Getting to the next level

[Krazy]

Hello guys 'n' gals,

Been reading this forum for a while for tips, and for the most it's worked as I'm able to win on BTS/Warlods on Normal level, but, I'm really struggling badly on Prince. Hence, this post to try and elicit where I'm going wrong and finally win a game on this level. I'm using BTS with the unofficial 3.13 patch.

The main problem is that I usually coast along fine until Renaissance, sometimes Industrial era (although if I'm unlucky earlier) when I think the AI is just "cheating" to beat me and I need an effective counter.

So what do I mean by cheating? Well it just starts wars, even Civs that were friendly or pleased, and it's not because I'm weak either, I have stacks of troops in defence and for the first x years I fend off the assailants. And I can not get peace, ever. Then suddenly, one turn after beating back stack after stack, I suddenly get peace, but it's only because some other guy who has done nothing but build stacks, has a go. So I'm stuck in this endless loop of war I can never escape out of. With cities stuck on producing troops, I can't start keeping up in the tech race because they are building troops and not infrastructure.

Also, tech trading becomes all but impossible, or at such disadvantageous rates that it's stupid. Especially since a turn later all the other Civs are going to have it.

Things I've tried, bribing other Civs to go to war - works for a while, but sooner or later the AI just gets both Civs to war on me. I've even kept Genghis happy for a long time, bribing him to fight people fighting me, but sooner or later he ends up turning on me.

So, I need some more advanced tips to try out. I've tried specialist economies and get my backside handed to me so quickly it's not funny. As my cities are building things like the pyramids and great library and not troops, Napoleon, Montezuma and Genghis smell blood!

I've even tried desperate ploys like staying religion free to avoid zealots getting all nasty with that heathen religion penalty, but you lose that 25% bonus on buildings and that hurts

I've seen people mention the AI advantages, is there a list of what they are, coz it really feels like they are cheating badly on Prince! If I at least know what they are I can amend some plans to take account for it.

And lastly, my gripes.

Spies - I really hate them. Watching turn after turn as my city's water supplies are poisoned is annoying, never mind key mines being destroyed. Yes I've stuck spies in there, built the agencies, bureaus but I think the AI is just sending everyone's spies at me to get this measure of success (or am I paranoid?)

Siege Suicide - This is really really irritating when the AI just sends 20 cats/trebs/cannons at you, as without 5 machine gun defenders you are to put it mildly ****ed even with the best defenders going for the age. I think to be honest this is the most inane part of Civ IV ever.

Civs (often vassals) that just build troops - and troops and troops and troops that the AI uses in some last ditch bludgeon weapon against you. It's so lame and annoyingly effective. I really have no answer when Civs with a couple of vassals (as above) just send stacks and stacks and stacks at you combined with siege suicide.

So anyway, tips please from the civ iv s

 

[Verge]

Welcome to CFC!


Quick help:

1) Post any savegames you'd like to share, it'll allow us to offer better critique.

2) The AI doesn't cheat, at least in the way you think they are. They receive certain bonuses on Prince and above, such as a boost in research rate.

3) Dedicate at least one city to military production, and make it build units constantly. It sounds like you're not maintaining a large enough military.

4) Strive for power parity. You don't have to be the strongest civilization militarily, but you should constantly be upgrading and adding to your army and navy. If you don't, opponents will pounce, and then you'll be mired in a war you haven't prepared for.

5) Siege suicide: learn from your frustration. You've obviously seen the power of suicide siege, so why not turn the tables? Build an army, amass a large amount of siege, and go on a conquering rampage.

6) Build more troops. I said this already, but it doesn't hurt to reiterate, especially since you seem to have trouble with other armies invading you.

7) How many beakers is your best science city producing? If it isn't producing over a 100 by midgame, you might want to reevaluate your commerce strategy.

8) Don't be afraid to drop in difficulty level if it will help you learn the game better.

 

[The Rook]

If your armies are genuinely as strong as you suggest, I can only imagine that they were weak at the time that the AI made a "decision" to attack you, or the AI was unfriendly at the time. Decisions and declarations do not happen at the same time. If the AI considers you weak it might decide to go to war with you, then 30 turns (or more) later it will declare. The problem is that the AI doesn't seem able to undecide to attack you, so if your relations improve, you sign defensive pacts with other AIs, or your military becomes much stronger, it will attack regardless, irrespective of whether they are friendly or the attack is suicidal. Diplomacy can be helpful. One way of assessing whether the AI is planning to go to war with someone (not necessarily you), is to visit their diplomacy screen and move the mouse over one of the names in the "declare war on" section. If the AI says "we have enough on our hands right now" then either they are at war, or a decision to go to war has been made. Another thing that is useful to know is "peace probabilities". No AI will never make a decision to go to war when friendly, many AIs will never make the decision when pleased. So if you are next to someone aggressive like Brennus, you could disband your entire army and he won't lay a finger on you if he is pleased or better... unless he made the decision to attack you before he became pleased.

For peace probabilities consult:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=236346

Edit: Sometimes AI's can be bribed to go to war when friendly with the victim.

 

[madscientist]

Verge has some great hints.

All I will say is that Ghengis/Napolean/Monty will always come after you eventually. Best to take them out ASAP.

As far as diplomacy, how are you doing with that? Run the favorite civics (OK, you can't with those three maniacs), leverage religion (works on Ghengis and Napolean), give them tribute. Close borders are a killer also.

 

[Krazy]

Hi Verge,

OK, I'll stick a game up, I in an effort to try and learn from my errors, playing a game as the Romans, went back to an early era, and built more troops, lots and lots and lots and I managed to get to Industralism and Railroad before anyone else so I could defend cities with Infantry and Machine Guns, but then due to the nature of the tech tree being crosslinked, and the other civs not trading, they all caught up and exceeded me pretty quickly.

Here is the game, in a few turns I gave up.

With regards to siege suicide, it's not that I don't use it, I don't use up 20, I use 1 or 2 only.

Which reminds me of Flank Attack, watching cannons get whittled away to nothing but a suicide attack of Cavalry.

The game started with Cyrus who had horses and I didn't (for a long time) because his Immortals were a pain, after that I took out some of China's cities and kept Genghis happy, but when Russia attacked me and I took some of Catherine's cities, she became a vassal of Sur...eyman and then my troubles started. I'm fairly sure he bribed Genghis to attack me (no proof though)