European thread

[Ancient Grudge]

Why does it have to be the english language by the way?
I call myself british not european.

quote:
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So I don't suppose you support giving economic aid to poor areas of Britain, like Cornwall?
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its part of our own country so yes ofcourse we should but personally id prefer poor african countries get more aid then say cornwall

We tried a union with denmark and norway? When was this?

Why throw away the single market? Because it is costing as more money then we get back.

 

[Pillager]

Originally posted by MrPresident

more importantly so does the government. That needs to be the case in Europe. The EU needs a single language in which to produce all its offical documents.

I say that the Euro cannot work without political union in the long run.

I will surprise you but agreeing with most of what you said. Wait for it...I agree with most of what you said.

1. & 2. No. Producing official documents in Klingon would make little difference to labour mobility. If people don't speak the language of where they wish to go, most will not go there. There has to be a cultural agreement and cohesion, of which language is the most important part. And that is not going to happen any time soon.
Why is the long run any different to the short/medium run? Surely if the project needs political unity & a common language to work, it could well need it next year. The project has the potential to be extremely damaging for the member states before the 'long run'. The project has inherent problems that exist now.

3.

 

[MrPresident]

Why does it have to be the english language by the way?

It is the most widely (notice that word) spoken language in the world and most European countries have to as their second language already. Also French makes the men sound feminine and Germany is simply a horrible language. Spanish could be an option but I think English is the obvious choice.

If people don't speak the language of where they wish to go, most will not go there.

I point you to the history of American immigration.

Why is the long run any different to the short/medium run?

It takes longer to get there.

I think you need to get rid of this obsession you have with labour mobility. First of all, as I have said before, it is impossible to know:
1) The current level of labour mobility
2) The level necessary to make a single currency area a success
Secondly, labour mobility is no more important than economic convergance, which as I have also said before, Europe has. There is no definite answer to whether the Euro will be a success or whether Britain should join it. You ask a group of economists and that this what they will say. It all comes down to what you consider more important and that all comes down to self-interest.
You can't say the Euro is good for Britain and you can't say the Euro is bad for Britain. You can only say that you think the Euro is good for you and your verison of Britain.

 

[insurgent]

Originally posted by Ancient Grudge

We tried a union with denmark and norway? When was this?

Why throw away the single market? Because it is costing as more money then we get back.

1: It was called the EFTA (acronym for European Free Trade Association). It was more confederate, bureaucratic, and smaller in its construction. It fell apart as the EU was more and more succesful. When the EFTA broke apart, Denmark and UK both joined the EU, while Switzerland and Norway, I believe, are the only members left of the EFTA.
Finland, Sweden, Norway, Iceland, the UK, Switzerland, Austria, and Portugal were all members.
The EFTA was founded in 1960 (?) and the UK and Denmark left the EFTA in December 1972 and entered the EC (later EU) in January 1973.

2: The single market isn't costing you more money than you get back. The EU is. The single market is a free-trade limit-less area in Europe, which benefits trade in a very high degree.
But I disagree that the Brits would automatically lose the benefits of the single market if it secedes from the EU. The trade is simply too valuable to both sides.


And finally I still contest the necessity of a single common European language. Why should that be necessary? We just need a central administrative language, not one single popular language. Stupid to say otherwise and it only serves to antagonise the skeptics.

 

[MrPresident]

The trade is simply too valuable to both sides.

You can't have a single market without some sort of political union. You can have free trade (i.e. no tariffs etc) but as see by the relationship between Europe and America it is very hard to implement.

single market is a free-trade limit-less area in Europe

The single market is more than that. It is the free movement of goods, capital, labour and services.

We just need a central administrative language, not one single popular language.

Labour mobility, as Pillager and I have been dicussing for a lot of this thread.

And Pillager I found out what the European definition of economic convergance neccesary for the Euro to work is.

•The amount of money owed by a government - known as the budget deficit, has to be below 3% of Gross Domestic Product (GDP) - the total output of the economy.

•The total amount of money owed by a government, known as the public debt, has to be less than 60% of GDP. The public debt is the cumulative total of each year's budget deficit.

•Countries should have an inflation rate within 1.5% of the three
EU countries with the lowest rate. This was supposed to push down inflation rates and lead to more stable prices.

•Long-term interest rates must be within 2% of the three lowest interest rates in EU.

•Exchange rates must be kept within "normal" fluctuation margins of Europe's exchange-rate mechanism.

 

[EdwardTking]

Originally posted by Ancient Grudge
We tried a union with denmark and norway? When was this?

Over a thousand years ago. King Canute.

 

[Ancient Grudge]

if we do join the euro will this hinder or help our economy. wont it help the manufacturing sector which has been suffering from the extremly high pound.

 

[MrPresident]

if we do join the euro will this hinder or help our economy.

The short answer, no one knows. The long answer includes lots of economic terms, diagrams and a strange use of the word divergance but basically means the same as the short answer.

the extremly high pound.

Relatively high pound.

 

[Ancient Grudge]

it is extremly high compared to the former italian and greek curriences

 

[MrPresident]

it is extremly high compared to the former italian and greek curriences

Affecting the vitally important anglo-italian and anglo-greek trade?

 

[Ancient Grudge]

Originally posted by MrPresident

Affecting the vitally important anglo-italian and anglo-greek trade?

Italy and Greece OLIVE OIL