Do you predominately play with the 4UC modmod?

[Phosphoraptor]

I think integration will need to come with an overall increase in the cost of … everything. This is the biggest increase in civ power, tempo, yield inflation ever proposed and I would like to still play at the same pace as before.

 

[CppMaster]

I think integration will need to come with an overall increase in the cost of … everything. This is the biggest increase in civ power, tempo, yield inflation ever proposed and I would like to still play at the same pace as before.

Do you think Epic speed would solve it initially?

 

[Phosphoraptor]

Do you think Epic speed would solve it initially?

I have never played 4UC and the last time I read what it does was a few years ago. I cant answer because I dont know how much faster 4UC is

 

[pineappledan]

Need to dig up @L. Vern ‘s 4UC test games. I believe he published victory timings. How much faster 4UC makes the game is something that can be empirically tested.

 

[pineappledan]

Rather than rely on people to find this post and self-report, why not just look at download statistics?
the latest build of 4UC has been downloaded 862 times as of posting. How many times has the latest VP been downloaded? @Recursive do you have any way of tracking that?

 

[L. Vern]

Rather than rely on people to find this post and self-report, why not just look at download statistics?
the latest build of 4UC has been downloaded 862 times as of posting. How many times has the latest VP been downloaded? @Recursive do you have any way of tracking that?

github does keep track of the number of times assets associated with a repo are downloaded

 

[Phosphoraptor]

Need to dig up @L. Vern ‘s 4UC test games. I believe he published victory timings. How much faster 4UC makes the game is something that can be empirically tested.

Found it: 2.7 4UC, comparing with 3.2
Based on what I could eyeball from the graphs, research and victory times have marginal differences on average. This probably means that if I did a playtest on this versiom the pace should be similar.

The AI has improved its victory pursuit in 3.2 so that might confound my conclusion.

 

[pineappledan]

github does keep track of the number of times assets associated with a repo are downloaded

But that’s GitHub. The vast vast vast majority of players are downloading the .exe file shared in the version release threads. The only people who are downloading things from GitHub are devs.

The AI has improved its victory pursuit in 3.2 so that might confound my conclusion

I would guess that the AI actually trying to win games would make games faster than whatever yield inflation 4UC adds.

 

[L. Vern]

But that’s GitHub. The vast vast vast majority of players are downloading the .exe file shared in the version release threads. The only people who are downloading things from GitHub are devs.

I would guess that the AI actually trying to win games would make games faster than whatever yield inflation 4UC adds.

the exe file shared in the version release threads are downloads from github

 

[pineappledan]

the exe file shared in the version release threads are downloads from github

Cool.

… so how many downloads?

 

[Recursive]

Cool.

… so how many downloads?

As of making this post, the 4.6 release (which was released 5 days ago) has been downloaded 856 times.

The 4.5.1 release from the end of February has been downloaded 3937 times.

To check for yourself: https://api.github.com/repos/LoneGazebo/Community-Patch-DLL/releases

 

[pineappledan]

Okay, so 850/3900 = 22% of players also play with 4UC
And 69/105 = 66% of players who responded to this poll play with 4UC
Which means that active community members that answer polls are 3x as likely to use 4UC than non-interacting users

 

[usadefcon1]

Nah those numbers aren't accurate, I copy 4UC between my laptop and PC all the time but I always download VP to run the .exe and make sure the cache gets cleared.

I'm assuming I'm not the only one who does this.

 

[azum4roll]

And you don't keep the installer around?

 

[CppMaster]

Yeah, many of those who don't play with 4UC may not be aware of it or don't care. It doesn't mean that they would be against intergrating it.

How about doing it just like every proposal that would require supermajority vote, because of the scope? If magi want, it could just require 66% majority with minimum 20 votes or something.

 

[Zuizgond]

Integrating it means the additional two components can then be subject to balance pass in the VP congress. I'm all for it.

 

[Recursive]

If we were to integrate 3/4UC, reverting it would be quite difficult. We don't have the resources to maintain two different versions of the mod, one with 3/4UC and one without. That would be a nightmare for balancing discussions. If anyone wants it that way, they should vote against integration and have it remain a modmod.

I have reservations about a simple supermajority vote given the magnitude of the change on every civilization of the game. People who don't like it won't be able to disable it, and if they really don't like it we could potentially lose a substantial portion of the player base. How many players that would be is unknown, though.

I'm also concerned about additional memory consumption by the mod's art assets. Will it be compatible with the 43 civ version in the late game, or will it crash constantly?

 

[CppMaster]

I have reservations about a simple supermajority vote given the magnitude of the change on every civilization of the game.

Then how would you see it?

 

[looorg]

I'm not sure how this became about integrating 4UC into the core or not. I only saw it as a poll about if I played with it or without it. It was never about integration. I just never play with out so in that regard sure it might as well be part of the package but then it doesn't have to be. I can download it as soon as Pineapple Dan has updated it if and when it needs another update. But I don't require integration or possibly even want it to be.

 

[CppMaster]

I'm not sure how this became about integrating 4UC into the core or not. I only saw it as a poll about if I played with it or without it. It was never about integration. I just never play with out so in that regard sure it might as well be part of the package but then it doesn't have to be. I can download it as soon as Pineapple Dan has updated it if and when it needs another update. But I don't require integration or possibly even want it to be.

Once again... The point of the integration is maintanance and balancing as a whole through VP Congress. Can't really do that for a modmod.