Economy Mod

[Valkrionn]

Marble is giving the bonus only to the city that have it in its "BFC". Don't know what happens if multiple cities have access to a quarry, but it is definately not civwide.

If so, I'll leave it.

Yesterday I started a game with this mod, and I must say it's very good.
-The game pace is much more fun.
-The improved resources make them really nice to get, instead of just meh.
-The buildings too, make you want to build them, not like before.

Here are some observations:

- 20% faster units is far too OP for just unlocking honor. I would lower it to 10% or put it at the bottom of the tree.
- Between the better yields and the reduction in building maintentance, I'm swimming in gold. I would lower the income or increase the maintenance on some buildings. Or maybe of units.
- Teching seems still pretty fast in my game. Is it really increased by 50%? Doesn't look that much. Maybe the better yields makes it faster.
- In vanilla it was already too easy to do early warfare to win the game (easier than later). Now with the fast unit production, before and even more after unlocking honor, anhilating the AIs at early warfare is even easier. I can't tell you what, but it would be nice to compensate the cheaper units with something that helps defense. At least early game.


Thanks for your work, the game looks much more fun now.

Glad to see you're enjoying. Now for your points...

• Whut? You must be running another mod with this, as Honor does not increase build speed. AFAIK, no policy affects unit build speed directly.
• What better yields? The only thing I changed was bonus resource yields, by 2 at most. Also, what building maintenance reduction? Again, not something I did at all; Check what mods you have activated.
• It is increased by 50%, yes.
• Play with Afforess's ActiveCityDefense mod. He's made pretty much exactly the changes I would have.

The problem is, the AI should be changed too to know that units are much faster now and it has to build walls. It's always the issue with balance changes, the AI has to be changed to take advantage of the new stuff. But the AI is anyway horrible on vanilla, so it's not that big issue.

A question, when we get new versions of this mod, do we have to download a new mod or can it be patched?

btw I can't see the new luxury resource window.

It will likely be a new download, the way the modbrowser is set up.

New luxury resource window? If you mean the one in the infopane, that's in the unreleased version. Otherwise, it's a mouseover in the top bar, but that one will be gone in v2.

At what gamespeed is this mod supposed to be played? Cause i've started an epic game and now i just entered the medival age...at 200 BC

I actually play epic as well. I don't advance eras as fast as you did, though... Guessing you focused on one specific branch?

I played it at standard and techs still seemed too fast. Probably increasing their cost is countered by increasing resource yields

Not really. Science is purely from population. The only resource that would help is Wheat.

Tech is primarily population-related and this mod just doesn't increase your food input anywhere close to making up for th 50% higher cost in tech. It does increase how quickly you can build the science buildings of course, but until the medieval era, you have very little of those.

Exactly.

 

[Feyd Rautha]

Re: 200 BC Medieval

Dimes to dollars it was a great scientist. I know you aren't fond of altering their ability to get a free tech, Val, but it's far too strong. 50% of current tech is more than acceptable IMHO and nowhere near as overpowered. Same for research agreements.

As for population increases I think the maritime fix was needed.

 

[Beatrix202]

Re: 200 BC Medieval

Dimes to dollars it was a great scientist. I know you aren't fond of altering their ability to get a free tech, Val, but it's far too strong. 50% of current tech is more than acceptable IMHO and nowhere near as overpowered. Same for research agreements.

As for population increases I think the maritime fix was needed.

Agreed. My only Gripe with this mod is with the +50% tech cost the Great Scientist bulb value is through the roof. The only way I can see a Scientist used for anything else is Babylon rushing Writing and dropping an academy. I think GPP needs a overhaul in general but that's alot of work and things should be done 1 step at a time.

On a side note your mod is great. It brings more life to the game and really spices it up. I look forward to this mod update as much as a official patch

 

[ArgentumStudios]

Okay, going to go with option2.

Any opinion on the tech popup?

Also, I got fed up with trying to get the damn tabs to work last night, decided to go with an infopane, and then just as I settle down to actually code the thing, someone else released a working version. As I've modified the TopPanel.lua file, the two mods will not work together separately... But he's given general permission for people to merge it, so this will be the resource pane used. Saves me a lot of time, for sure.

Can check it out here: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?p=9709601#post9709601

I'm glad my little mod suits your needs. Feel free to give any feedback on general improvements that you'd like to see. Great work so far!

 

[Shiggs713]

wow nice mod, looks great

I did a few little game speed changes for my Shiggs Earth mod, and pretty quickly had people asking me how to disable my changes so they could use yours pretty similar though, I only raised tech cost 33% and made unit and building creation 33% faster. Anyhow great looking mod, I will try it out soon.

 

[Shambles]

I actually play epic as well. I don't advance eras as fast as you did, though... Guessing you focused on one specific branch?

Not rly, no But to be fair i played Babylon and built science buildings/wonders asap. Then again, i also wiped out two enemies till then (i'm playin on prince though, which is far too easy... )
btw: I always use great scientist for building an academy...

 

[Feyd Rautha]

How hard would it be to mod out the free tech until someone figures out a fix for the OP scientists? Would I be able to use Kael's guide to gump my way through it?

 

[Thalassicus]

No, roads are going back to default maintenance. I don't have a problem with them, I was just testing something that wasn't working for someone else.

You or the person you were helping have probably tried this already, but if not...

You could experiment with giving a free, invisible policy with the RouteGoldMaintenanceMod attribute altered. It would avoid the integer division issue by doing it after the multiplication by # roads, instead of before.

 

[Valkrionn]

How hard would it be to mod out the free tech until someone figures out a fix for the OP scientists? Would I be able to use Kael's guide to gump my way through it?

No idea, as I don't know how the abilities are set up yet. I haven't looked.

You or the person you were helping have probably tried this already, but if not...

Something I thought about is you could experiment with giving a free, invisible policy with the RouteGoldMaintenanceMod attribute. It would avoid the integer division issue by doing it after the multiplication by # roads, instead of before.

Well, if it was something I wanted I'd just add it to agriculture (free tech for everyone, afterall), but it's not a change I want. Was just testing it.

 

[Ekmek]

I think we should add an engineer slot to the monument. it takes an engineer to build one, gets production in game for flatland cities, and if someone pops a great engineer it could lead to some real wonder races.

Also, I still dislke the workshop. maybe if you made pastures like farms but only can build on plains and grasslands you could have them add 1 hammer (simulating production from large animal labor). Or change the worthless tradepost to give +1 hammer inistead of gold and make that the workshop or call it the village. I'm thinking there are options other than adding a new TI.

 

[Valkrionn]

I think we should add an engineer slot to the monument. it takes an engineer to build one, gets production in game for flatland cities, and if someone pops a great engineer it could lead to some real wonder races.

Also, I still dislke the workshop. maybe if you made pastures like farms but only can build on plains and grasslands you could have them add 1 hammer (simulating production from large animal labor). Or change the worthless tradepost to give +1 hammer inistead of gold and make that the workshop or call it the village. I'm thinking there are options other than adding a new TI.

I may do the pasture thing. I've also been considering making the trading post upgrade; Could easily have it gain hammers as well as commerce. Either solution would allow me to remove the workshop.

While you're here: I know you're far better at art than I am. Any chance I could talk you into possibly making icons for the resource buildings I'm adding? They are:

• Brewery
• Bakery
• Leatherworker
• Textile Mill
• Hunting Lodge
• Plantation
• Fishmonger (close enough)

Edit: Also, like the monument idea.

 

[kaltorak]

You were right, the problems I listed on the last page were coming from another mod. I started new with only this mod active and it's more balanced.

 

[Grey Fox]

Playing with the mod now, gonna write down my opinions of the changes as I go, maybe add stuff I want to see.

1. The new interface for the build queue is forcing me an extra click EVERY time I add a new construction item. The old system only forced me extra clicks when I used the queue. ("City is ready for a new construction"- notification brings up the screen, then it doesn't close when I pick an item, I have to click the back button).
2. You realize there is a building called 'Workshop' as well right?
3. Pedia is very bad at showing how much a tile with a resource is improved by an improvement. It's so bad that it's not shown at all in fact.
4. For some reason when I purchased a warrior it added a warrior to the top of the build queue as well... o.O - wasted one turn on that instead of the wonder I was building. (Similar thing happened when I purchased a structure, the build queue disappeared)
5. Dunno if this is because of your mod or because I deleted my config.ini or cause of mods in general, but I am not getting any auto-saves.
6. Road maintenance has been removed? If so, you should probably change what the Trade Unions policy does...

Some ideas

1. Social Policy tweaks
   1. Liberty>Collective Rule - Is boring, bring it up to 1 population added per city. Find other ways to limit how powerful this makes city spamming.
   2. Make it a bit easier to get Social Policies? I love getting them, I'd just like them to come a bit more often. Just don't make it too easy to get cultural victory.
   3. Maybe a bonus for finishing a social policy branch, for one thing it would give an incentive to finish one besides going for culture win
2. A little bit less resources per strategic resource, I find that it's a bit too easy to get a large number of resources, more than you are able to field in units usually.
3. Not sure I like that a few wonders go obsolete, I don't really see any need for that. Or is the Colossus considered so strong it needs to go obsolete?
4. Maybe cities could come with an innate +1 culture (is it possible to make it only local?, though the already +33% policy cost per city might be enough offset)

Well, that's it for now.

 

[Derekhan2]

Hi, don't know if it was mentionned before (though I read a lot of posts in this thread), but there is one thing I dislike about your mod, which apart from this I find great - and it's the fact that when you've built something in a city, there is no longer a reminder of what it is ! so unless you keep an eye on each & every city in your empire in order to know what they are about to build and in how much time, then all U know is that something has been built up in a city, but what was is ?? It's really a shame cause I love the way game is sped up in terms of production & slowed down in terms of science - which was I think a major drawback of the vanilla game - but this UI thing is really poisoning the experience.
I'm surprised no-one seemed to mention this in threads, so maybe it's because of another activated mod - which would seem very strange to me as the only 2 other mods that I activated are "maps" mods (Legendary Earth Mod & Yet Another Huge Earth Map mod).

 

[kaltorak]

I agree with the 2 posters above. I like the mod, but I don't like the change to open the queue by default. Or at least not how it is implemented. For example if I click something and I want to change it, I have to close the window, remove that from the queue, open teh window again, and add what I want.
If we could remove items from the queue with a rightclick, it would be better. From the queue where we add things, not from where we just see the queue.

 

[Feyd Rautha]

I don't see the queue problems from vanilla. You can move stuff up and down and you can hit the X to delete it. I like the ideas in this mod, but I'd like to have an option to unload the queue changes altogether.

Also, I think reducing policy costs could be done if you counterbalance it with requiring SIX policy trees to be complete instead of five.

 

[Valkrionn]

You were right, the problems I listed on the last page were coming from another mod. I started new with only this mod active and it's more balanced.

I thought so.

Playing with the mod now, gonna write down my opinions of the changes as I go, maybe add stuff I want to see.

1. The new interface for the build queue is forcing me an extra click EVERY time I add a new construction item. The old system only forced me extra clicks when I used the queue. ("City is ready for a new construction"- notification brings up the screen, then it doesn't close when I pick an item, I have to click the back button).
2. You realize there is a building called 'Workshop' as well right?
3. Pedia is very bad at showing how much a tile with a resource is improved by an improvement. It's so bad that it's not shown at all in fact.
4. For some reason when I purchased a warrior it added a warrior to the top of the build queue as well... o.O - wasted one turn on that instead of the wonder I was building. (Similar thing happened when I purchased a structure, the build queue disappeared)
5. Dunno if this is because of your mod or because I deleted my config.ini or cause of mods in general, but I am not getting any auto-saves.
6. Road maintenance has been removed? If so, you should probably change what the Trade Unions policy does...

1. Been fixed in v2, as I've said several times. The new mechanic should look much like that of Civ4:
   • Always on, build list only expands if more than one item is in it (as in, only takes up more space on the city screen if you actually queue something)
   • A standard mouse-click ignores the queue, functions as if it was off, and closes the build menu.
   • A shift-click adds the item to the back of the queue.
   • A ctrl-click adds the item to the front of the queue.
   • The build popup does not allow queueing.
2. Very aware of that fact, yes. ATM, I'm considering removing the improvement. When it was added, I was considering removing the building instead.
3. I know. Something that needs to be done... At the least, we could have it in the improvement page, displayed in the resource mouseover? As in, mouse over a resource in the "Can be built on" section.
4. Known, and fixed in v2. Was a logic error in the original author's code.
5. I know I am getting autosaves, so I'd think that would be on your end.
6. Accidental inclusion. Tested something for someone, neglected to remove it, will be gone in v2.

Some ideas

1. Social Policy tweaks
   1. Liberty>Collective Rule - Is boring, bring it up to 1 population added per city. Find other ways to limit how powerful this makes city spamming.
   2. Make it a bit easier to get Social Policies? I love getting them, I'd just like them to come a bit more often. Just don't make it too easy to get cultural victory.
   3. Maybe a bonus for finishing a social policy branch, for one thing it would give an incentive to finish one besides going for culture win
2. A little bit less resources per strategic resource, I find that it's a bit too easy to get a large number of resources, more than you are able to field in units usually.
3. Not sure I like that a few wonders go obsolete, I don't really see any need for that. Or is the Colossus considered so strong it needs to go obsolete?
4. Maybe cities could come with an innate +1 culture (is it possible to make it only local?, though the already +33% policy cost per city might be enough offset)

Well, that's it for now.

1. Social Policies:
   • I rather agree.
   • Same, maybe increase the amount you need for cultural victory?
   • Would have to see how to do that. Maybe a free policy requiring all the others in the tree would work...
2. Not sure about that one, particularly for the later ones where you have buildings for them as well.
3. I don't like that either, personally. Wonders should remain useful.
4. Not sure about that.

Hi, don't know if it was mentionned before (though I read a lot of posts in this thread), but there is one thing I dislike about your mod, which apart from this I find great - and it's the fact that when you've built something in a city, there is no longer a reminder of what it is ! so unless you keep an eye on each & every city in your empire in order to know what they are about to build and in how much time, then all U know is that something has been built up in a city, but what was is ?? It's really a shame cause I love the way game is sped up in terms of production & slowed down in terms of science - which was I think a major drawback of the vanilla game - but this UI thing is really poisoning the experience.
I'm surprised no-one seemed to mention this in threads, so maybe it's because of another activated mod - which would seem very strange to me as the only 2 other mods that I activated are "maps" mods (Legendary Earth Mod & Yet Another Huge Earth Map mod).

I don't know of anything I'd done that would change that behavior. I'll check it out though.

I agree with the 2 posters above. I like the mod, but I don't like the change to open the queue by default. Or at least not how it is implemented. For example if I click something and I want to change it, I have to close the window, remove that from the queue, open teh window again, and add what I want.
If we could remove items from the queue with a rightclick, it would be better. From the queue where we add things, not from where we just see the queue.

The queue has been changed, like I said.

I'll try to add a rightclick to remove items, but may not be able to.

 

[Feyd Rautha]

RE: More policies

One thing you could do is have every nation start with a free policy choice. Basically, it would be the principles upon which the society was founded. I would also remove the ability to skip a policy choice and make it a required choice. That would eliminate some of the more exploitative strategies where people are holding onto policy choices until the Medieval era in order to immediately cap out the patronage tree.

I'd also say you could lower the costs for later policies but require six paths for Utopia.

RE: Queue

Could you use the same functionality code to just add the "delete"/X button to each item so you can click that instead to delete items?

 

[Grey Fox]

1. Been fixed in v2, as I've said several times.

Yeah I am not gonna read 220 posts when I download a mod .

 

[Feyd Rautha]

Did he not edit the original? *checks* Oh... I guess not.