[RD] George Floyd and protesting while black

[Zardnaar]

The confederate lovers are militantly insisting that their huge statues remain erected in public places because they are compensating for something else.

Their large pick up trucks?

 

[Cloud_Strife]

Irrespective of race I’d rather have the cops shoot the guy that stole the weapon than have the guy with the weapon hurt some innocent person.

Don’t drink and drive, don’t fight the police, and don’t try to steal their weapons. Pretty easy guidelines to avoid getting shot.

Looks like this post didn't age well, given that even the police acknowledged the taser is a non-lethal weapon.

 

[Zardnaar]

The fact that you responded to an accusation that you're not a "real Murican" with "I'm part white" says it all.

In any case, I agree with you that "American" isn't, and shouldn't be limited to "pure" white folks.

You would cop more flak here due to your American accent than the colour of your skin.

American expat food bar had a sign saying no politics. They're anti Trump but yeah.

 

[Bugfatty300]

Looks like this post didn't age well, given that even the police acknowledged the taser is a non-lethal weapon.

There's a video of a rioter stealing a rifle from an abandoned police car and then being quickly disarmed by an armed security guard without a single shot fired. Had there been actual cops there then there would have been a massacre.

 

[red_elk]

The confederate lovers are militantly insisting that their huge statues remain erected in public places because they are compensating for something else.

Raises the question about George Washington monument TBH.

 

[Zardnaar]

Raises the question about George Washington monument TBH.

A good chunk of them are Slavers.


Still.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-53055857

 

[Cloud_Strife]

There's a video of a rioter stealing a rifle from an abandoned police car and then being quickly disarmed by an armed security guard without a single shot fired. Had there been actual cops there then there would have been a massacre.

It's weird, white people seem to be taken in live whilst holding dangerous weapons but a black person can't even hold a toy gun without putting their lives at risk.

 

[Sommerswerd]

To be fair Takhsis brought up his race and he just clarified it.

The obvious issue is that being American was conflated with being white. Its a completely accurate portrayal of race in America. No "clarification" needed.

 

[gay_Aleks]

I think that it is a fool's errand to try and separate the Founding Fathers and the Confederates, as supposedly the "good" and the "bad" slavers. One cannot actually understand why the Confederacy happened, without looking at the beginnings of your country, which exists as a kind of a project that: defends slavery, enables westward expansion and maintains general bourgeois interests in the North. The likes of Washington, Jefferson, Hamilton, et cetera, they created this. Therefore, they furthermore made the conditions for the existence of the Confederacy. But this put the U.S in a critical, and unresolvable (in a peaceful way) between the ascendant Northern bourgeoisie and the Southern aristocracy. The fact that it was set within the U.S's own creation, therefore, means that a division is impossible - there's nothing more trivial, in fact, than drawing a line from Washington to Jefferson Davis' secession, and it's something that many historians have done in the past.

So, yeah, the statues of the Confederacy should probably go first, being open and outright displays of white supremacy, but I think that the day for Washington and Jefferson and all the rest will come all too soon.

 

[Imaus]

I think that it is a fool's errand to try and separate the Founding Fathers and the Confederates, as supposedly the "good" and the "bad" slavers. One cannot actually understand why the Confederacy happened, without looking at the beginnings of your country, which exists as a kind of a project that: defends slavery, enables westward expansion and maintains general bourgeois interests in the North. The likes of Washington, Jefferson, Hamilton, et cetera, they created this. Therefore, they furthermore made the conditions for the existence of the Confederacy. But this put the U.S in a critical, and unresolvable (in a peaceful way) between the ascendant Northern bourgeoisie and the Southern aristocracy. The fact that it was set within the U.S's own creation, therefore, means that a division is impossible - there's nothing more trivial, in fact, than drawing a line from Washington to Jefferson Davis' secession, and it's something that many historians have done in the past.

So, yeah, the statues of the Confederacy should probably go first, being open and outright displays of white supremacy, but I think that the day for Washington and Jefferson and all the rest will come all too soon.

Jefferson got a lot of a flak a few years ago due to his 'Slave wife' and misinformational plaques or records calling slaves 'servants'. Washington often gets a pass 'because he freed his slaves on his deathhhhh!', at the very least both figures deserve a helluva lot of cleaning, clarification, record-straighting.

Coming up against Washington and Jefferson and co also incurs attacking the Civic Religion of the US, which while it's not something I ever put too much stock in, much like conservatism it's all the rage around this country. By that time we may have new founding fathers and mothers to encapsulate anyway from Cascadia to New England....

 

[Kyriakos]

If campaigning to take down statues of the founding fathers is a bad idea due to making it more difficult to take down statues of confederate leaders, how does campaigning to take down statues of the confederate leaders not serve as an equally detrimental diversion to the actual goal of reforming the murderous police?

And though I personally would not view the police as so ideologically heavy, if anything they would have allegiance to the founding fathers, not the CSA. But in reality they have allegiance to a concurrent oligarchy.

 

[Anysense]

I see you know an important distinction and prefer one flavour of slavers over the other!

wow, 35 million Americans living below poverty line, while the ghost busters are figuring out which statues to take down next in order to fix the inequality issues. When you’re done with statues, burn all the books, all the museum inventory from “dark and troubled times”, i.e. entire human history. Burn all buildings too, built and engineered by slavers. That will fix all what is wrong in America (and the world!) immediately, I promise.

Never mind, people will come to their senses soon enough. There was the same hysteria in Russia in early nineties, nobody gives a damn about the remaining statues and symbols of communist era, except may be a few lunatics.

 

[Estebonrober]

If campaigning to take down statues of the founding fathers is a bad idea due to making it more difficult to take down statues of confederate leaders, how is campaigning to take down statues of the confederate leaders not serve as an equally detrimental diversion to the actual goal of reforming the murderous police?

And though I personally would not view the police as so ideologically heavy, if anything they would have allegiance to the founding fathers, not the CSA. But in reality they have allegiance to a concurrent oligarchy.

We can do both and frankly police reform was always the less likely considering the political realities on the ground. Its why tens of pages back I pushed for getting what seemed attainable at the time. This is quickly devolving into the assault weapons type firing lines. Which means no progress considering the current tyranny of the minority rule we have here in the USA.

Never mind, people will come to their senses soon enough. There was the same hysteria in Russia in early nineties, nobody gives a damn about the remaining statues and symbols of communist era, except may be a few lunatics.

Trust me you've got another 40 years of people like me wanting to tear down your symbols of racism and oppression. I'm pretty sure the generations behind me will be following suite.

 

[AmazonQueen]

Never mind, people will come to their senses soon enough. There was the same hysteria in Russia in early nineties, nobody gives a damn about the remaining statues and symbols of communist era, except may be a few lunatics.

Well just as an example a statue of Marx was removed from Corvinius University in Budapest in 2014. I don't like Orban but I don't think hes a lunatic.

 

[red_elk]

Meanwhile, Germany installs new statues
https://www.euronews.com/2020/03/06/court-approves-statue-of-soviet-leader-lenin-in-germany

 

[Yeekim]

Meanwhile, Germany installs new statues

Well, they did bankroll him, so it's only fair.

 

[Inhalaattori]

It would be fun to see what would happen if all American cops would simply call in sick and stop going to work.

 

[red_elk]

Well, they did bankroll him, so it's only fair.

We still have much more of them, but hope Germany will catch up

 

[Commodore]

It would be fun to see what would happen if all American cops would simply call in sick and stop going to work.

A national day of jubilation and celebration?

 

[Anysense]

Trust me you've got another 40 years of people like me wanting to tear down your symbols of racism and oppression. I'm pretty sure the generations behind me will be following suite.

If you don't want to learn from history you'll have to learn from your own experience. And I feel as much connection with confederates as an average American with Lenin. Tear down as many as you like - its your problem, not mine. Alghough, I'm a bit worried about possibility of a major crisis in US, which would affect the rest of the world, and what turn American foreign policy can make unless you start electing sane presidents.