe it went east. Barbarians should not be too bad either. I have the sea to the south and civs on my eastern+western front. They can only bother me from the north. I have a sweet ancient unit in the war chariot, and horses where I can put a 2nd city. No one likes Sitting Bull as far as I know on the diplo front. And to top it all off, war chariots eat dog soldiers for breakfast. I figure the steal is a coin flip on losing the game, but might give me a big enough boost to win a dom victory, which is what I want.
OF COURSE I STOLE IT
The results: 2280BC
I am in serious trouble! If he sends the two chariots out ahead, I lose the city. If he marches the entire stack straight to me, I'll probly lose the city. If he re-inforces his new city then sends the diminished stack at me ...
Hehe, stupid AI. The first chariot withdrew from my war chariot. His 2nd chariot beat my warrior and took some damage. His archer lost to my warrior. The two injured chariots were mowed down by my war chariots.
Now for the good parts.
The war chariot has a str 5 and is immune to first stikes. In the field, Sitting Bull can't stop them until he gets spears or swords. I went in force after Bull's first city, but judged that 6 chariots could not take it. So I picked off any unit that went outside the city and massed 9 chariots. He had two archers defending that would kill 1 war chariot each, two chariots that would die in the first attack, and two dog soldiers that were annihilated easily. It took 8 war chariots to win in the first strike, with the 9th to mop up any lucky chariots that won a battle. On deity, NEVER give the computer a chance to reinforce his city cause you left one archer at 0.3 hp.
I pushed on leaving the captured city lightly defended, hoping to get a look at the capitol and lure out some units to kill. Jackpot!
Sitting Bull sent two chariots and an archer from his capitol, and two dog soldiers from the north to take back his city. Now I had a very interesting choice with 8 full hp war chariots in the middle of his lands.
Cahokia: Archer, Chariot, Dog Soldier
Poverty Point: Archer, Chariot, Chariot
Mound City: Chariot, Chariot (half hp)
Field Troops: Archer, Dog Soldier, Dog Soldier
I figured my reinforcements could easily take back Mound City as chariots don't get defense bonuses, so I ignored it. The archer had to die before it got to a city, so I ticked off 1 war chariot to eventually kill it. That left 7 war chariots to go for the capitol next turn or Poverty Point on this turn.
I chose to take Poverty Point with 5 war chariots and kill every one of his field troops with the other three. He didn't have bronze is his capitol, so I figured I would choke him as much as possible while building up enough force to take his cap for sure later before he discovered Iron working.
The war ended with 6 war chariots, 4 heavily injured, and no fresh replacements coming. Bull was down to just his capitol though, so it was a good war.
Coming next, the end of Sitting Bull hopefully, and trying to join the tech race without being left behind!
After exploring the map for 15 turns, I had my first important decision to make. Steal or no steal?
Spoiler :
Stealing a worker on Deity is almost always a bad idea. Once a war begins, the only two ways of ending it are taking an enemy city or giving up a city/tech. In addition to the longer term doom, the scout archer they send out has a chance of visiting your capitol, who has roughly even odds with a lone warrior defending.
On the other hand, I don't see Sitting Bull's archer. Maybe it moved north, or maybe it went east. Barbarians should not be too bad either. I have the sea to the south and civs on my eastern+western front. They can only bother me from the north. I have a sweet ancient unit in the war chariot, and horses where I can put a 2nd city. No one likes Sitting Bull as far as I know on the diplo front. And to top it all off, war chariots eat dog soldiers for breakfast. I figure the steal is a coin flip on losing the game, but might give me a big enough boost to win a dom victory, which is what I want.
OF COURSE I STOLE IT
The results: 2280BC
Spoiler :
I am in serious trouble! If he sends the two chariots out ahead, I lose the city. If he marches the entire stack straight to me, I'll probly lose the city. If he re-inforces his new city then sends the diminished stack at me ...
Spoiler :
Hehe, stupid AI. The first chariot withdrew from my war chariot. His 2nd chariot beat my warrior and took some damage. His archer lost to my warrior. The two injured chariots were mowed down by my war chariots.
Now for the good parts.
The war chariot has a str 5 and is immune to first stikes. In the field, Sitting Bull can't stop them until he gets spears or swords. I went in force after Bull's first city, but judged that 6 chariots could not take it. So I picked off any unit that went outside the city and massed 9 chariots. He had two archers defending that would kill 1 war chariot each, two chariots that would die in the first attack, and two dog soldiers that were annihilated easily. It took 8 war chariots to win in the first strike, with the 9th to mop up any lucky chariots that won a battle. On deity, NEVER give the computer a chance to reinforce his city cause you left one archer at 0.3 hp.
I pushed on leaving the captured city lightly defended, hoping to get a look at the capitol and lure out some units to kill. Jackpot!
Spoiler :
Sitting Bull sent two chariots and an archer from his capitol, and two dog soldiers from the north to take back his city. Now I had a very interesting choice with 8 full hp war chariots in the middle of his lands.
Cahokia: Archer, Chariot, Dog Soldier
Poverty Point: Archer, Chariot, Chariot
Mound City: Chariot, Chariot (half hp)
Field Troops: Archer, Dog Soldier, Dog Soldier
I figured my reinforcements could easily take back Mound City as chariots don't get defense bonuses, so I ignored it. The archer had to die before it got to a city, so I ticked off 1 war chariot to eventually kill it. That left 7 war chariots to go for the capitol next turn or Poverty Point on this turn.
I chose to take Poverty Point with 5 war chariots and kill every one of his field troops with the other three. He didn't have bronze is his capitol, so I figured I would choke him as much as possible while building up enough force to take his cap for sure later before he discovered Iron working.
The war ended with 6 war chariots, 4 heavily injured, and no fresh replacements coming. Bull was down to just his capitol though, so it was a good war.
Spoiler :
Coming next, the end of Sitting Bull hopefully, and trying to join the tech race without being left behind!
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ummm...what exactly are your plans with Mound City? And poverty Point at the other end of the map (okok not that far but the name really fits lol).
You should have burned this waste of space to the ground, these locations are totally unacceptable in my book.
but the name really fits lol).You should have burned this waste of space to the ground, these locations are totally unacceptable in my book.
Haha, no one likes those two cities but me I guess. Here is what happened next.
Sitting Bull saw a gap between my two newest cities and sent a settling party through to make his 2nd city again. I added 8 war chariots to the 6 that were already there and raced to his capitol.
Mmm, a 2nd awesome city. The great general got settled in my troop building city. I used the gold I received from capturing Cahokia to tech a bunch of alphabet. Then I traded Aesthetics for alphabet and iron working. A few turns later, Sitting Bull agreed to end the 2nd war for a bunch of his techs.
I finished off his last city 10 turns later (and received a 10xp war chariot woot!), but for centuries my economy flatlined. How bad did it get? It got so bad I was disbanding warriors and putting veteran war chariots on my cities for happiness. Here's my future great person farm in 625BC.
LOL, that is pretty bad, but war chariots need gold to keep up! The gems from my northernmost city allowed me to come back a little, working iron tiles and such, but for literature and later code of laws, it was 2 scientists in every city with a few cities building research that got me there.
My ace in the hole was the Great Scientist I had stored away, ready to bulb philosophy as soon as I was able. I traded literature for some gold, teched code of laws, traded that for mathematics, bulbed philosophy, and then traded that for currency
With currency and some whipped courthouses I was back in the game! Now who should I attack next
1AD
Sitting Bull saw a gap between my two newest cities and sent a settling party through to make his 2nd city again. I added 8 war chariots to the 6 that were already there and raced to his capitol.
Spoiler :
Mmm, a 2nd awesome city. The great general got settled in my troop building city. I used the gold I received from capturing Cahokia to tech a bunch of alphabet. Then I traded Aesthetics for alphabet and iron working. A few turns later, Sitting Bull agreed to end the 2nd war for a bunch of his techs.
Spoiler :
I finished off his last city 10 turns later (and received a 10xp war chariot woot!), but for centuries my economy flatlined. How bad did it get? It got so bad I was disbanding warriors and putting veteran war chariots on my cities for happiness. Here's my future great person farm in 625BC.
Spoiler :
LOL, that is pretty bad, but war chariots need gold to keep up! The gems from my northernmost city allowed me to come back a little, working iron tiles and such, but for literature and later code of laws, it was 2 scientists in every city with a few cities building research that got me there.
My ace in the hole was the Great Scientist I had stored away, ready to bulb philosophy as soon as I was able. I traded literature for some gold, teched code of laws, traded that for mathematics, bulbed philosophy, and then traded that for currency
With currency and some whipped courthouses I was back in the game! Now who should I attack next
1AD
Spoiler :
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@GKey - I am keeping Poverty Point. It makes war chariots every 3 turns and is not
a drag on my economy any more. Tokugawa in general is a bad trading partner, unless there are no other choices.
My uber hammer city can indeed build settlers in 4 turns, but I would never dream of building anything but military units in it. The 100% bonus from Heroic Epic is too amazing. I'd only stop doing that in some kind of odd emergency, or if I needed a key building built.
Funny that you mentioned Monty and HC. Monty declared on him at 1AD exactly.
I canceled all my current trades with Monty that I could, because I didn't want to take
any diplo hits from HC when he demanded I stop trading with him. I figured it
would be a stalemate, as HC had longbows and Monty didn't.
and now ... The war against TOKUGAWA BEGINS
100AD
Troops were marched on three of his southernmost cities. The first two fell easily, but the next would be defended by longbows, and would require heavy seige. The third army was pinned down in a forest by a marauding band of 8 Japanese troops. 2 Axe, 2 spearmen, 1 swordsman, and 3 catapults, a formidable roving band. Additional reinforcements arrived along with bits of the 1st and all of the 2nd armies. They were able to annihilate the roving band and march on the 3rd city.
City Raider swordsmen do just fine against damaged longbowmen on flat land
With Nara captured, catapult replacements were brought in, a war chariot went scouting (and died), and the freshly minted super-medic war chariot healed up the stack, as it took major damage.
Outside the war, Sury granted independence to a Colony named Byzantium in 375AD. This is good news for me, as the fresh colony has no memory of my earlier tech trades. I should be able to do quite a few trades with him before he thinks I am too advanced.
Eventually, the march north culminated in this pitched battle.
For the first time in the game, I felt intimidated. Most of my attack stack were swordsmen, most of his defenders were axe/sword. I had war chariots, he had 3 spears. I had catapults but he had promoted longbows. Who would win?!!!
The math is that I have 25 attackers once the 6 catapults die spreading collateral damage amongst his 18 defenders. At that point, I could lose 7 fights and still take his city, but 8 or more losses and the war would grind to a halt.
The Result:
Further Results:
With this victory under my belt, I am assured of a loyal vassal able to quickly discover techs for my benefit. To keep him I must have double his land, double his population, and protect him from losing half of his lands. The only bind this places on me is that I may no longer whip all my cities down to 2 pop for war.
I plan on collecting techs, whipping forges, and preparing for the next war, wherever that might be.
a drag on my economy any more. Tokugawa in general is a bad trading partner, unless there are no other choices.
My uber hammer city can indeed build settlers in 4 turns, but I would never dream of building anything but military units in it. The 100% bonus from Heroic Epic is too amazing. I'd only stop doing that in some kind of odd emergency, or if I needed a key building built.
Funny that you mentioned Monty and HC. Monty declared on him at 1AD exactly.
I canceled all my current trades with Monty that I could, because I didn't want to take
any diplo hits from HC when he demanded I stop trading with him. I figured it
would be a stalemate, as HC had longbows and Monty didn't.
and now ... The war against TOKUGAWA BEGINS
100AD
Troops were marched on three of his southernmost cities. The first two fell easily, but the next would be defended by longbows, and would require heavy seige. The third army was pinned down in a forest by a marauding band of 8 Japanese troops. 2 Axe, 2 spearmen, 1 swordsman, and 3 catapults, a formidable roving band. Additional reinforcements arrived along with bits of the 1st and all of the 2nd armies. They were able to annihilate the roving band and march on the 3rd city.
Spoiler :
City Raider swordsmen do just fine against damaged longbowmen on flat land
With Nara captured, catapult replacements were brought in, a war chariot went scouting (and died), and the freshly minted super-medic war chariot healed up the stack, as it took major damage.
Outside the war, Sury granted independence to a Colony named Byzantium in 375AD. This is good news for me, as the fresh colony has no memory of my earlier tech trades. I should be able to do quite a few trades with him before he thinks I am too advanced.
Eventually, the march north culminated in this pitched battle.
Spoiler :
For the first time in the game, I felt intimidated. Most of my attack stack were swordsmen, most of his defenders were axe/sword. I had war chariots, he had 3 spears. I had catapults but he had promoted longbows. Who would win?!!!
The math is that I have 25 attackers once the 6 catapults die spreading collateral damage amongst his 18 defenders. At that point, I could lose 7 fights and still take his city, but 8 or more losses and the war would grind to a halt.
The Result:
Spoiler :
Further Results:
Spoiler :
With this victory under my belt, I am assured of a loyal vassal able to quickly discover techs for my benefit. To keep him I must have double his land, double his population, and protect him from losing half of his lands. The only bind this places on me is that I may no longer whip all my cities down to 2 pop for war.
I plan on collecting techs, whipping forges, and preparing for the next war, wherever that might be.
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