I missed that.
A petition to replace Churchill's statue with one of a robot from an anime series.
That needs to be taken very seriously
[RD] George Floyd and protesting while black
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I missed that.
A petition to replace Churchill's statue with one of a robot from an anime series.
That needs to be taken very seriously
Socrates99
Bottoms up!
I've actually seen pushes against Jefferson. Either removing statues or renaming schools. I can see why. He allegedly raped slaves. Still, I worry that attacking founders could undermine the push against confederates (actual traitors against the US).
I missed that.
A petition to replace Churchill's statue with one of a robot from an anime series.
That needs to be taken very seriously
An EVA; this is no time for laughing.
Various talking heads have been doing the rounds on breakfast TV calling for the removal, although whether they're having any less of a laugh...
Evangelion?!I missed that.
A petition to replace Churchill's statue with one of a robot from an anime series.
That needs to be taken very seriously
Signed.
Didn't he have a black servant?
And is there any truth to Pushkin being descended from that servant?
His godson was black, bought from Turkish slavery and freed. Later became nobleman and military engineer.
Yes, he was also great grandfather of Pushkin.
Theres a big controversy over a statue of Rhodes at Oxford and to a lesser extent over Rhodes Scholarships.
I'd stick Rhodes in a museum. The scholarships are now open to women and non-whites which Rhodes wouldn't have approved of so I've no problem with them continuing. I think a policy of some going to African students automatically should be adopted.
Socrates99
Bottoms up!
This may be semi off topic but I recently got into the band The Hu. They're a fusion of metal and Mongolian folk music. That led my YouTube feed to reccomend other Mongolian throat singing and similar regional folk music. One video had this guy who looked white and American commentors were making fun of him saying stuff like he got lost on his studies abroad trip or overstayed his spring break. A Russian poster chastised them saying he was Altaic and they had both caucasian and Asian features and that racial classification wasn't as prevalent in Russia.
How true is that. Is racism less prevalent in Russia than in western countries?
It's different. We have our fair share of xenophobia and some racist skinhead groups. But among common folks IMO there is much less of whites-to-blacks racism which appears to be a serious problem in the US. Also, I wouldn't put USA and other Western countries in the same category here.
Opinion of people who lived both in Russia and America:
r16
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oh-kay that one got me . Where in Turkey is that Karl Marx thing ? But then might also be a wrong question to ask . With people always looking forward to bring down idols and the like . Racism (especially against Blacks) is always rare where there are no Blacks . Poster has had his heartbreaks over the years with regards to national streotypes he was brought up with . lt only took widespread numbers of Black players to see bananas in the hands of fans and so on .
Crezth
i knew you were a real man of the left
They will all end up torn down. People won’t be picking nits when the Founding Fathers’ country is shooting them for exercising their quote-unquote “First Amendment rights.”
caketastydelish
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I don’t think the founding fathers statues will be torn down, nor should they. First, is they weren’t traitors to America (Confederates were), second historical context matters.
In the founding fathers time there wasn’t a strong abolitionist movement to begin with, no common sense “right side of history” to be on. People should be held to different standards based on the social norms and expectations of their own time period. Exaggeration to make a point: Julius Caesar would be a bloodthirsty tyrant by current standards but most don’t view him that way.
The Persian and Roman empires both used slaves but no one is offended by their statues.
George Washington, for example, at least voluntarily had his slaves set free at some point. Which doesn’t mean he should be given a free pass for having owned slaves in the first place, but is a distinctly different situation than fighting and dying to the bitter end to preserve it.
In the founding fathers time there wasn’t a strong abolitionist movement to begin with, no common sense “right side of history” to be on. People should be held to different standards based on the social norms and expectations of their own time period. Exaggeration to make a point: Julius Caesar would be a bloodthirsty tyrant by current standards but most don’t view him that way.
The Persian and Roman empires both used slaves but no one is offended by their statues.
George Washington, for example, at least voluntarily had his slaves set free at some point. Which doesn’t mean he should be given a free pass for having owned slaves in the first place, but is a distinctly different situation than fighting and dying to the bitter end to preserve it.
Cloud_Strife
Deity
I think people tend to forget that in terms of American history, the ending of slavery and jim crow is relatively recent; people's grandparents literally grew up not being considered full human beings under the eyes of the law.
I see this argument being used in defense of the Confederates as a red-herring distraction, and mostly offered in bad-faith. It's just the same old whataboutism. People call for the Confederate stuff to be removed and the defenders of the Confederate stuff say "Well what about what George Washington and Thomas Jefferson did?!? We would have to take their monuments down too cause slippery slope!"
I'm handwaving that BS. First things first. The Confederate stuff comes down. Once all of that stuff is gone, then and only then is there any need to talk about George Washington and Thomas Jefferson. Then we can let the folks claiming that they are defending the Confederate stuff on the grounds of "preserving heritage/history" and similar, debate the whataboutism folks who were insisting that if General Lee comes down George Washington has to come down too. Let those two groups sort that out amongst themselves. Problem solved.
Because "history and heritage" isn't the real issue. They just want to keep their Confederate stuff. Once the Confederate stuff is gone the "preserving history" folks aren't going to argue with the "whataboutism/slippery slope" folks.
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caketastydelish
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And the founding fathers came from a period of time about 100 years before the confederacy with different historical circumstances regarding slavery.
I don’t buy the “heritage not hate” for the csa because they only lasted for 4 years, and they were traitors to this country and they lost. For better or worse, this country wouldn’t have existed without our founding fathers, so in that case the “heritage” claim is actually legitimate, even if we acknowledge that some of them made some morally reprehensible decisions.
Speaking as an American, tearing confederate statues down doesn’t feel like an assault on my heritage. Tearing down statues of the founding fathers does.
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