Geography and History in US school curriculum

[CartesianFart]

And good point about not advancing political views. I expect you would object to any teacher that says America is the greatest country in the world as well.

That is not politics,that is stating the facts.

Teachers are suppose to teach credible and conventional facts not random analogies as one with the preaching of Hitler.

 

[Desmond Hawkins]

Well, no kidding Cartesian.

But MobBoss was saying the primary problem with geography education in the US was with the teachers, and then he gave the case of a single teacher from Colorado as his evidence.

I mean, clearly the problem is that all the teachers are commies.

 

[Warman17]

. Come to think of it I don't think I have ever taken a standarized to test on the subjects.

Do you think history and geography should be held up with higher importance in the classroom?

I would say NYS places higher on english and history than math and science. We need 4 credits of social studies, and 4 of english to get a diploma, but only 3 of math and 3 of science(well thats our school at least). Theres a regents(state run standardized test) on global history/geography and US history as well as an english regents in 11th grade. Theres math regents for Math A(algebra/geometry) and one for Math B(geometry/trig). Theres a regents for Earth Science, Biology, Chemistry, and Phyiscs. However for the sciences I believe you only need two to pass high school, and only pass a Math A regents. You need to pass the English regents, but I'm not sure if you need to(or which one if not both) of the social studies regents you need to pass.

Theres also a regents for (the main 3) French, Spanish, German, and a few other languages; Hebrew, Italian and Latin. Maybe Chinese or a couple others too.


And yes I believe history is important and should be taught, the problem is after High School normally people will just forget because they're never around it again. (My sister, age 23, doesn't even remember Marbury v. Madison and she took AP US History!)

 

[jameson]

War is God's way of teaching Americans geography

just had to throw it in there .

However, since an experience in junior high (at age 12), where a sizable number of my fellow students couldn't locate my hometown on a map of the Netherlands, I'm extremely sceptical of the ability of any lower-grade student to locate anything on a map. So while I'm always in favour of more knowledge as opposed to less, I doubt this is a uniquely American problem (although the problem may be exacerbated in the US by the lack of a need to get acquainted with what's going on in the rest of the world).

 

[zjl56]

I remember conversations where it became apparent that people thought Chicago was a state. In everyday life, it just doesn't register to people.

Growing up in Columbus:
6th grade: we had a general social studies course
7th: Ohio history
8th: US history
9th: half World Geography/studying for Ohio standards tests
10th: can't remember...
11th: US history
12th: Democracy/Citizenship

World geography got little to attention. The 6th grade and part of 9th is total time in my public schooling is where I had the chance to learn about world religions, cultures, etc. Needless to say, those that weren't interested learn very little.

And even after the years of education I received on the topic, I know/remember very little. I don't remember all the president's names like I used to, much less remember what each did. The school system and tests they administer doesn't encourage utilization of knowledge or long-term memorization.

In math, you can't but build upon that knowledge one course after another. In these topics, you memorize, regurgitate and forget. And the US is not the only country afflicted by this system. It just so happens that the nations in Europe are smaller and are more directly affected by other nations (heck, there is an EU). It just so happens that people are much more likely to meet people of other nationalities or travel abroad, whereas I had friends in college that have never left their state!


Is a face of a man really important? I have no idea what Socrates looked like, or know even if the books attributed to him are mostly Plato's works. But that seems pretty inconsequential compared to the idea's he's credited for bring out, for the ideas he stood for, etc.

Still.. Anyone could recognize other such leaders of World War 2. That was a more advanced example, but it is sad to know that many people can't point out countries like Iran and Iraq on the map.

 

[ChrTh]

New report timed to Civilization Fanatics thread:

Study: Geography Greek to young Americans

Heh, I just saw that. It's obvious National Geographic reads this forum and saw my request for an update

 

[kingjoshi]

Still.. Anyone could recognize other such leaders of World War 2.

Not really. I can't remember of the life of me what Churchill and Stalin looked like. I would never claim to be well versed in WWII history, but I'm not completely ignorant either. I know that the Germans and Japanese were evil and Americans saved the world Seriously, I remember reading biographies on Hitler and reading about Marx, Lenin, Stalin, etc.

But students barely remember what they learned last semester much less information years ago. I can't even remember what course I took in the 10th grade for the humanities. And I got an A. I know that because I didn't get a B until I took an AP course my senior year. And I liked to learn. I can't imagine all the students who finished the course (30% of US students drop out of HS, almost 50% of blacks) that didn't care a damn remember the stuff years later.

That was a more advanced example, but it is sad to know that many people can't point out countries like Iran and Iraq on the map.

I haven't watched the news in a long time. I read online, but I can totally understand people who wouldn't. And if they don't, how are they supposed to remember the information?

 

[The Yankee]

What was sad was that in senior year of high school, when the teacher gave a little test to see where everyone stood on the first day, I was the only one that could not only somewhat draw the US with each state in its place, but could also name all of them and label them all in the right place.

 

[Bluemofia]

What was sad was that in senior year of high school, when the teacher gave a little test to see where everyone stood on the first day, I was the only one that could not only somewhat draw the US with each state in its place, but could also name all of them and label them all in the right place.

That. Is. Sad.

At my school, we're much more attuned to History and Geography, (we've got a bunch of history freaks, and we have relitivly large classes of AP Euro/AP US History classes) but the school only requires 1 credit of World History or Geography, 1 credit of US History, and .5 credits of Government. (2.5 credits of history)

Verses 4 credits of English, 2 credits of Science, 2 credits of Math, 0 credits of Forigen Language (stupid teachers...), and something like 8 credits of Other (anything going over the required credits).

Ah well, but I was always strong in Math, Science, and History. And horrible at Linguistic Courses. (English, Reading, Forigen Languages, etc.)

 

[The Yankee]

That. Is. Sad.

And I went to what was considered one of the top public schools in New York City. Brooklyn Technical High School...sigh...I think it went down the drain, especially during the time I was there. I'm glad the principal was finally canned...but that's also a personal struggle I had with those boneheads.

Anyway...US History was split up. The older stuff I had junior year, I think...maybe the first term of senior year. No, junior year. Because I was wearing a cervical collar for much of my time in that last class. I was the ace of that class, everyone went to me for answers at the review (which was a competition between groups, it worked well). World History was two terms I think, plus US Government. So yeah...2.5 years.

But I had learned most of it all beforehand through my own interests and my parents helping me with a few books and all, so the classes were a breeze.

Now if you want a tough but very interesting history lesson...wow...first term in college with religions and history in East Asia, then writing a paper about a part of the T'ang Dynasty (I think it's buried in the History forum here). Lot of work but very rewarding. It was heaven.

 

[MobBoss]

But MobBoss was saying the primary problem with geography education in the US was with the teachers, and then he gave the case of a single teacher from Colorado as his evidence.

If our kids are not learning geography in school when they should exactly whose fault is it? The kids fault? No, I humbly submit that teachers are not doing so great a job at actually teaching these days. And when a significant percentage of kids cant even point out Israel or Iraq on a map, let alone Louisana, thats just pathetic.

I mean, clearly the problem is that all the teachers are commies.

Well, not what I said, but you are free to have your opinion.

 

[aaglo]

Did I read correctly? Some schools in USA don't teach geography and/or history? That is just crazy... or they've been listening too much Sting (History will teach us nothing).

Here we study thus:
1st grade: finnish, math, physical education, religion (?)... and maybe some art classes too (music, drawing..)
3rd: history, geography, biology, 1st foreing language (usually english or swedish), environmental scienses (or whatever that's called... you know, the basics of chemistry and physics...), crafts
7th: second foreing language, physics, chemistry

 

[A'AbarachAmadan]

Scary on some of things I've read. My 5-yr old knows more geography than the average 18-24 yr old according to the statistics given. Of course, he's already moved cross-country and cross-world, so guess that tends to make one more aware and curious.

 

[JtheJackal]

If our kids are not learning geography in school when they should exactly whose fault is it? The kids fault? No, I humbly submit that teachers are not doing so great a job at actually teaching these days. And when a significant percentage of kids cant even point out Israel or Iraq on a map, let alone Louisana, thats just pathetic.

Its not the teachers, its the people in the state capitol who decide what the students should be learning. The students must be prepared for SATs! Everythings revolved around the standarized tests. No time for geography its not on the test!

 

[Bluemofia]

I personally believe it's the kids fault if they do not know where Iraq is on the map or anything.

They are the ones stupid enough not to have enough sense to ever look at a globe.

 

[Irish Caesar]

I blame the parents.

 

[The Yankee]

Did I read correctly? Some schools in USA don't teach geography and/or history? That is just crazy... or they've been listening too much Sting (History will teach us nothing).

I'm not sure about that. Though, some schools, in order to meet the No Child Left Behind Law, have been axing some departments and having the students spend half the day on math or reading.

 

[Veritass]

I'm surprised no one has brought up the role of political correctness in dumbing down history textbooks. It seems that an inordinate amount of U.S. history was enacted by white males (read patriarchal, slavery-loving misogynists). To make sure no one feels left out, California has passed laws to make sure that minority groups (various ethnicities and women) are "adequately represented" in the textbooks. That is why you have one page on Abraham Lincoln and two pages on "Rosie the Riveter."

There is currently legislation before the California legislature to add gays and lesbians to the lists, to make sure that their contributions to history are "adequately represented" as well. (btw, I think Rosie the Riveter was a lesbian .)