Grigori : Brainstorm Thread

[Deon]

I don't really agree about godslayer since it's supposed to be a simple sword, maybe a good sword, but not an artifact of a huge power.


Also could you rename the Dragon Horde to Dragon Hoard please? I am tired of this typo...

 

[Rystic]

Another solution: just make the Luonnotar buildable. The reason they weren't originally was because they could just build the Altar. Now, it doesn't make much sense that you need a 6th level unit.

 

[WarKirby]

I don't really agree about godslayer since it's supposed to be a simple sword, maybe a good sword, but not an artifact of a huge power.

Maybe supposed to be, but it isn't. it really, really isn't.

it gives +3 strength and immunity to magic, on top of the god slaying part. It's probably the most powerful piece of equipment in the game, even against non-avatars.

This is one of those cases where gameplay completely ignores the lore. Another, incidentally, is Brigit the Shining being immortal. I poked Kael into admitting that she shouldn't be.


Regardless of how powerful it is, though, It's still a legendary artifact created by the gods, and deserves to be in a museum at least as much as any other.

 

[cyther]

I can only see the final part of Indiana Jones where the Arc of the Covenant is put into some huge government warehouse where I think about the Godslayer being in a museum.

 

[Arctic Circle]

I'm my TweakMod, I gave the Grigori the Diverse trait, that makes units born in their empire have a random race. It also replaces UU's (so you won't get an Orc Hunter, you'll get a Lizardman). It's actually a pretty fun mechanic. I also gave them a Museum (+10% culture, +1 from Marble, +1 Adventurer), and made Dragonslayers able to upgrade to Luonnatar.

This is so sweet. Can I get a link to this mod?

 

[WarKirby]

The Diverse trait does sound like a neat idea. I'd love that.

Orcish adventurers!

 

[Rystic]

This is so sweet. Can I get a link to this mod?

The link is in my signature

 

[Deon]

I can only see the final part of Indiana Jones where the Arc of the Covenant is put into some huge government warehouse where I think about the Godslayer being in a museum.

Put http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=12151 into a warehouse and you're done .

 

[civ_king]

Put http://forums.civfanatics.com/downloads.php?do=file&id=12151 into a warehouse and you're done .

smooth....

 

[Iceciro]

The trait in Rystic's mod gets my vote. Something the player can use, the AI can use, and reflects the grigori ideal of diversity.

Make sure it affects the adventurers too and you've got my vote. Grigori Dwarf Adventurer, /sold. I would play a Grigori civ with this trait and FF+'s changes.

 

[WarKirby]

I kind of think the Bannor should have that Diverse trait, too.


Doesn't have to be limited to one civ. Besides, I'm really not a fan of "traits" which are applied to one, and only one leader. Why make such things a trait at all?

 

[Rystic]

The trait in Rystic's mod gets my vote. Something the player can use, the AI can use, and reflects the grigori ideal of diversity.

Make sure it affects the adventurers too and you've got my vote. Grigori Dwarf Adventurer, /sold. I would play a Grigori civ with this trait and FF+'s changes.

ATM, the Diverse trait only affects units built in cities, not Great People. But I plan to fix that in the next update.

I kind of think the Bannor should have that Diverse trait, too.


Doesn't have to be limited to one civ. Besides, I'm really not a fan of "traits" which are applied to one, and only one leader. Why make such things a trait at all?

I'm not as big a fan of this. Originally, I was going to give Diverse to the Kuriotates as well, but I decided against it. I feel that Diverse is to the Grigori the same way Tolerant is to the Elohim (or Conqueror is to Decius in FF). Diverse is also meant to represent the prosecuted people from other nations flocking to the Grigori; I got the idea from reading Cassiel's entry. Considering the Fall of Cautine scenario, the Bannor is probably where they'd be running away from.

In the TweakMod, my solution for the Bannor was to fix their mechanic. Demagogs now check the city working their tile for metal, and get that grade of weapon (so you don't have to run huge stacks into cities). Also, the Bannor can build a UB called Cathedral, which has a chance to give Demagogs the State Religion. Great if you summoned Basium/Hyborem and want to buff them.

 

[Iceciro]

Yeah. Maybe set it up as a civtrait, if you don't like the idea of giving a trait to a leader that only one civ uses, but still... I don't think it's a fit at all for the Banor. Orc Bannor? nahhhh.

 

[WarKirby]

By far the most numerous of the estate-holders, the non-hereditary Orders will take fighters from all across the world, all nations and races. Those deemed worthy in prowess and intelligence are taught in the ways and language of the Bannor and then join the fighting forces on the same footing as native Bannor.

I'm afraid I have to disagree. I think it suits them perfectly

 

[Lone Wolf]

Bannor aren't exactly known for their tolerance...

 

[Rystic]

I'm afraid I have to disagree. I think it suits them perfectly

That may be, but the odds that the Bannor armies would enlist an entire legion of orcs or elves is unlikely. For the Grigori, there's an ample amount of other races for it to be more realistic.

 

[carnun]

Has anyone considered giving agnosticism the mechanics of a religion, allowing Grigori to achieve a 'religious' victory? That's what Cassiel wants to do is it not? Just to throw a few ideas about:

Agnosticism:

- No immediate benefits.
- Spreads more slowly than other religions.
- Chance of Agnosticism spreading to a city decreases with each religion in the city. You'd therefore need to use Luonnotor (buildable?) to clear cities of religions.

- Cities with Agnosticism can't build religious buildings or units.
- Religious units/civs can purge Agnosticism with some sort of spell/ritual.

- Some civilizations are more adverse to Agnosticism for example, very unlikely to spread in Bannor cities but more likely in an Amurite city.
- Big hit to relationship with religious civilizations.
- Diplomatic relations effect chance of religion spreading. (Is this possible?).

So... 70% of cities are Agnostic... Cassiel sticks two fingers to the sky and everybody rejoices.

One problem I can think of - if you start a game with Grigori and a civ that's already Agnostic... you win automatically. Optional victory condition a possible solution?

Might be a bit whacky and probably a fair amount of work to get it right but I thought I'd throw it out there.

 

[Rystic]

Has anyone considered giving agnosticism the mechanics of a religion, allowing Grigori to achieve a 'religious' victory? That's what Cassiel wants to do is it not? Just to throw a few ideas about:

Agnosticism:

- No immediate benefits.
- Spreads more slowly than other religions.
- Chance of Agnosticism spreading to a city decreases with each religion in the city. You'd therefore need to use Luonnotor (buildable?) to clear cities of religions.

- Cities with Agnosticism can't build religious buildings or units.
- Religious units/civs can purge Agnosticism with some sort of spell/ritual.

- Some civilizations are more adverse to Agnosticism for example, very unlikely to spread in Bannor cities but more likely in an Amurite city.
- Big hit to relationship with religious civilizations.
- Diplomatic relations effect chance of religion spreading. (Is this possible?).

So... 70% of cities are Agnostic... Cassiel sticks two fingers to the sky and everybody rejoices.

One problem I can think of - if you start a game with Grigori and a civ that's already Agnostic... you win automatically. Optional victory condition a possible solution?

Might be a bit whacky and probably a fair amount of work to get it right but I thought I'd throw it out there.

We've actually tossed that idea around before, but it's actually quite uncharacteristic of the Grigori. Cassiel doesn't hate religion, he hates dogmas. He even lets religion exist in his cities so long as it doesn't harm the people. Making Agnosticism into a passive religion is exactly the kind of thing he stands against.

I do support having a random event where religion peters out on its own. Religions disappearing from Grigori cities would probably be from lack of interest.

 

[carnun]

We've actually tossed that idea around before, but it's actually quite uncharacteristic of the Grigori. Cassiel doesn't hate religion, he hates dogmas. He even lets religion exist in his cities so long as it doesn't harm the people. Making Agnosticism into a passive religion is exactly the kind of thing he stands against.

I do support having a random event where religion peters out on its own. Religions disappearing from Grigori cities would probably be from lack of interest.

I don't see it as being dogmatic: You wouldn't be spreading it actively, there's no temples, no priests... no religous law.

 

[Rystic]

I don't see it as being dogmatic: You wouldn't be spreading it actively, there's no temples, no priests... no religous law.

Here's the link to the original topic discussing this idea (another Grigori brainstorming thread). It was the whole eighth "phantom religion" thing. It very well could be possible, but I don't think the Grigori should be eligible for a religious victory.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=307183