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Final Fixes Reborn

Discussion in 'Rise from Erebus Modmod' started by Ronkhar, Apr 17, 2013.

  1. Nor'easter

    Nor'easter Chieftain

    Joined:
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    After I updated to Revision 301 and loaded my latest Autosave (playing as the Scions), I was no longer able to build Crossbowmen, they just don't appear in my build queue. This was reloading an Autosave of a game started under Revision 300, so maybe in a new game started under 301 this won't happen, but just thought I'd bring it to your attention.
     
  2. Mknn

    Mknn Chieftain

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    Houston
    Attached. I've tried a lot of different things, no matter what, the attached save crashes going to the next turn.
     

    Attached Files:

  3. Bearmarshal

    Bearmarshal Chieftain

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    Sweden
    I haven't played the scions myself, but this probably makes sense. From what I've seen, they don't look overly powerful, and not having a Marksman unit at all until the very late game isn't exactly fair...

    The Royal Guard is pretty overpowered in the mid game, what with being a mounted unit gaining defensive bonuses, having the highest base defense of non-UU units at its tier and getting metal weapons on top of that, and it gets the rare Guardsman promotion too. The Royal Guard is the only reason I even consider picking the Aristocracy civic, because if you rely on farms to be your primary food source, turning them all into pseudo-hamlets can be quite a harsh blow to your production...

    Ah, right, that's because I made them national units again, and you've probably already built four of them. If there was a good reason for why they were made freely spammable in the past, I'm willing to revert that, but I'm of the mind that none of the top-tier units should be non-limited, and it was annoying me that Crossbowmen could be made your staple offensive unit as well, what with them having a higher base attack than the Champions (of course, being archery units, they don't get the City Raider line of promotions).
     
  4. Calavente

    Calavente Richard's voice

    Joined:
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    Re-Xbow:
    I think the change was to follow what the real transformation of X-Bow were:
    - Xbow are 'pre-gunpowder' revolutions : you don't need to have a huge training to be able to accuratly shoot an armored cavalry dead, when compared to longbows.
    Longbows were powerful, but needed long training....
    Xbow were as powerful, more in short distance shooting, but with less rapid fire... with cost in equipment, but less training.
    to have Xbow equivalent to LB, you needed 2-3 more guys, 2-3 more cost in equipement, but the guys were newbies, only a few days/week in training, and each guy is less expensive.

    so the idea was to reflect that :
    a unit cheaper than LB, more powerful, that can be spamable. (but less defensive fire, and less first strikes).

    Indeed, having XBow being elite super high power ranged units was opposite to the real gain that happened.

    but one can do it differently and we can adapt lore

    a bit more on this later.
     
  5. Nor'easter

    Nor'easter Chieftain

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    I saw in the new game that I started that Crossbowmen are now National Units. I don't really have strong feelings on this one way or the other, will probably need to play a bit more to see how it plays out.
     
  6. Bearmarshal

    Bearmarshal Chieftain

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    Ah, yeah, from a real world perspective, it makes a lot of sense, but from a real world perspective, it doesn't make sense that they are as crazy powerful as they are. All of my complaints are about the game balance. When every city in the entire enemy empire is guarded by 1-3 Crossbowmen, I have to rely completely on the AI being too passive to deal with my siegers in order to even keep an advance going. Defending simply becomes way too easy this way.

    Now, Black Imperators's plans for the unit trees involves making Crossbowmen a tier 3 unit, so that will eventually resolve everything.
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2017 at 2:08 AM
  7. Calavente

    Calavente Richard's voice

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    yup, I agree.
    it's just that I remember that a few years ago there was that discussion for justifying the change on Xbow.
    but I agree, the change was to have units slightly more powerful (in str) than Longbows, cheaper, but with limitations on defensive strike.
    I agree that the aim was not to have the tierIV Xbow become unlimited without any changes.
    It should have been a tier3.5 cheaper.

    But Huge "repeatable Xbows" : aka chonoku, could well be tier IV units ; maybe with a cross with siege unit, and have it as "fantasy machine-gun" ?
     
  8. fdrpi

    fdrpi Chieftain

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    Quick question: what's the name of the new main menu music?
     
  9. PPQ_Purple

    PPQ_Purple Techpriest Engineer

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    Personally what I'd do with the crossbow is make it an alternative to riflemen for those civs that don't get access to gunpowder weapons. Makes for an interesting tradeoff.
     
  10. TheIanOakley

    TheIanOakley Bugged

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    There was a unit tier chart a few pages back, which IIRC wanted to have a split between Offensive Archers and Defensive Archers. Is that still a thing or are we ignoring it for the purposes of this discussion?
     
  11. black_imperator

    black_imperator Chieftain

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    The chart is a long term plan. it's nowhere near ready to be implemented and can and will be amended if people come up with better ways to do thing ^^
     

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