Democrats hard at work blowing the 08 election Part II

[JollyRoger]

Actually, Bush should wait until the day before the first presidential debate before he does this.

That would turn the GOP candidate into an instant flip flopper.

 

[mrt144]

That would turn the GOP candidate into an instant flip flopper.

not if the republican candidate keeps mum about it and minimizes his opinion. "I trust in the president's decision on Iraq" leave it at that. President says that we are promoting the freedom of Iraqi's through advising and giving them real choices now, and the GOP mops up those voters who were debating the election on this issue.

 

[JollyRoger]

not if the republican candidate keeps mum about it and minimizes his opinion. "I trust in the president's decision on Iraq" leave it at that. President says that we are promoting the freedom of Iraqi's through advising and giving them real choices now, and the GOP mops up those voters who were debating the election on this issue.

McCain is on record of saying the President hasn't committed enough troops.

Giuliani is on record that withdrawing from Iraq would put us on defense instead of offense. They can remain silent, but that would be at the expense of not responding to the new attack ads featuring their quotes that would make them appear to be out of step.

 

[GenMarshall]

That would turn the GOP candidate into an instant flip flopper.

That is if Bush does this during the Republican Primaries.

 

[mrt144]

McCain is on record of saying the President hasn't committed enough troops.

Giuliani is on record that withdrawing from Iraq would put us on defense instead of offense. They can remain silent, but that would be at the expense of not responding to the new attack ads featuring their quotes that would make them appear to be out of step.

This is where counter attack ads using red herrings on iraq come into play. just paint democrats as unpatriotic, terrorist lovers that arent willing to fight for anything.

the fundamental problem with the GOP right now is that the president does whatever he wants, in spite of his party's future. he certainly wont listen to democrats, but in not building consensus with the future of the party, he's screwing them.

 

[GenMarshall]

This is where counter attack ads using red herrings on iraq come into play. just paint democrats as unpatriotic, terrorist lovers that arent willing to fight for anything.

As a Democrat, I'm sick of hearing these stupid generalizations from the Republican Party (And part of the reason why I hate them and have no desire to change parties). How would the Republicans like it if the Democratic party paints the Republicans as totalitarian and authoritarian people, world hater that aren't willing to listen to anyone but people who have the same or similar mindset as they do?

I mean I dont like the terrorists, but the way the Republicans spew their garbage makes me want to support the terrorists.

 

[nc-1701]

Errr. Wait a minute, but isnt 'winning it politically' exactly what the Dems are saying to do?

Huh?

Thats basically OBLs point exactly.

You never considerd that he might be right? OBL might be a terrorist, but he's still a very smart man.

You suffer from political myopia. Thats all good now....what do we do in the years from now when the insurgents still want a piece of us? Are you truly so naive that if we pull out of Iraq, the insurgents will say 'its all good' and just leave us alone after they have beaten us? Hardly.

By ignoring the obvious future problem all you do here is cut your nose off to spite your face. We WILL have to address this sooner or later. If we pull out of Iraq it just postpones the inevitable. Isnt it better to try and solve it here and now while it is before us instead of putting it off for a few years?

I'm not saying they will, but my guess is if we pull out cut them some slack and they come for us again. We will be able to fight it out on our own terms and win. Right now this is unwinnable, we have massive WW, and both (R), and (D) are unwilling to use the tactics necessary to beat an insurgency. After we get attacked again I imagine they could harden up, and get ready to fight it out in the necessary way, rather than letting the terrorists dictate the terms of the war as they are doing now.

The republicans have the will to win. The Dems dont. Just like the Phillipine war, we can win this, it just takes time, money and manpower because the insurgents cannot beat us militarily. The dems dont have the will to see it through.

The Republicans, are the worst they don't have the balls to win, or the balls to admit defeat. Winning this war would require tactics like those used by Russia in Chechnya, or a massive increase in our troop levels. The American public would never accept either possibility, face it we haven't been attacked by Iraqis... We already got our revenge for 9/11, the people aren't going to accept what's necessary to fight such a broad, and devastating war. In order to win something like this we would have to have a public that is so pissed off that genociding enemy civilians would be considerd acceptable. Let's face it, the American public is to sqeamish for that right now.

We can't win it now, but if the terrorists are dumb enough to come after us after we give them what they supposedly want. Then we can rain down hell upon trhem from our bombers.


It's the only solution that works.

 

[Mark1031]

The Repubs are in a tight spot. While the right thing to do is to declare victory, pull out and offer tactical and air support to the government against external threats. The problem is that the mess will be pretty bad when they do pull out. Not as bad as many think but not what we hoped to achieve (ie. a loss). Also, once the troops are out the recriminations will start comming more hot and heavy. The only thing going for this strategy is that the alternative is worse politically and the press and the American people have very short memories. Once troops are not dying we will move on to other things eg. man dog marriage

 

[mrt144]

attack ads arent meant to win over people from the other side, they are meant to win over those who havent decided.

and essentialy the bet im making is there are more votes to be gained in leaving iraq and mooting the only issue they lose more support on with time. i am also betting that most people who support the war do so solely based on the parties support and the majority of war supporters would not raise hell because the party decided to leave iraq.

 

[MobBoss]

Sorry, but I will as for proofs to things I find suspicious.

Do you normally find everything outside of your knowledge base suspecious?

I'm sorry but I don't have my head stuck in the sand.

We will just have to disagree on this one. But I am hardly the only person who has ever told you this, eventually weight of opinion, might convince you, or not.

Sorry, not wrong as usual. The only wars with insurgents that we have one are the ones we backed!

I just gave you historical and factual proof that your statement is completely wrong. What do you call someone who denies fact?

BTW, you should really do something about your capslock key.

You should really do something about asking for proof, getting it and then failing to understand what it means.

No I shoulnt. I dont care what thoes radical muslims have to say to the US. Plus, I do not consider myself an American.

You dont consider yourself an american? What are you then?

BS, The lives lost in the Unjustified Meat grinder called Iraq is significant.

Ok, CG...here it is.....slowly. If you consider the Philipine war in which well over four thousand americans lost their lives insignificant, then how on earth can you label the Iraq war as significant when our losses there have been lower? Add in the fact that we were involved in the Philipine war for far, far longer then what is your reasoning behind such a claim?

You only look at the US troops where I look at both the Military & Civilian casualties.

Incorrect. Btw, didnt you just state earlier that you dont care about the Iraqi civilians? Why yes you did. So, if you dont care...why are you considering civilian casualties? Which is it?

You are flipflopping worse than John Kerry at this point.

The only impact the Iraq War has is causing us to be hated by most of the world and a Second Vietnam in the Middle East.

You earlier said you didnt care about Vietnam or the people that died in it. So why are you referring to it again?

How hypocritical of you. Telling me not to Judge when you yourself are the one judging.

What I did was not judging, but giving a brother christian a gentle rebuke. Its up to you whether you are wise in regards to it, or foolish. But know that what I told you true, not false.

I'm sorry but it does work like that.

Yes, it works precisely like that.

You assume that all Christians should have the exact mindset that you do.

No, I assume that all christians should have a mindset like Jesus Christ has. Not caring about the victims of genocide wouldnt be part of that mindset.

Well here is the real truth. Not every Christian agrees with your world. No Orthodox Christian, No Catholic Christian, Heck Not even every Protestant (including Anglicanism) Christian agrees with you.

/shrug. Not ever christian values their faith in Jesus like I do. /shrug.

 

[MobBoss]

We are only one signature away from being able to declare victory in Iraq. Why does the President want to push back the date of victory?

How can you declare "we have lost" like Harry R. has and then in the next breath claim victory?

I swear life in the democrat party world becomes more like Supermans Bizarro world every day. White means black. Up meand down. In means out. Etc.

 

[JollyRoger]

How can you declare "we have lost" like Harry R. has and then in the next breath claim victory?

How can you say Harry Reid is wrong and then talk about surrender instead of victory? We are one Presidential signature away from declaring victory - unless Bush thinks that our military hasn't won.

White means black. Up means down. In means out. Etc.

 

[mrt144]

/shrug. Not ever christian values their faith in Jesus like I do. /shrug.

come now, thats prideful.

 

[MobBoss]

come now, thats prideful.

Is it? Or is it a simple matter of fact? You tell me, is not caring about people facing genocide a christian value? Or is human life most certainly something Jesus would value.

I have said it before, and I will say it again. There is far, far more to actually being a christian than merely stating you are one.

 

[mrt144]

Is it? Or is it a simple matter of fact? You tell me, is not caring about people facing genocide a christian value? Or is human life most certainly something Jesus would value.

I have said it before, and I will say it again. There is far, far more to actually being a christian than merely stating you are one.

and there is more to being christian than be pious.

 

[mrt144]

furthermore are you pro are anti death penalty? are you pacifist? do you uniformly support life or just when it suits you? can you claim to be a christian and then only selectively value life based on political outlook?

 

[MobBoss]

furthermore are you pro are anti death penalty? are you pacifist? do you uniformly support life or just when it suits you? can you claim to be a christian and then only selectively value life based on political outlook?

Why should I answer your questions when you didnt answer mine? But in order to not continue off OT, let me just say there isnt a simple answer to your question. I do value all life, but I also think their are ramifications to what you do with that life.

 

[sonorakitch]

We are only one signature away from being able to declare victory in Iraq. Why does the President want to push back the date of victory?

So you are on the record now of stating a victory in Iraq (ie. "Mission Accomplished")?

Truly, if this one signature would do what you say I would be all for it. But it is hard to declare victory with Iraq in utter shambles. The question is, are we delaying the inevitable?

~Chris

 

[Hygro]

The republicans have the will to win. The Dems dont. Just like the Phillipine war, we can win this, it just takes time, money and manpower because the insurgents cannot beat us militarily. The dems dont have the will to see it through.

Burn down towns, draft an infantry force to flood Iraq with Troops, bomb the capitols of any foreign government supporting the insurgents, and not worrying about casualty rates on either side, allowing for upward millions (at least a few hundred thousand) Iraqi deaths and many many more thousands of American deaths. No, the republicans don't have the will to really win, and neither do the democrats or American people. At least the democrats are not trying to have their cake and eat it too, anymore.

 

[FriendlyFire]

Incorrect. Btw, didnt you just state earlier that you dont care about the Iraqi civilians? Why yes you did. So, if you dont care...why are you considering civilian casualties? Which is it?

You are flipflopping worse than John Kerry at this point.

ZING !

"We're never been stay the course, George." --George W. Bush, attempting to distance himself from what has been his core strategy in Iraq for the last three years, interview with ABC's George Stephanopoulos, Oct. 22, 2006

"I'm the decider, and I decide what is best. And what's best is for Don Rumsfeld to remain as the Secretary of Defense." --Washington, D.C. April 18, 2006 <----- This one takes the cake

&#8220;If our commanders on the ground say we need more troops, I will send them. But our commanders tell me they have the number of troops they need to do their job. Sending more Americans would undermine our strategy of encouraging Iraqis to take the lead in this fight. And sending more Americans would suggest that we intend to stay forever.&#8221; June 28, 2005

This notion that the United States is getting ready to attack Iran is simply ridiculous. And having said that, all options are on the table." --Brussels, Belgium, Feb. 22, 2005

"Brownie, you're doing a heck of a job." --to FEMA director Michael Brown, who resigned 10 days later amid criticism over his handling of the Hurricane Katrina debacle, Mobile, Ala., Sept. 2, 2005

no one suffers more than their President and I do." - 4/25/2007 Laura Bush