Discussion in 'Fall from Heaven Lore' started by Kael, Feb 15, 2006.
Oh, forgot to mention that the Dark Eye would be revealed by the AV unique tech.
This month I've played several good vs. evil games. There was more indifference than hatred between good and evil civs. Half of them became neutral because of religion. Infernals even signed a defensive pact with basium once because they were both Runes.
Moreover, beelining for Order and Veil cripples economy and their unique techs are very expensive.
I have a few suggestions:
Let Order be founded if a good civ destroys evil civ and vice versa for Veil.
Order and Veil should have two unique techs - one cheap and one expensive.
Final Conflict ritual – good civs form a PA, evil civs form the other one
- these PAs are locked in permanent war
- its builder can only win by conquest
- war weariness is inverted (1 unhappy for 5 turns without battle / 1 unhappy for 15 turns without city conquest)
- neutrals can either choose an alliance or try to pursuit their own victory condition being at war with both PAs (being considered "infidels")
An interesting mechanism! The problem that may arise is if you aren't going for a warlike victory. E.g. If you are going for Tower victory then you might be peaceful and want to found the Order or Veil to get the manas. Or perhaps you are going for a one city victory? Or perhaps you are using culture to attack your enemies.
Still an interesting mechanism (but would need to give more bonuses due to increased difficulty of getting it).
Actually, the problem would be that evil and neutral civs wouldn't be in control of when they could found the Order and good and neutral civs wouldn't be in control of founding Ashen Veil. Also, not all games include both evil and good civilizations.
perhaps runes should be made neutral and leaves should be made neutral-good?
you can go about making money in good and bad ways, while leaves always seems to be living in harmony with nature...
evil treehuggers does not seem appropriate for a dark fantasy mod...
same post twice! if i go around killing anyone who enters the lands i consider sacred woods im not exactly being friendly or good.
My opinion continues to firm up around the notion that religions and the tech tree need some serious brainstorming. In short, success depends overly much on founding one of the early three religions. Those civs that fail to do so get stuck behind. So a game of 8 civs gets whittled down to 3 competitors and 5 weak sisters almost right out of the gate.
That's the short version. Just throwin' the idea out there.
It seems wholey appropriate to me.
Did you have a chance to read that story on this forum about the Calabim and Fellowship? That's a great explanation of how the religion can be used in an evil way. Survival of the fittest, baby!
Is octopus overlords ever getting a new name? I mean, octopus overlords? How about Rey'leh or Ctuh'luhu or something? Octopus overlords sounds like a band name.
Hey, I think Octopus Overlords sounds fine. Plus, it has "inside-joke" value, can't beat that.
No. Why ? Its the name of a site Kael likes (dont know for sure what is his involvement with the site) and plus, he likes the name.
EDIT: Chand ya fasty bas....
How about Overlords of the Abyss?
Or Abscess of the Overlords.
Abcess as in Absess? Cause that's just wrong
No I meant abscess as in abscess.
Oh yeah, must've been a typo... it's still just wrong
Is there any chance of a seventh (sixth, if you don't count the Cult) religion being introduced in Fire?
IIRC, Kael once said something about a religion worshipping Lugus, the sun god, or something like that...
Yeah, Mr. Malakim is sorta into the Sun god. (just a tad)
Wouldn't it upset the balance if there was an extra good religion, but no evil? Besides, you could have a religion for each god, and Kael said that in his D&D campaign there were even religions for supposed gods that don't actually exist. Sure, you could include them all. But even now not at all five major religions get a decent following in the game. Besides, the more religions would be added, the more civ-specific they would become. So why not just give a civ some special benefit to represent that religion, eg orcs and Bhall? What's the added value of adding more religions? More is less in this regard IMO.
Separate names with a comma.