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DMOC's DEITY Game #4 - Suryavarman II

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Strategy & Tips' started by DMOC, Jan 27, 2011.

  1. DMOC

    DMOC Mathematician

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    I have updated the second of three parts for this round. Even though Ragnar and Mehmed were of different religions, I am sure they were still friendly.

    Your questions have been answered.
     
  2. ABigCivFan

    ABigCivFan Emperor

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    Whip walls and castles and Longbows in the Eastern city. Meh only has Cats, he prob will waste some turns to bomb down the cultural defense if you have some decent defenders in the city. Also try send some workers and weak military units to bait his SOD.

    Buy as much time as possible. Even you lose the Eastern city, your Curis should be able to kill his army by the time he reaches your capital, then it is payback time. But make peace with him ASAP and focus on your main attack plan on Hanni.
     
  3. Kid R

    Kid R Emperor

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    Awesome foresight not settling a more eastern city earlier on :lol:

    There may even be a lesson in there somewhere. Choke points are good if they make it possible to block off land but otherwise owning one is likely to mean trouble (like it was for Rags here).
     
  4. iggymnrr

    iggymnrr Deity

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    How did Moa's stack get to where it is? It is in a wierd spot.
     
  5. DMOC

    DMOC Mathematician

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    I have updated part 3 of Round 7.

    Mao's stack was in my territory.
     
  6. Kikka

    Kikka Chieftain

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    I will suggest you save an engineer and or merchant for corporations. You have a lot of seafood for sids sushi and a barb island it seems to the west with even more seafood.
    Could give you a super wall street city with a shrine perhaps. :king:
     
  7. Kid R

    Kid R Emperor

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    Bravo for a very slick conquest of Hannibal. Another excellent demonstration of raising a huge force of cuirassiers quickly (much like the Willem game!)

    Looks like you might be able to get rifling quite soon with steel to trade. Perhaps just keep the army rolling and take Mehmet down with cavalry? (Possible GM = trade mission upgrade cash?)
     
  8. DMOC

    DMOC Mathematician

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    Great Merchant - Sushi?
    Great Engineer - Mining Inc?
    Great Scientist - Save for golden age?
    Great Artist - Save for golden age?

    I won't be able to get Steel anytime soon, because I first need the gold to fund the research. It looks like I'll be whipping some courthouses and working wealth in certain cities.

    Also, I plan to change civics this turn (1200 AD) so I'll have to go through about 2 turns of anarchy.
     
  9. Kid R

    Kid R Emperor

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    Well it depends what's the long term plan? If it was me with Mao out of the way I'd be looking at that map and thinking it's probably enough for space, and is a virtually unattackable area of territory as it stands. I know that's not deity thinking though, or at least not Augustus Caesar deity thinking :rolleyes:
     
  10. DMOC

    DMOC Mathematician

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    I will probably have to beeline to the Internet for the Space Race, because much of my land and Mao's is not good for cottaging. Taking over China and racing to space is probably the safest route to victory, though.
     
  11. DMOC

    DMOC Mathematician

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    1200 AD Overview & Plans


    It's been a while, :)lol:) so I'm going to need to take some time to plan what I want to do for this game. I definitely want to complete this game, because I think it's one of the most challenging I've had, primarily due to the hostile civs around me. I think I'm in a fair/good position at the moment. I've got 22 cities, which is 9 more than the next civ, and I have the most land while also having decent population and soldier counts. I was hoping to attack Mao, but I'm not entirely sure that's a great idea.

    The problem is that if I reattack, it will likely have to be after I get Steel (which won't be for another 10+ turns), and at that time, Mao will have beefed up his army while other civs continue to run away. I still hope to attack Mao, but it may have to wait until Flight + Cavalry or Tanks.

    What I'm hoping to do is to get Steel ASAP and try and catch up via trade. My land isn't the greatest land for cottaging -- but then again, I have so many cities that haven't even reached half of their population ceiling ... so my aim from about 1200 AD to 1500 AD is to use my pure population power and GROW GROW GROW. Yasodharapura is a good start -- it's a size 17 city and it's the largest sized city in the world. :goodjob: There were also some minor changes I made to cities' resource allocations, so that they could get to their next population level sooner. For instance, with Zhou, I want to grow first and then work the cottages.




    At the moment, I have a worker bulldozing a riverside farm for a cottage, as planned. Even with the loss of that farm, the +7 net food per turn (and that could be +8 if I get a baray) ensures that the city can keep growing and still work the (1) horses, (2) plains hill mine and (3) grass hill mine and also have +3 surplus left over for those two forested plains above. I'm not sure what I'll do with those, but it's clear they are low priority tiles. I think Zhou has great research potential, and I'm hoping to maximize it.

    (As a side, I've got to get workers here ... the cottages should be on the river, not on the nonriverside tiles :crazyeye:. I will bulldoze two riverside farms and have those farms on where the 2 nonriverside tiles are.)

    Ah, here's Angkor Wat, a city playing a crucial production/cultural protection role for me. I'm going to grow this city and then work the mines. It needs a baray for the health, but after that it will work on a Jewish Synagogue for cultural reasons.




    Another Angkor city ... this time, it's one of my research powerhouses:




    I definitely need Oxford University there, and I certainly need to have more than 11 population. :crazyeye: The following turn, it should steal one of the farms from one of the cities to the south, since I'll have workers finishing up farms down there that the southern cities can switch onto.

    I'm not going to get into a detailed overview of all of my cities, but here's the general overview. My median population size is 8, and the mean population size is 7.95. I'm hoping to have both numbers be at least 10 within 20 turns. Notice the happiness surplus I've got?

    There's only two universities in construction, but Carthage will work on a university after it finishes its bank.




    :lol: 17 workers for 22 cities. I'm totally not following the 1.5 workers per city rule of thumb. In all seriousness, though, I'm going to concentrate these two workers in two primary areas. The first is with the former barb city of Minoan up north -- I'm trying to convert it into a full-fledged research center with cottages. And the second area is to the southwest portion of my empire, including areas like Zhou.




    And finally, civics. I'm planning to revolt to (1) Free Speech, (2) Free Market, and (3) Free Religion.

    • Keeping Hereditary rule is straightforward -- I'm getting bonus points from Ragnar, Catherine, and Gilgamesh.
    • Leaving Bureaucracy is fine because my capital isn't a cottage-filled area. It relies on high population and great people.
    • I also need extra culture to fight for land (hence, Free Speech)
    • Free Market is straightforward -- having +1 trade route in ALL of my 22 cities? YES please!
    • I don't need Theocracy, and Free Religion gives me more research bonuses. Furthermore, Ragnar should still be Friendly with me even after my change of religions.
    • Free Religion also has lower upkeep than Theocracy.

    It will take two turns, which is a pain, but I definitely think it's worth it. The only one of these three switches that I'm nervous about is the switch to Free Religion ... but I have +15 with Ragnar right now. I NEED to keep him Friendly ....




    Revised plan:

    1. Switch civics
    2. Grow!
    3. Fix the cottages around Minoan and Zhou
    4. Use Steel (or another tech) and trade to catch up

    Of course, I'll probably end up beelining to the Internet anyway ...

    EDIT: It looks like my screen resolution has changed, so I hope the text is still readable.
     
  12. bestbrian

    bestbrian Just this guy, ya know?

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    Welcome back! :goodjob:

    Now I've got something to follow while I'm laid up for the next couple of weeks. :)
     
  13. DMOC

    DMOC Mathematician

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    Nice to see you again, bestbrian.

    I was thinking of taking the day to program in more Java in preparation for my internship in a few weeks, but **** that. I want to play this round. :D In fact, why don't I start playing right now!
     
  14. bestbrian

    bestbrian Just this guy, ya know?

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    No time like the present. Hop to it, and good luck. :)
     
  15. DMOC

    DMOC Mathematician

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    Round 8: 1200 AD to 1470 AD [28 Turns] - After a Long Layoff...

    I decreased my resolution to make the screenshots easier to read. Let me know if the resolution makes the text too hard to read. As for the round, the goals for this one were to (1) stay peaceful, (2) grow the cities, (3) increase specialization of cities, (4) catch up technologically. Unfortunately, goal #4 didn't turn out as anticipated, since I was struck by WFYABTA penalties, and the civs that were friendly with me kept researching technologies before I could finish them!

    But anyway, I did start with the triple civic swap to Free Religion, Free Speech, and Free Market. That cost me two anarchy points, but I do think it was worth the swap. I was able to remain Friendly with Ragnar for the entire 28 turns of this round. Unfortunately, in order to make sure that I wouldn't get involved in another war, I had to do some judicious gifting of techs. This one below, for instance, gave me +4 with Mehmed II and immediately made him cautious. I was, therefore, no longer his worst enemy as I think he was annoyed with someone else. Before doing this, of course, I checked to make sure that Ragnar or Gilgamesh didn't have Mehmed II as their worst enemy, since I would have earned some demerits with those two.



    I did get a Great Merchant! :goodjob: I will save him for Sid's Sushi.



    I made a little diversion to capture a barbarian city, bringing my total city count to 23. It will never be a strong city, but it can benefit the empire from its trade route income. As a bonus, I'll be able to store a small force here and eventually attack Mao's city here while preserving my galleons elsewhere.



    Ragnar has vassalized Montezuma. Oh well ... time to set up another defensive pact!



    Time for the every 50-turn report. Given that there are vassals ahead of me at the moment, that doesn't bode very well. :lol:




    Anyway, the round proceeded. My tech path was, I believe, Steel, Corporation, Astronomy (incomplete), followed by Steam Power, and I believe I obtained Scientific Method, Replaceable Parts and Constitution via trades. As you will see, WFYABTA is really hindering my ability to catch up in trades.

    I decided to end the round after researching Steam Power, since I was feeling a little aimless and it's always good to take a step back. Here are my choices:




    1. Astronomy - A partially researched tech, but it will obsolete The Colossus, and I'm working a lot of water tiles.
    2. Railroad - Absolutely necessary ... but does it justify the delay in Democracy?
    3. Divine Right - Not necessary
    4. Assembly Line - I need this NOW but it's too expensive at the moment
    5. Democracy - The tech I'm probably going to research next, given that I have -4 happiness in every city from Emancipation.
    6. Communism - Not necessary
    7. Biology - A high priority, but given that I'm already suffering from intense unhappiness, this will need to wait until after Democracy.
    8. Military Science - Not necessary
    9. Rifling - Not necessary

    Techs, Top 5 cities, and Demographics.







    Now for the good news -- I did take advantage of all the food I have (I'm tops in crop yield) and I have a mean city size of 10.12 and a median city size of 12. Not bad, so at this point of the game, I want to make sure those citizens are working the best tiles possible. Notice that I'm still not building much military.



    A deeper look at 5 of my best cities.

    My capital, which will spit out a GP soon. It's also the planned Ironworks city, given that I really don't see a better option. (Honestly, I think this map script is good in the sense that there is less extremely bad land -- e.g. icy stuff -- but there's also less extremely good land.)



    My Oxford University city. After this, it goes right to a levee (unless it needs happiness ) and I'll transfer the farms from the south over to this city.




    Wow - Magyar turned out to be a great city, with the Moai statues and the Colossus wonder. This will be my naval station, and will produce the galleons and frigates necessary for Mao's island cities.




    Zhou - working 8 cottages at the moment. The lack of food hurts its ability to work more cottages, but if I can get Sid's Sushi, I'll be bulldozing those farms.




    Hannibal's former capital seemed like a good place to build the Forbidden Palace, and it has the production necessary to do so. I anticipate that this city will do a lot of heavy lifting in terms of military production. I may even put West Point here. (Another alternative is Magyar.)




    The map:



    I'm playing this "live," so this is as far as I've gotten. What's in store for the future? Well, I know I want to take all of Mao/Hannibal's land for myself, and given that they are the most backward in the game, that seems like a reasonable goal. I can't realistically go east and attack Ragnar. Mehmed is a possible target, but Ragnar will take over his land (Ragnar is planning to attack Mehmed now). But with what army should I attack? Mao will have riflemen and grenadiers defending by the time I'm ready to muster a strong enough force to beat him. I also can't use my forces now, because they are essential for Hereditary Rule happiness. So I'm actually thinking of waiting until tanks in order to attack Mao. That means by the time I can realistically wipe out China, the other civs will be building their space ships. So I'll see what happens at that point. :crazyeye:

    But first, I have to adopt Emancipation, since I'm getting hit by 4 unhappy citizens per city. I do have Steam Power, though, so the plan is this:

    Democracy -> Railroad -> Astronomy (finish up) -> Assembly Line -> Biology. After that, I think my path will depend mostly on what other civs research. I definitely need Rifling, Physics, and Electricity since Industrialism (for tanks) requires Electricity and Assembly Line. And I need Combustion somewhere along the line for oil. (I've got plenty, so no worries.)
     
  16. vranasm

    vranasm Deity

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    interesting game...

    the SS's are fine if you're using 1280 wide monitor and max firefox/ie/chrome/opera.

    I am not deity player, but have to say I have mix feelings about your plan for the future, but will better bring some :popcorn: and watch.
     
  17. Kid R

    Kid R Emperor

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    With all that land at the end would it be a possibility to go EP heavy and engage in a little production sabotage?

    Also maybe this game could be an illustration to the person who asked the other day about when to build the internet! Tanks do have their weaknesses but all the required techs are on the way to computers.

    Edit. PS great to see you back to finish this game! :goodjob:
     
  18. Killroyan

    Killroyan Deity

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    DMOC is back. Nice. Love the writeups. Since you are superfriendly with Ragnar, can't you beg astro? Get 1 turn in it, beg, go democracy? Or at least get some cash from him. He is loaded :p

    BTW what are you building? A heavy horseman? Can't fully read it. Is this a new unit in this script?
     
  19. DMOC

    DMOC Mathematician

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    I have mixed feelings as well. The main reason is that it's going to take me super-long to do this without trading.

    Yes, the Internet seems to be the reasonable option with Ragnar, Gilgamesh, Catherine, and Willem tearing it through the tech tree. If not, well, then I can use my tanks against them! What I lack in commerce tiles I'll be able to make up with better production.

    Espionage is going to be a little problematic ... because some leaders have put a huge amount of points on me since forever. The good news is that Mao keeps wasting his points on city poisoning, so I don't really need to put points on him. I have points on Ragnar, although perhaps I should put it on someone like Mehmed II.

    The problem is I tried to beg him halfway through this round. This was his response: :ar15:. Yes, I definitely need their cash ... the problem is I need to get the tech before the other civs can get them!

    The heavy horseman is the BAT mod replacement for the cuirassier. It's the same thing only they renamed the unit. I'm not sure why but it doesn't affect gameplay.
     
  20. DMOC

    DMOC Mathematician

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    Round 9 - 1470 AD to 1816 AD [72 Turns] - Two Civilizations Eliminated (Part I)

    I continued the process of growing my civilization and beelining to Industrialism for tanks. After that, my goal was to research Plastics and then Computers for the internet. Of course, I was a little behind in that regard, since in 1470, Catherine had Electricity and Assembly Line, Gilgamesh had Railroad and Assembly Line, and Willem had Assembly Line and Biology. :crazyeye: My biggest concern was always Ragnar, but Gilgamesh wasn't far behind.

    I finally finished up Forbidden Palace, and given that Democracy was due next turn, things were looking up economically. You can see how much unhappiness I'm suffering from.



    On the next turn, with Democracy in hand, I took advantage of some last opportunities to use the whip. Slavery is the best civic in the game, and I take advantage of it up to the turn before I switch to Democracy.






    My research focus was now on Assembly Line. I also switched to Universal Suffrage, since I no longer had pressing needs for Hereditary Rule happiness. In fact, the military units I stationed in cities were there because of the Emancipation unhappiness. My civics after this were Universal Suffrage, Free Speech, Emancipation, Free Market, and Free Religion.

    Unfortunately, that switch would make Ragnar pleased with me. He was annoyed towards several other leaders (and already at war with Mehmed II), and I only border him via one or two land tiles, so I'm hoping that he will look elsewhere for war targets. Since he was at the WFYABTA limit, I made this trade before switching civics:



    The war was not looking good ... for both Mehmed II and my situation. And on this same turn, Ragnar obtained Railroad, Gilgamesh got Artillery, and Catherine incorporated Creative Constructions. :crazyeye:




    But on 1540 AD, I received great news -- I got a Great Engineer! This means once I get Railroad, I can start up Mining Inc.! You can see that I'm building wealth in many cities. I'm at the point where cities don't have useful buildings left to build (e.g. customs houses, Jewish Synagogues, etc.) so I set many of them to produce wealth in order to get Assembly Line (and then Railroads) ASAP. Then I can start factory production!



    More bad news -- Ragnar completes Sid's Sushi, before I had a shot at it. :sad: And if that wasn't enough, Gilgamesh built the Pentagon last turn.



    On the following turn, I got Assembly Line and checked the technology situation:



    Yes! I can finally trade technologies! I hit up Catherine for a trade. This one made the most sense to maximize my gold amount and to clear up an important prerequisite for Electricity. I couldn't have gotten Railroad, anyway.



    But on the same turn, I also made a very important decision. It was a bit of a gamble, but if I hadn't done this, I think Ragnar would have had enough power to overwhelm every single computer-controlled player. The demographics told me that there was a leader with a terrifying amount of military power. I knew it was Ragnar by taking advantage of the odd tendency of the Catherine AI's ability to be bribed to war with someone who she's friendly with. I remember that I was friendly with Catherine at one point during this round, so when I looked at Catherine's availability to be bribed for war, Ragnar was the only "red" or unavailable name on the list (i.e. she was willing to be bribed to attack all other leaders), with the reasoning "We're afraid of their military might." Not good ....

    The gamble part is, of course, that I'm giving him factory production and that he's only pleased with me. :crazyeye: Notice, though, that Willem is also at war with Mehmed II. I'm hoping Willem vassalizes him so Ragnar targets Willem next.



    I obtained Railroad on 1570 AD (of course, Gilgamesh had already researched Rocketry several turns ago) and had a Great Engineer ready to set up Mining Inc. It was just in time, since Catherine got a Great Engineer this turn!





    To recap, my tech was Democracy -> Assembly Line -> Physics & Astronomy (Trades) -> Railroad. I now set up research for Biology.

    At this point, I built factories in all important cities to prepare them for tank production. I also finalized some National Wonders. The capital finished Ironworks and Carthage got West Point, which you can see being produced in the following screenshot. Notice that Catherine built the Apollo Program. :eek:



    After some amount of turns had passed, I finally had the chance to start Wall Street in Utica. I gave Utica the copper mine Carthage was working since it's a terrible production city.



    With a Great Engineer, and a Great Merchant (who failed to found Sid's Sushi), I now had the chance to start what may be my last Golden Age. I decided to wait until finishing Industrialism. Oh, don't worry about Ragnar being WHEOOHRN ... it's almost certainly Mehmed II. And if it's us ... well we're about to start producing an army!



    The tech situation upon Industrialism. Plastics was up next for me, for the possibility of getting the Three Gorges Dam. I was building so much wealth that I had positive gold income at 100% research. That wouldn't last, of course, since I now had better things to build.



    (The full tech path was To recap, my tech was Democracy -> Assembly Line -> Physics & Astronomy (Trades) -> Railroad -> Biology -> Combustion -> Electricity -> Rifling -> Industrialism -> Plastics.)

    After the Golden Age, I had stunning demographics.



    And Mao is going down ...



    [To be continued in next post.]
     

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