GR18-AWM Genocide Variant vs 30 Civs.

[Greebley]

I would also start a road toward the two Wheat. It would be nice to place our next town there, but I wouldn't want to do so without a road connection.

Roster:
Greebley
NP - Out until Aug 15th
markh - Up
ThERat - On Deck
vxma -
Mumpulus

 

[Mumpulus]

Here's my view on tech priorities here:

1) We don't have the shields and the commerce right now to benefit from any buildings. Our towns need to grow bigger before we can get to that point. Furthermore, this is AW, so military should come first to make sure we can expand safely. And finally, units can be built faster than buildings. Therefore: research math, wheel and HBR first. My guess is everyone will agree on that, at least for math, probably for the others too.

2) By the time we finish that, we still won't have sufficiently big towns to benefit from buildings. Growth will be hampered a bit by the despotism penalty. I always like to get that out of the way as soon as possible, and I've never had difficulties handling the unit support issue (I definitely agree the issue is there, but I think we can handle it). Therefore: research monarchy after phase 1.

3) We are scientific: a library is 40s, a market 100s. I think it's more efficient to turn up the tax slider for extra gpt, and multiply the remaining bpt by buildings, than the other way around. Therefore: research lit after phase 2.

4) Obviously, we need everything else after that, but probably there will no longer be any urgent techs, so therefore select the cheapest tech at each point.

Just my opinion on the matter. Please correct me if I've overlooked anything. Specifically, I have next to no practical experience with ultra-huge maps; that may influence our choices a bit maybe? I don't know.

 

[markh]

I would go maths next, not the wheel. I think we want cats asap. Horsemen would require two techs, furthermore cats will enhance our kill ratio.

 

[Northern Pike]

My thought on the Spearman and Warrior was actually to move them onto the worker. Then if the Archers chased you, they are stopped by the river and the Warriors could attack them. I probably should have mentioned this.

I didn't fully explain my reasoning here. You're right of course that the spearman and warrior could have moved out of range of the archers towards the worker, but then the archers would have been free either to pillage the vulnerable desert tile or to make a more advantageous attack there (unfortified spearman, no river bonus), depending on whether we occupied the tile. So luring the Ottomans into a dubious attack seemed the best course, although it didn't work.

 

[Greebley]

I didn't fully explain my reasoning here. You're right of course that the spearman and warrior could have moved out of range of the archers towards the worker, but then the archers would have been free either to pillage the vulnerable desert tile or to make a more advantageous attack there (unfortified spearman, no river bonus), depending on whether we occupied the tile. So luring the Ottomans into a dubious attack seemed the best course, although it didn't work.

The archers coming down would have stopped that scenario before they could pillage. The turn they move onto the desert square they stop because it is within our borders (they can't attack the lone spear for the same reason). The 2 archers are one square north of that square and can attack the archers first. At least that was the plan - I just don't think I was clear enough in my post-turn notes.

 

[markh]

looks good, hit enter

IBT : Cuzco completes The Pyramids

Another Ottoman archer appears from the South

1) 730BC : archer kills a Dutch spear clean (1-0)

IBT : a Dutch spear retreats North
a hittite warrior appears from SE

Masonry comes in -> Maths

Chitchen Itza completes The Oracle

2) 710BC : build the colony on the iron, change builds to swords

IBT : a Viking archer suicides on a warrior in the hills at our colony (2-0)
two hittite warriors appear from the N

3) 690BC : an archer loses to an Ottoman archer at Seoul (2-1)

IBT : an Ottoman warrior destroys a mine at Seoul
a hittite archer follows the two warriors in the N

Pyongyang : sword -> worker
Wonsan : settler -> settler

4) 670BC : ewarrior kills hittite rwarrior at Nampo (3-1)

IBT : another hittite archer from the N and a warrior from E
A Viking archer appears W

Seoul : sword -> worker

5) 650BC : archer kills Ottoman archer at Seoul (4-1)
sword kills Ottoman warrior at Seoul (5-1)

IBT : Pyongyang : worker -> sword

6) 630BC : just worker actions

IBT : a hittite warrior and archer approach Pusan
Viking archers come from W, they ignore our colony, so it should be safe for a while

Seoul : worker -> sword
Nampo : sword -> spear

The Dutch build a new town N of Nampo

7) 610BC : sword kills hittite warrior at Pyongyang (6-1)
archer kills hittite warrior at Pusan (7-1)
ewarrior kills hittite archer at Pusan (8-1)

cover that warrior with a spear

IBT : hittite archer suicides on the covering spear and promotes our spear to elite
2 Spanish archers and a spear appear at Pusan, another Spanish archer E at Nampo
a Dutch archer appears at Nampo

8) 590BC : moving troops

IBT : hittite warriors appear from S and E
the two Spanish archers and the spear close in on Pusan

9) 570BC : sword kills the Spansih spear clean (9-1)
sword loses to Spanish archer (9-2)
ewarrior loses to the second archer (9-3)
archer kills one of the archers (10-3)
ewarrior kills the second archer (11-3)

cover the ewarrior with our elite spear, a reg archer can attack there

IBT : it's getting crowded. Dutch archers appear at Wonsan

Pyongyang : sword -> sword
Wonsan : settler -> walls
hittites send warriors from the S and a new archer at Pusan

10) 550BC : the fresh sword from Pyongyang kills a hittite warrior at Wonsan (12-3)
archers kill 2 Ottoman archers at Seoul (14-3)

There is a constant flow of Viking archers from the SW via our iron road. The first one will reach the hills at Seoul next IBT. Archers of different nationalities are arriving in our N and E, so it could get tricky now.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/47099/GR18_BC550.SAV

 

[Greebley]

We have two settlers now? I would like to see a coastal town West of the capitol on the river. It won't be hard to defend.

I do like the choice of Maths for our next tech. Cats are key.

Roster:
Greebley
NP - Out until Aug 15th
markh - Just Played
ThERat - Up
vxma - On Deck
Mumpulus

 

[Tribute]

Since you have 2 settlers, why not put one next to or on the spearman in the hills. It's on a hill, protects your capital, and has access to a river and flood plains too.

 

[markh]

We have two settlers now?

Originally one should have gone to the spot at the wheats NE of Nampo. The road was just completed when Willy settled Holwerd. The other one was planned for a coastal city, but now there are too many foreign troops.

 

[ThERat]

got it

I think no matter what, I will settle at spots avalaible. We MUST expand else, we will be overwhelmed sooner or later.

A spot at the coast and the hills looks good. It seems less busy there. Once we get an army, we can raze those Dutch cities and expand in that direction again.

 

[vmxa]

This biggest problem we have is that we have so many civs so close to to start the game. Until we can get an army and some cats, we will be in danger of attrition.

 

[ThERat]

save

Pre-Turn
shift a warrior into Nampo to get it back from unhappiness

1.530BC
we do have very few units, cut down an archer at Wonsan, where there are quite a few
lose archer to beat 2hp warrior, defeat it with our e-warrior

IT lose spear to archer in Wonsan, if this continues, we can forget this game

2.510BC
redline sword, but defeat archer at Seoul and then get this...will the tide turn?

cut down another archer and warrior

IT our new 2 sword army in Wonsan almost gets beaten by an archer, but wins
we defeat another archer on defense at Pusan, this is really really tight

3.490BC
found Cheju in the south and Hyangsan in the north

IT defeat 2 archers, but lose 1 spear on defense

4. 470BC
continue to try and clear units with the little stuff we have
Cheju faces 4 Ottoman units now
defeat 2 archers near Seoul

IT defeat 2 archers on defense at Cheju, but 2 units move onto the road on the hill
Wonsan gets a wall and goes for another settler

5.450BC
lose a warrior but defeat 1/2 units and leave a wounded warrior, the road won't get pillaged

IT Vikings lose 2 archers at Seoul...but the enemy now invades our land

6.430BC
lux needs to go up to 20% as our cities grew
to pop 5
defeat 2 archers, but need to expose an archer ourselves

IT good interturn, as th enemy loses 4 archers for the exchange of 1 warrior

7.410BC
defeat redline archer, shuffle units, army stays in the south for now to make sure roads won't get pillaged

IT the 3hp archer is attacked by a spear and loses
Hattusas finishes the Great Library

8.390BC
MM Pyongyang to 10spt

IT lose spear at Nampo

9.370BC
zzz

IT nth much

10.350BC
we get another settler in Wonsan, send him south to the coast west of Seoul
beat an archer with e-sword

remember that we have the army in the south to ensure our iron supply

maths is due in 6

 

[Greebley]

Sounds like a harrowing turn. Well played We have and Army and soon will get Cats, so things are looking up.

I would try to get a settler or worker out of Pyongyang and Nampo before they hit max food (dependent on the need for more swords of course). The capital can just grow past size 6 I think for faster sword production.

I think we definitely need more workers, it looks like our towns are using unimproved squares.

Another town on the river would also be able to eventually get above size 7 so it would be nice to build when we have the chance. We will want size 7 towns whenever we get to Monarchy.

Are we thinking of going for the wheel next to see where the Horses are?

Roster:
Greebley
NP - Out until Aug 15th
markh
ThERat - Just Played
vxma - Up
Mumpulus - On Deck

 

[ThERat]

the initial part of my set was scary...really. Lucky we have an army and it was fortunate that the enemy suicided a lot of troops.

Pyongyang is making 10spt, which is good. We should keep it that way for a while. Wonsan and Hyangsan are the fast growing cities and should build more settlers and workers. We have soon 8 towns and only 7 workers.

I would try and expand south a little to get the iron into our borders and connect the gems eventually.

As for techs, we should go after the cheaper techs first since we have quite a few to cover before hitting the MA. The wheel sounds good next

 

[Mumpulus]

For techs, I think we better add some intermediate goals before taking the global "get all AA techs, cheapest first" approach. I still advocate my earlier proposal. Our research capacity will start to pick up (if it hasn't already, math went from 23t to 6t over Rat's 10 turns (7 turns saved)). By the time we research monarchy in my research order, we should be more or less ready to switch.

For expansion, I'm not sure expanding south right now is viable. I can't open the save to check, but won't that divide the front there? I imagine the Vikings and Ottos converge on Cheju now, while the Vikings will rather target the new town if we found one more to the SW.

 

[vmxa]

I got it, probably do it in the morning as I want to watch the Tour tonight. Will get it posted tomorrow afternoon if I can.

 

[vmxa]

Here is the save:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/uploads/42522/GR18_BC0150.SAV

 

[vmxa]

150BC look:

 

[vmxa]

Sorry I did not get to this sooner.

Pre:
archer kills archer at Pusan (1-0).

IBT:
The archer was attacked a 1HP archer and goes elite (1-0).
[2-0]

330BC:
Nampo finished sword and starts a worker. Will grow before settler or sword could be done.
1st kills Ottoman warrior (1-0).
I move the settler to Seoul with the idea of getting it on the hill next to a gem mountain.
This will be on the same side of the river as the colony. It will not cover the road, so no one will pillage the road.

It lets us start to get some land to eventually get the iron in the border and cut off the road to the core. It will however take a lot of worker turns to get roads to the cap and the gems.

We could road the plains to the gems and that would put the next site in the net. I reluctantly have the worker at Wosan mine the BG. I am a bit worried about it being so close to converging units.
E-sword kills archer (2-0).
[4-0]

IBT:
nada

310BC:
E-sword kills another archer (1-0).
Sword kill archer both at Wosan (2-0).
Sword at Nampo kills archer (3-0).
1st kills Vike archer (4-0).
[8-0]

 

[vmxa]

IBT:
Dutch archer kill a sword (0-1)
[8-1]

290BC:
Have to dial down research as we have 8 gold and -4gpt.
Turns out the turns does not change, still 3.
eSword kill that archer (1-0).
eArcher kill vike archer on the mountain (2-0).
1st kills one as well (3-0).
Have to use a specialist in Wosan for 1 turn, till sword gets back.
[11-1]

IBT:
zero

270BC:
Put specialist back to work. Reduce research to 40%, Math next turn.

IBT:
zip

250BC:
nothing.
[11-1]

IBT:
1st kills V-archer (1-0).
Action starts to look scary. We have 5 Dutch units at Wosan.
We have 2 Hittite swords at Nampo and 2 Spanish archers behind them.
3 Ottoman swords near Cheju and a Vike warrior.
2 Vike archers passing by the Iron.