Fall Further - The Original Thread

[scutarii]

You do realize that's counterproductive. If you kill Vehem through the pop loss, we'll never get another update ever again.

It is appropriate to whip great engineers for production boost, khm.

 

[RogueThunder]

It is appropriate to whip great engineers for production boost, khm.

I thought he was a great scientist... Or Prophet.

 

[Vehem]

Ok, because I have a priest and a warrior, a swordsman and an adept, the sacifical alter, and I can't sacrifice. I even have Mizquatle(sp?).

Thanks - by the looks of it, the feature has been broken for a few versions. Not sure when it happened, but it meant a fairly key mechanic of the Cualli was absent. Fixed now.

Do the Kahdi get their World Spells back with Birthright Regained?

They're banned from building that project.

EDIT:
Vehem, how did you fix the diplo keys?

Pretty much just a case of "adding them".

When I was doing the first set of races, I added a set of "Default" keys that could be used when no other text fits (i.e. when the new race doesn't have custom diplomacy). One of those defaults was missing an entry in the GameText files - so it was just displaying "AI_DIPLO_DEMAND_REJECTED_DEFAULT" instead. I've added the key now.

Basically, the Kahdi and the Austrin haven't had custom diplomacy written yet, so they'll just be using the defaults. Every other race will randomly select between default and race specific diplomacy text.

 

[Vehem]

I've done a lot of the XML grunt-work, need to do the Python and C++. What's left shouldn't really take long, but I'm basically out of time. I'll be away completely until Monday, home briefly then out on Monday evening. Tuesday I have a day off though - so that will be J-day.

In other news - found a couple of new bugs and fixed them, fixed the old ones that were mentioned in this thread and also updated to the newer version of FFHBUG (it looks very nice indeed).

 

[Darksaber1]

They're banned from building that project.

they Are? That's good. My brother is playing as the Khadi, I had the scary thought they could get their world spell back, since it's really a mega upgrade, not just gives Khad.

 

[MaxAstro]

Every other race will randomly select between default and race specific diplomacy text.

Is there any way you can change that? Just speaking for myself, but it really break immersion when I meet Os-Gabella, and she says "Would you rather be my friend or my foe?". The default text just never fits as well as the race-specific one.

 

[The13thRonin]

Now Fall Further will have to update to patch L. I hope this doesn't delay it too much.

 

[Vehem]

Now Fall Further will have to update to patch L. I hope this doesn't delay it too much.

I've just completed the merge for Patch L. The only issue I'm currently working on is repairing the World Builder - at the moment it's throwing an unidentifiable C++ exception when you try to enter it (since the 3.17 upgrade and using FFHBUG - not sure where the cause lies as yet).

As things stand - the game seems to be perfectly playable, but the World builder doesn't work at all. One of the things that seemed to be changed with 3.17 is the method used to highlight certain plots (such as the world builder plot highlight or the naval-blockade highlights) so I'm looking at that to see what could be causing it.


EDIT: Fixed.

Wish I could say it was some savvy coding, but I actually still have no idea what was causing the issue or what exactly fixed it. Still - it works now.

 

[Jie]

I've just completed the merge for Patch L. The only issue I'm currently working on is repairing the World Builder - at the moment it's throwing an unidentifiable C++ exception when you try to enter it (since the 3.17 upgrade and using FFHBUG - not sure where the cause lies as yet).

As things stand - the game seems to be perfectly playable, but the World builder doesn't work at all. One of the things that seemed to be changed with 3.17 is the method used to highlight certain plots (such as the world builder plot highlight or the naval-blockade highlights) so I'm looking at that to see what could be causing it.


EDIT: Fixed.

Wish I could say it was some savvy coding, but I actually still have no idea what was causing the issue or what exactly fixed it. Still - it works now.

Does this mean the new patch is out? I don't see where I can d/l it.

 

[Darksaber1]

Yep, it's not on the front page, and it's been just under three hours. I'm sure you have a good reason.

 

[MagisterCultuum]

I wonder if that bug is in any way related to the intermittent WorldBuilder problem that some versions of my modmod had, where none of the units, buildings, etc, showed up, and the worldbuilder controls wouldn't go away when returning to a normal game. (It doesn't sound particularly similar, but both are worlbuilder issues.)



So, when do you plan to post it? And how long would you guess it would take to merge xienwolf's modcomp into FF, once he releases it again? (It better be out before August )



In addition to his changes, I'd really like to have AirCombat strength handled like normal combat, with different damage types and the ability to add (typed) strength through promotions. Making Archer and Siege units use ranged attacks makes that much more important. It would also be nice if units could get xp from ranged combat. (I believe that aircraft can get xp this way, but it doesn't seem like ranged land units do.) Letting terrains and improvements have damage resistance prereqs like features do could be very nice too.

 

[Charybdis]

So uh, this merge for patch L.. does he mean just download the main file and remerge it, or was there meant to be a patch file for fall further?

 

[Vehem]

Yep, it's not on the front page, and it's been just under three hours. I'm sure you have a good reason.

Fairly good - I've not posted it yet

I like to give things at least a half decent test before releasing them, especially with as many updates as went into this one (3.17, Patch e to patch L, new civ, FFHBUG etc). I finished the merging bit at around 1:30am here and will be doing the testing/packaging this morning.

I wonder if that bug is in any way related to the intermittent WorldBuilder problem that some versions of my modmod had, where none of the units, buildings, etc, showed up, and the worldbuilder controls wouldn't go away when returning to a normal game. (It doesn't sound particularly similar, but both are worlbuilder issues.)

So, when do you plan to post it? And how long would you guess it would take to merge xienwolf's modcomp into FF, once he releases it again? (It better be out before August )

In addition to his changes, I'd really like to have AirCombat strength handled like normal combat, with different damage types and the ability to add (typed) strength through promotions. Making Archer and Siege units use ranged attacks makes that much more important. It would also be nice if units could get xp from ranged combat. (I believe that aircraft can get xp this way, but it doesn't seem like ranged land units do.) Letting terrains and improvements have damage resistance prereqs like features do could be very nice too.

It does sound like it was a similar issue, but it's basically just what happens when it fails to create the worldbuilder content/tabs. If it fails to do that, then you pretty much get the results you describe (same issue with controls not going away on mine).

As far as Xienwolf's modcomp - I reckon it will take less than an hour to merge if it's done as neatly as he did it last time (he makes it very easy to merge - my code looks a little scruffy by comparison).

Regarding the other requests, they all pretty much sound like SDK jobs and not really small ones.

Current plan for 040 is:
Austrin
3.17
Patch L
FFHBUG

Then 041:
UnitStats
Xien's XML comp
Looking at the Dural (their statues are a little "mixed up" now, seeing as things like Valor have increased in power significantly)
Looking at Broad Alignments

===

I'd originally held off on UnitStats as part of it was covered by the GPL (so the whole of it was covered by the GPL, so then the whole of Fall Further becomes covered by the GPL, which means the whole of Magister's modcomp would become covered by the GPL if he used FF as a base and so on...) and Teg had identified the part that would need to be rewritten to escape that. It seems however that the latest version of BUG is also GPL'd so I think I'm largely stuck with it.

For those who aren't familiar with it - the GNU Public License is a copyright (or actually "copyleft" according to its creator) agreement designed to protect the rights of open-source developers. In theory it's a very good thing, except that the full GPL (there is a lesser version - LGPL) forces any software that contains any portion of code that was covered under the GPL to also become completely under the GPL and to display that fact prominently. It has been described in the past as a "Viral License" - it spreads itself. The creators (Free Software Foundation) would argue that this is necessary to protect the rights of developers - but many feel that there are better ways.

I'm actually not convinced it can be fully legally applied to Civ4 mods, especially ones with such myriad changes in the DLL, but I do have to respect the notice as given so there will be a "GPL notice" in the mod folder.

 

[Vehem]

I've just added Blackwater and Blighted Coast (hell terrain versions of ocean/coast - cloned from the originals with a slight brightness decrease). The blending however is not 100% perfect. It's not too bad and it certainly allows you to see where Hell terrain has spread to in the ocean (the main reason for doing it), but I'd like to sort it if I can - possibly in a later patch.

Has anyone come across a mod that uses different Ocean/Coast types and has the blending working correctly?

 

[Vehem]

Version 040

1. Updated for FfH 040 and BtS 3.17
2. Austrin Civilization added (Air/Tali inspired explorer race)
3. Hell terrain versions of Ocean and Coast added (Blackwater and Blighted Coast)
4. FFHBUG included - many interface upgrades, almost all of which can be deactivated if you wish (CTRL-ALT-O to access the options screen, you can also turn off the "Reminder Message" on that screen)
5. Mazatl Priests reworked slightly - may need a bit of further work later
6. TXT_KEY fixed in Diplo messages

===

DLL source code to follow - going to try tidying it up a little first.

 

[grumpylad]

Many thanks, nice easy installation see you all soon.

 

[Ahriman]

Has anyone come across a mod that uses different Ocean/Coast types and has the blending working correctly?

Haven't seen it anywhere. This would be an awesome feature though; I take it this means that I could see where hell was advancing, and put an adept in a boat and sanctify big areas of ocean to keep Hell away from my continent, rather than having to to just run around putting out fires wherever it happens to advance on land?
Maybe we could also have a chance of demonic sea monsters spawning in hell-sea.

 

[Ahriman]

Also:
Idiot question. Should this be installed over a copy of FFH 032 patch L?
Or can it install over previous FAll further versions?

 

[MacGyverInSpace]

Annoyingly, the installer looks for FFH 032 in Firaxis Games/Beyond the Sword and not Civ4/Beyond the Sword . Maybe you could update the installer to use the install path? -NVM Somehow my registry entry got changed - I think it was patch 3.17.

P.S. Great Release.

 

[mogoroth]

yeeees!!!!
you made it man!! You are a DEMIGOD.
Congratsulations for all your efforts for enhancing the game we all love FFH2.
I hope soon Fall Further will be part of the main game as it should be, because it is carefully and responsibly woven with the rich lore of FFH2.
I hope the best for you and your family and I send you my warmest wishes from real hot Greece .
The day after tomorrow I will be enjoying FF from the beach of my favorite island while the slight waves will tinkle my feet .Happy and cool summer time VEHEM !!!